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HOI4 Dev Diary - Armored Cars - The new horsey boys!

Hi everyone and welcome to another dev diary. The team is working hard towards PdxCon that is coming up next week and we are looking forward to pretzels, beer, and of course meeting you guys!

Today we will be talking about Armored Cars! I have often been asked why HOI4 doesn't have them, and today you get to find out why now is the time time :)

Resistance Suppression
Part of the reason we are finally adding armored cars is that they go hand in hand with resistance suppression. Since its inception, the armored car has been a useful tool against lightly armed and armored opponents. As explained previously, Garrisons will work as a shield against resistance activity. If adequate, the garrison will absorb the vast amount of resistance attacks that would otherwise sabotage industry or resource extraction. Armored vehicles will be especially suited to this role as hardness will give damage reduction to attacks made by the resistance.

In addition to being more resilient and preserving manpower, armored cars will come with a higher suppression stat and a better ratio of suppression to deployed manpower. Armored cars will generally not be as protective as light tanks, but will have a great amount of manpower protection for their cost.

All of these things combine to make armored cars a good option for resistance suppression when manpower is more of a concern than some extra production cost. Horses will still have an edge when it comes to suppression vs production cost, however.
  • Hardness to prevent losses
  • High suppression value
  • Cheap production cost compared to other armored vehicles
  • Higher cost still than just horseboys

Main battalion Combat Role

Fighting on the frontlines as the main battle force is not a typical role for an armored car. In HoI4 it will be no different. In most situations, the armored car will be outclassed or simply not appropriate for the terrain. However, in a few cases, armored cars should work fairly well as main battle units.

In WW2 armored cars saw a good deal of combat in the deserts of Northern Africa and the Middle East. Their decreased supply needs, ability to move quickly in desert environments, and excellent capability in fighting poorly equipped enemies made them perform rather well in those theaters.

In HoI4, armored cars will work similarly. They will provide increased protection and breakthrough over say motorized or infantry while coming cheaper than light tanks. They will also be the fastest land unit in the game in the right terrain. These factors should make them dangerous opponents in secondary and tertiary theaters of combat.

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Combat and Intel
We have split the recon support company into several now so that it can be tailored to the division type you have, and the speed it needs to move at because now the speed on the recon company will be limiting the whole division. Meaning that if you scout your trucks with cavalry they will need to move at cavalry speed.
We have:
  • Cavalry Recon Detachment - regular horsey boys you are used to. Cheap, but not that fast.
  • Motorized Recon Company - Motorized, so jeeps and light vehicles. Fast but weak
  • Light Armored Recon Company - Armored cars
  • Armored Recon Company - Light tanks
Armored cars is a good sweet spot of capability, speed and armor while light tanks help keep your hardness and armor up in tougher divisions.

Recon companies give you an edge when picking tactics in combat, and that remains the same. We have on the other hand been rebalancing tactics to make recon more worthwhile. Tactics are now rerolled twice as often and we have lowered the frequency of certain phases like close combat quite a bit (unless fighting in urban terrain).

Recon companies now also do one more thing, they let you generate more intel in combat. More intel you say? What is this? As part of this update we will be redoing how intel works, but we will be going into that in detail in the future. For now all I can say is that there will be several ways to acquire intel (where fighting is one) and that relative intel will be replacing the straight up combat bonus from having crypto techs.

Armored cars looks really cool, so here are some renders for the new models for you to enjoy:
renders_small.jpg


Ingame tech wise armored cars depend on motorized, so to use the recon companies you need both that and to have unlocked the recon support companies.

image (31).png


Armored cars will be coming with the DLC while basic intel changes and the other recon companies are available for all with the ‘Husky’ update. Next week is PdxCon and we are also moving offices, so I’ve set my alarm clock on “Maximum chaos!” but I think we should be able to give you a bit of an update diary anyways :) Seeya then!
 
Recon companies give you an edge when picking tactics in combat, and that remains the same. We have on the other hand been rebalancing tactics to make recon more worthwhile. Tactics are now rerolled twice as often and we have lowered the frequency of certain phases like close combat quite a bit (unless fighting in urban terrain).
Is there a way to make these effects more transparent to the player?
The way it is now, one would "assume" that it is doing its job, but testing has proven it to be inconclusive at best, and with no effect at worse.
This has been speculated to be a bug (if it is, is it getting addressed?), or perhaps simply a matter of perception, as the player has no clear way to tell how his tactics are being weighed in combat, so a way to improve the mechanic could be to give the player more feedback in how exactly recon is helping him in combat.

Recon companies now also do one more thing, they let you generate more intel in combat. More intel you say? What is this? As part of this update we will be redoing how intel works, but we will be going into that in detail in the future. For now all I can say is that there will be several ways to acquire intel (where fighting is one) and that relative intel will be replacing the straight up combat bonus from having crypto techs.
Can't wait to hear more about this, the way it is now I only put recon on my tank divisions for the speed boost, but put together with the point above, I hope this will make me reevaluate, as recon and engineers should be the most important support units in a division.
 
Will the different recon units be equally "good" at recon or will they differ?
The recon level will most likely stay the same. You pick between them for their other attributes.

VEHICLE OF GLORIOUS DESIGN Panserbil m/39
Good good. Archangel85 is making up for betraying me by having anti-swedish named ai strategies scripted ;)
 
Can you stack multiple recon companies if you don't care about speed penalties and just want a few extra stats (say superior firepower's soft attack/org bonus for support companies)?
 
