HoI2 Doomsday is Discriminative

[unmerged(52674)]

I was waiting for Doomsday's release since the first announcement and finally I got it. I knew that new scenario would be having some fictional elements. But when I began to play and realized that 1945 scenario begins with the US nuclear bombardment of Soviet cities, it was definitely shocking for me.
I just want to say that it is not "element of fiction" - this is too serious deformation of original history. Yes, I can agree with adding the war between Allies and Communists, but not with American planes in the heart of Russia. This is nonsence - Allies wouldn't be able to intervene so deep into Soviet territory. In modern time, the role of the historical simulation games is high enough to affect people's mind, so playing Doomsday, some persons can really consider that the Allies in autumn 1945 were the only major world power while USSR and its satellites (who took the largest part in defeating nazism and which armies were ready to move further) were totally unable to defend their borders! Alas, HoI2DD reflects only Western view. The balance of the game is quite one-sided.
So it's clear now why the mod is named "Doomsday". It is doomsday organized by Allies for USSR because it became too powerful...
I ever may suggest that Doomsday is not just a game - its content has a political purpose. All we see the actual situation in the world. Computer games, as well as massmedia, can be the tool of propaganda. I hope I'm overestimating the problem, but it can be real.
I'm sorry for sharp tone, but it's definitely important question. Believe me, next patch must remove US bombers from the territory of Soviet zone of influence to provide real parity of powers.

 

[Vidfavne]

I ever may suggest that Doomsday is not just a game - its content has a political purpose. All we see the actual situation in the world. Computer games, as well as massmedia, can be the tool of propaganda.

If it's propaganda (which I don't think it is), it's directed against USA - implying that the US would be barbaric enough to use nuclear weapons.

(don't read too much into that, I sort of mean "use nuclear weapons for real - not just to scare the USSR"... or something)

Edit: Also, this should be moved to the Doomsday forum.

/ V

 

[talin]

I just want to say that it is not "element of fiction" - this is too serious deformation of original history. Yes, I can agree with adding the war between Allies and Communists, but not with American planes in the heart of Russia. This is nonsence - Allies wouldn't be able to intervene so deep into Soviet territory.

Yes, they could the B-29 has a range of 3700 miles. From Ankara to Moscow it less than 1200 miles.

 

[Barkdreg]

It's a fictional scenario
nothing discriminative about it

 

[Daztek]

Yes, they could the B-29 has a range of 3700 miles. From Ankara to Moscow it less than 1200 miles.

maybe the russians could have intercepted the B29s

 

[Gaarq]

The argument, that "this is not a fiction" is not valid. It is. Simply, fiction is something what did not happen (but might) or could not happen. HoI focuses on thing which might happen. Therefore the scenario starting with USSR being assaulted by nukes is fiction in term "it might happend". US has quite a few long range bombers (Superfortresses AFAIK) which will be able to deliver the "gift". In that time, they might have more nukes in a pocket. Technically.

Some generals in US (Patton?) tried to push Allied to make a preventive strike on SU and then to push them till edge of the world. What's there wrong on it as a "might-be" fiction?

Well, strange things I see in a Doomsday scenario, are in a political situation depicted at the start of it. SU did not manage to install commie governments into all countries they liberated. Most of the commie leaders came later, definitely in Czechoslovakia, where commies made coup in February 1948, not sooner... I understand, that game needs to be polar just from start, but...

Anyway, fiction is a fiction and would be fiction, regardless what happened *here*. Another Doomsday might be just the Russian attack, well-known "Frankfurt Cut"... but Paradax chose this fictive historical branch... is that discriminative? Would you assign Harry Turtledove as discriminative, because he started his Worldwar series in 1942 with invasion of lizard-like Race?

The "hot" start of Doomdsday scenarion is, according to my understanding, intentional to throw the player immediatelly into warmonger to give him a real challenge: all must be made on march, all optimisations, all actions, what is far more challenging than Sitzkrieg with 300+ IC, nukes in a fridge and royal techteams. Paradox just used the nukes to initiate it. It gives the game a ballance; the Red Hordes suffer from dissent and fewer Allied troops have at least a chance. It is similar to underpowered France in GC36, simple German AI would have no chance to defeat France if it wouldn't be artificially underpowered. See?

 

[stabsoffizier]

All we see the actual situation in the world. Computer games, as well as massmedia, can be the tool of propaganda.

Then let's talk about your presidents view on this issue...

 

[Gaarq]

maybe the russians could have intercepted the B29s

moment of surprise is the key word they might hesitate to shoot down Allied plane not being in war momentary... it might be a provocation, who knows? i immagine the phones started to ring, but all of sudden, it wasn't provocation... it was attack...

 

[Barkdreg]

maybe the russians could have intercepted the B29s

so could the japanese, yet they got nuked twice

 

[GAGA Extrem]

If it's propaganda (which I don't think it is), it's directed against USA - implying that the US would be barbaric enough to use nuclear weapons.

...they already did it. So were is the big deal?

And @topic: The planes start there, because its called 'first strike' - and assumed, that they got through.
Guess its a necessary setup for the DD scenario...

 

[unmerged(39808)]

while USSR and its satellites (who took the largest part in defeating nazism and which armies were ready to move further)

Look how well the Soviets were doing until Lend Lease help didn't came.
Were there any countries with legal govs created?

BTW:You forgot to tell that USSR has slaving half of the Europe. So maybe Allies were trying to give them real freedom?

And please don't use a propaganda argument. We all know who's the paper tiger is! Put in.

 

[unmerged(57001)]

OK, perhaps to make it more PC the scenario could be slightly changed to simulate one of the planes being shot down Also, it would've been easier if the scenario started in e.g. 1952 - then I guess both powers would have kind of equal chances of such attack, and so it could start with Sov striking Usa first. Alas in 1945 only Americans had the bomb so I dont think it can be done any other way.

PS. I recommed playing Hammer & Sickle if you like ColdWar-Gets-Hot-themed games

 

[Darth Tracid]

it´s not a historical scenario, the 45 one...