Hoi2 player

[unmerged(45932)]

I played Hoi 1 for a few months when it was originally released, however I was new to strategy games at that time and never really got into it. In the past couple years I have played hoi2 and mods for that game a lot, and really love what that game was able to simulate. I recently reinstalled hoi and applied the latest patch in addition to the core mod. I am enjoying the tech tree and how you can decide which caliber guns to apply to certain units or make decisions that have real impact on how your nation develops. In hoi2 all nations produce units with the exact same stats which seems very non realistic to me. Having played hoi2 so long I have forgotten a lot of the aspects of the original hearts of iron game.

For instance, I enjoy playing as Japan and attempting to launch offensives against the American powerhouse. It appears as though the naval command structure is completely different than it is in hoi1. How can you effectively organize and build up a fleet when grand admirals are only able to command 12 naval units? Do you not need to include an even ratio of screen ing vessels (cl/dd) in your fleets as it is in hoi2?

I don't mind the added micro management that is needed with trade and convoys compared to hoi2. The more I have to control the better in my opinion. I am just curious if there are any other major things I should be made aware of that could have a significant impact on my war efforts. For instance, in hoi2, when you select naval units and then right click on a sea zone you are presented with a list of orders which those naval units are capable of preforming.

Playing as Japan as soon as the war against china begins I get a message saying that one of my convoys was attacked, so I know this mission type (convoy raiding) is available. Yet when I select my naval units and attempt to assign a mission to them (convoy raiding or naval patrol/interdiction) I am unable to do so. I apologize if this is covered in the manual or a tutorial already, but coming from hoi2 it is all very confusing to relearn or adapt to and I would greatly appreciate any help or tips that can be made.

For example, what is the best way to organize fleets? Do I need to separate CV and BB fleets like in hoi2? In the second game CV are given a far greater firing distance than BB, so if you group them in the same fleet only the CV will participate in the battle making it useless to have BBs in the same fleet as carriers. When I select naval units in hoi1 I do not see a "maximum firing range" even listed. Is this not a factor in the original game or is it just not visible in the interface? If you dont need to keep a proper ratio of screening vessels in your fleets is there any real reason to create destroyers or light cruisers?

Another odd thing I noticed while playing the original hearts of iron game again was the "softness" statistic missing from land units. When I select a tank/motorized/mechanized unit the only statistic that seems to separate them from normal infantry units is their movement speed. In hoi2 these units are given a reduced softness static that causes them to take damage at a vastly reduced rate. Is this statistic just not visible from in game or is it completely ignored?

Again I apologize if some of these questions have been asked before. I am attempting to get back into the original game with the reasoning that more time/thought has been put into patches and mods for the original game if only for the fact that it has been out longer. I already have found many aspects of the game to be far more accurate and enjoyable than the sequel, but am still confused on a few gameplay issues. I would greatly appreciate any tips or information on the differences between this game opposed to its sequel, as well as answers to the questions raised above. Thanks again for any help offered.

 

[JoeGiavani]

In relation to convoys, they're managed in the industry screen, click on the "manage convoys" button, below or above (can't remember, sorry) the Trade on world market button. You can assign convoys and escorts from there.
In regards to hard and soft targets...armour and mechanized infantry are hard targets, so hard attack is used against them. Everything else, infantry, motorized infantry, cavalry etc. are soft attack, so soft attack values are used against them.
Hope I've helped : ]

 

[Dr Rare]

Naval Mod Guide.pdf

Hello
For vanilla Naval stuff check the FAQ....
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?t=182709
Paradox Interactive Forums - Pro_Consul's Naval Primer

Make sure you have the last CORE v.90 and v.91 installed .