We havent really done much testing on this yet, but I think already with frequency alterations it will be useful enough to make recon worth it. If not we'll tweak it more. Of course they do have the other impacts as well
It was suggested that the problem was in abdurance of tactics. You had 10 tactics 2
We havent really done much testing on this yet, but I think already with frequency alterations it will be useful enough to make recon worth it. If not we'll tweak it more. Of course they do have the other impacts as well


No, the others are not affected. from a modding eprspective its possible to set this up now (and to make main line battalions that do not limit speed also if you want)
One of tests, others on reddit
I've decided to make extreme testing mod, because so far from my testing earlier on tactics (where I fixed the issue with eternal CC/TW tactics and so on) I did have some predictions which I wanted to confirm - and they basically confirmed my suspicions. Results and what I did below :)

Mod where I made following changes:

Almost all tactics were axed and now we had following situation:

Attacking side have 2 tactics to select, both with same weight: 4.

Basic Attack
Supreme Attack

Defending side have 1 tactic selection
Basic Defend

Basic defend counter Basic Attack but is countered by Supreme Attack.

I then made that Recon Company have 100000 (one hundred thousand recon value) Recon.

I've put on the opposing side Polish and German army.

German army have infantry divisions with recon, Polish did not.
Both sides are lead by Field Marshals of Skill 3 (Rundstedt vs Sikorski)

13 engagements across the line - and in the first day we got following results:
8 where there was Supreme Attack tactic elected (countering Sikorski Basic Defend)
5 where there was Basic Attack tactic elected (countered by Sikorski Basic Defend).

Second day of combat:
6 Supreme Attacks
7 Basic Attack

Third day of combat:
9 Supreme Attack
4 Basic Attack

Fourth day of combat:
10 Supreme Attack
3 Basic Attack

Fifth
9/4

So for the pretty big Recon Advantage (100000) there seems to be little effect on the actual tactic selection - IMO recon value doesn't matter, it just gives you reroll of the tactic, and there is nothing that indicates increasing the weight of the correct countering tactic applied by the recon advantage and so on.

So whether you have more recon than your enemy, or you have (IIRC 5 more skill levels as leader) you will get the same 'initiative' perk. If enemy will be using Recon I, Recon II is all you need, or Recon I + some SF/GBP recon value boost etc.
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* The more days I did run - it seemed to gravitate towards ~8/5 9/4 10/3 split, so about ~75%

Which means that it probably means that when tactic that was elected didn't counter, it will be re-rolled (50% chance to roll into countering one) and as such chance to counter will be ~75%
 
Finally! That's so cool!

I hope Spain gets some event or focus something related to this. The Republic started improvising armored cars since the beginning and eventually produced some very decent models, which were admittedly Soviet clones wish Spanish engines. Production was much reduced when the Fascists reached the MEditerranean and they cut off the auto plant at Barcelona from the armour foundry in Valencia.
 
That means that the Crypto-Tech will change too. Hmm.. I think they will bring in Espionage too in this DLC.

Armored Cars in the Recon Research are a big improvement, as well as light Tanks for medium Tank-Devisions etc. That will give the Game more flexibility.

I know exactly how to use them in the next Version:

- Armored Cars for Recon in motorisied Devisions / light Devisions
- Motorised for Standard-Secure-Duty
- Cavalary for Recon in normal Infantry-Devision / Coast-Guard-Devisions
- Light Tanks for Recon in medium Tank-Devisions / heavy Tank-Devisions
 
I know exactly how to use them in the next Version:

- Armored Cars for Recon in motorisied Devisions / light Devisions
- Motorised for Standard-Secure-Duty
- Cavalary for Recon in normal Infantry-Devision / Coast-Guard-Devisions
- Light Tanks for Recon in medium Tank-Devisions / heavy Tank-Devisions

You should take the armored car for Secure-Duty to get some hardness in the division
 
Today we will be talking about Armored Cars! I have often been asked why HOI4 doesn't have them, and today you get to find out why now is the time time :)

Let me tell you about a mod called Black Ice. Those dudes put in armored cars before it was cool. Why did they do that? Because they're kinda dedicated to grand strategy and historical accuracy. Zero hours wasted/spent on making "what if Japan went communist in 1937" anime foci trees gives more hours to make World War II content.
 
Really good stuffs the armored car is. Btw, in next update, it looks like there are needs on Bicycle/Bike Recon units.
 
Whilst this is a great addition, is there any thought going into the increased amount of things in the research tree? As more and more features are added are the times for each research changing? Because as it is there are already some which seem somewhat redundant and a waste of time. For example the motorised rocket artillery tech seems a bit redundant now that we have motorised towed artillery to use instead
 
just shut up and enjoy the content
Let me tell you about a mod called Black Ice. Those dudes put in armored cars before it was cool. Why did they do that? Because they're kinda dedicated to grand strategy and historical accuracy. Zero hours wasted/spent on making "what if Japan went communist in 1937" anime foci trees gives more hours to make World War II content.
 
Finally I can have a use for all these Panzer IIs I've got laying around! I'm glad a good proper use outside of just throwing them into garrisons will exist now, it always kinda bothered me how I'd have a couple hundred light tanks laying around a really nothing to use them on that wouldn't be just a straight down grade.
 
Finally I can have a use for all these Panzer IIs I've got laying around! I'm glad a good proper use outside of just throwing them into garrisons will exist now, it always kinda bothered me how I'd have a couple hundred light tanks laying around a really nothing to use them on that wouldn't be just a straight down grade.

Convert them to SPAA