HOI4 Dev Diary - Stability and War Support

HOI4 Dev Diary - Stability and War Support

  • Pre order now!

    Paradox Development Studio brings you the sequel to one of the most popular strategy games ever made! Crusader Kings III is soon upon us and you can pre order it today!


    Releasing September 1st 2020

podcat

Oberkommando HOI4
Super Moderator
12 Badges
Jul 23, 2007
12.589
30.130
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Semper Fi
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Hearts of Iron II: Beta
  • Europa Universalis: Rome Collectors Edition
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Paradox Order
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
Hello everyone! Today we are going to be talking about National Unity, or rather the fact that it no longer exists…

National Unity
National Unity first made its appearance in Hearts of Iron III, basically as a mechanic to make France surrender at an appropriate time (when Paris fell essentially). It was largely moved over to HOI4 unchanged. While it does accomplish what we wanted it's also a very restrictive currency to work with design wise. A player who is winning doesn't really care what their NU is, making a lot of focus choices meaningless in those instances (or almost, there is always that time your country gets blanketed in nukes and someone dropping paras on one of your big cities seals the deal in multiplayer). We wanted to model different nations better and make sure we could do more interesting focuses and events where picking a loss of NU wasn't always the better choice compared to giving up, say, political power. So what's the answer?

Stability and War Support
These are two new values shown in the topbar that replace National Unity. Stability models the people's unity and support for the current government. War Support on the other hand represent the people’s support of war and of fully committing to fighting that war. As an example Britain in 1936 would be a pretty stable nation, but with very low war support. A nation like France would be much more unstable and with equally low war support, while Japan would have high war support and also high stability (mostly due to the emperor’s influence).

Stability average is 50% and nations with higher stability than that gain bonuses to industry, political power and consumer goods. Once you drop below 50% there are penalties instead as well as lowering your surrender limit (although nothing as extreme as how NU affected things). Strong party support helps increase stability, but being in a war - no matter how well supported - is going to lower your stability. Stability also works to protect against coups against your nation as well.

War Support has several passive effects and also limits several of the laws. You can’t switch to full War Economy without enough war support for example.

Note that in the picture below France is getting +30% war support because they have been attacked by Germany. An offensive war on the other hand for Germany actually hurts their war support. This comes with some interesting balancing effects:
  • Democracies challenging Germany early over Rhineland etc would put themselves as attackers, forcing them to fight hindered by the war support penalty.
  • Fascist or aggressive nations will generally have more initial war support but are likely to be surpassed by democracies in a defensive war when it comes to war support.
  • Defensive nations will be able to ramp up army sizes faster due to mobilization speed while attackers need to play a bit more carefully. The return of “national pride” from HOI3 in the form of combat bonuses on core territory will help here too.
Speaking of mobilization speed, you no longer get a chunk of manpower instantly when enacting conscription laws or other changes to recruitable manpower. Instead how quickly the manpower is made available by the law change is controlled by your mobilization speed. The higher the war support the faster new manpower trickles in.
pasted image 3.png

The air war also affects things as successful enemy bombing (or nuking) will lower War Support. Shooting down enemy bombers will offset this somewhat, as people are seeing you fight back against the enemy.

Here is an example on what can happen in a nation with low war support and low stability in a war. The severity of these particular options depends on exactly how low your stability/war support are. Here it's pretty bad.
pasted image 2.png

For Germany a good way of raising war support is to pull off its diplomatic expansions without being opposed:
pasted image 1.png

War support is also affected by how your allies manage. If a major ally surrenders it will lower your war support, so make sure to keep your friends in the war. On the flip side successfully capitulating major enemies increases your war support.

There are also some new ways to affect War Support and Stability outside events, ministers and national focuses that we aren't ready to show off yet ;)

See you again next week!
 
Last edited:

Chanbara

Sergeant
38 Badges
Oct 22, 2011
76
9
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sengoku
  • Semper Fi
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Divine Wind
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Age of Wonders II
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • BATTLETECH: Heavy Metal
  • BATTLETECH: Flashpoint
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • BATTLETECH: Season pass
  • Surviving Mars
  • BATTLETECH
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Stellaris
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Cities: Skylines
Definitely seems like positive changes overall, but I'm slightly worried that the gradual manpower gain aspect could make the AI's manpower hit zero even faster than it does now
 

Ironside121

World Conquest Title Holder
On Probation
52 Badges
Mar 2, 2015
3.298
1.273
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Magicka
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Impire
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Steel Division: Normandy 44
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Cities: Skylines
  • War of the Roses
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
Now this I like.

Will mobilization also effect your mobilization laws? Since changing those is also instant- and really shouldn't be?

Feel free to mention what AI changes are coming in the next patch too ;)
 

Zwirbaum

(Formerly known as Zwireq)
98 Badges
Jun 2, 2011
4.403
2.177
32
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Magicka
  • Sengoku
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Teleglitch: Die More Edition
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • 500k Club
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Pride of Nations
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • BATTLETECH
  • Surviving Mars
  • Steel Division: Normand 44 Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Steel Division: Normandy 44
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • PDXCON 2018 "The Emperor"
  • BATTLETECH - Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife Pre-Order
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Shadowrun Returns
Any words what will be in next dev diary @podcat ? ;)
 

Lord of Beer

Major
10 Badges
Jan 18, 2017
518
1
  • Magicka
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • Rome Gold
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
Great DD. Could you also please set a minimum division width for AI nations to 10 to stop them spamming everywhere and lagging the game down? Maybe even simplify the capabilities of micronations (Tibet, El Salvador etc.) to save CPU AI cycles on modelling them?
 

JerkyJerry

There was never a good war or a bad peace.
23 Badges
Jan 15, 2013
2.163
1.262
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Semper Fi
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Cities: Skylines Industries
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife Pre-Order
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • 500k Club
  • Cities: Skylines
I've wanted NU gone since day one, its removal is good
My opinion of its replacement is ....... meh. That may change over time however this does not as of yet excite/interest me in the least.
 

adam_grif

Lt. General
76 Badges
Sep 16, 2011
1.648
2.221
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Prison Architect
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Surviving Mars
  • Steel Division: Normandy 44
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Victoria 2
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
The way to impact war support and stability he alludes to in this diary will be the Decision mechanics that were mentioned in the list of things that Podcat would like to implement a few weeks back, I'll bet. The half way point between National Focuses and Events, as he described it.
 

PsychoLold

Victoria III enthusiast
37 Badges
Jan 7, 2013
240
217
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Semper Fi
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Victoria 2
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
So many questions...
  • Will there be continuous national focuses that increase war support and stability?
  • What happens if the war support or stability drops to 0? Will the affected country surrender instantly?
  • Does war support influence unrest? I imagine that low war support could even raise resistance in your core provinces.
  • What's the topic of the next DD?

The new phone icon, huh? Intelligence, maybe?
It looks exactly like the famous red telephone:
 

Archangel85

Oberbefehlshaber, Content Design, HoI4
56 Badges
Jan 27, 2005
2.117
1.029
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • March of the Eagles
  • Naval War: Arctic Circle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Semper Fi
  • Sengoku
  • Sword of the Stars II
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • 500k Club
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Magicka
  • Magicka: Wizard Wars Founder Wizard
  • Pride of Nations
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Prison Architect
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Cities in Motion
  • Cities in Motion 2
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
For modders, how will this affect the add NU options? Or will the NU bonuses will just be converted to Stability by default?
NU has been completely eliminated. You'll have to go through the script and change NU effects/triggers to stability and/or war support. Use add_stability add_war_support has_stability has_war_support