If you are playing the CORE mod go to your mod-CORE folder inside your main Hearts of Iron folder and inside the CORE folder there is a folder called documentation in that there is a PDF document called Naval Mod Guide with loads of stats and info to read which might be what your looking for !! Lots of people never notice it,i didnt for a long time

or search in your system
Hearts of Iron/mod-CORE/documentation/Naval Mod Guide.pdf

hope this helps,
happy gaming hoi2 refugee

Dr Rare

 

[unmerged(12303)]

I played Hoi 1 for a few months when it was originally released, however I was new to strategy games at that time and never really got into it. In the past couple years I have played hoi2 and mods for that game a lot, and really love what that game was able to simulate. I recently reinstalled hoi and applied the latest patch in addition to the core mod. I am enjoying the tech tree and how you can decide which caliber guns to apply to certain units or make decisions that have real impact on how your nation develops. In hoi2 all nations produce units with the exact same stats which seems very non realistic to me. Having played hoi2 so long I have forgotten a lot of the aspects of the original hearts of iron game.

yes some of the aspects of HOI1 are much better than HOI2, take for example the convoys capabilites, supply distance modifiers or some of the tech capabilities. Hope HOI3 learns on those mistakes.

 

[comac]

Hey there PurpleHaze...
I don't think that anybody has yet improved on Proconsul's classic Naval Primer in the HOI 1 FAQs

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?t=182709

Without getting into which HOI naval system is 'better' (a futile and totally subjective exercise IMHO), HOI 1's naval system has some glaring problems but also allows one to reproduce a number of real-life naval activities.
Things to like include:

Raiding is a merely function of occupying a sea zone that is part of an enemy convoy route with warships. Convoy attack will attrit strength and organization of the attacker if the convoy is detected. Escorts seem to increase attrition and decrease merchant ship losses but I'm unsure of the exact numbers used by the game engine. Just having friendly naval forces in a sea zone will not protect your convoys as such but may intercept the attackers and this can occur before or after they have struck your convoy. To see what sea zones are being used by your convoys, zoom out the main map while in the manage convoy mode and the darkened sea zones represent your convoy routes. You can then set up offensive patrols accordingly but you cannot re-route convoys;

The ability to refit ships incorporating new techs. This costs time, money and resources but can impose realistic resource management choices for the player;

CORE specialized Carrier Air Groups instead of vanilla torpedo bombers. Their effect is subtle but if one incorporates them as designed, they can help recreate a number of RL aircraft carrier issues;

All DD class vessels can be sent on escort duties. Doing so means that they are lost for other service but all escorts are treated equally so sending top line DD's on escort duty is unnecessary. CORE has other DD models (like the MTB's) that can be built and deployed as escorts. Some argue that this is unrealistic but I would suggest that the overall effect is similar to the countless trawlers, minesweepers and patrol craft that all navies used. They take manpower, resources, time and capacity to build and maintain and generally suffer considerable attrition in any sort of naval war. They also can be very important yet serve invisibly behind the main effort, just like RL;

One can find frustrated players with issues about how even unescorted convoys inflict damage and loss of organization on raiding forces but I think that it introduces some very realistic problems. Warships are very maintenance intensive and the attrition caused by convoy action forces ships and subs to stay in port repairing and recovering. Try a naval submarine campaign for example and you will quickly find that you are likely to only keep one-third or less of them on station. It will also demonstrate why maintaining a significant force of effective surface raiders, enough to dominate any contested sea lanes, is impractical in both game terms and in RL. Hence the reason for unrestricted submarine warfare in both world wars. This is a pretty historically valid effect and makes up for the normal instant turn-around time for naval forces that all HOI versions allow;

Bombers can be sent out on naval bombing missions to seemingly empty sea zones and will attack any enemy naval forces that are detected. Using the repeat mission button, this can simulate offensive air patrols. I never got the HOI 1 patrol function to work satisfactory and have had some success with this technique. Naval bombers are especially effective in this role but tactical bombers will work as well.

I cannot offer any suggested fixes for the horrible naval leadership problems, brutal naval stacking penalties and AI tendency to build the dreaded uber-stacks. One learns to live with them.

Sorry for running off like a soup-sandwich... Hope this helps your HOI 1 experiance a bit.

Cheers

 

[unmerged(45932)]

Thanks for all the information and tips. As stated before I have been playing with the latest Core mod. That naval guide pdf file was a huge help thanks for pointing it out, never would have seen that on my own. The way the convoy raiding system works sounds a lot better than in hoi2, but will no doubt take some getting used to.