HoI 4 - Taking states via a peace conference does not give you their manpower [1.81 aa59]

[Question]

Description of issue
Taking states via a peace conference does not give you their manpower [1.81 aa59]

Game Version
1.8.1

Enabled DLC
Together for Victory,
Death or Dishonor,
Waking the Tiger,
Man The Guns, All of the above

Do you have mods enabled?
No

Description
When a country capitulates, the manpower they have in the field is simply deleted and does not go back to the manpower pool after the peace conference.

Example 1 :

1. Start as China. Use the "ai" and "nocb" console cheats to disable AI and allow instant war declaration.

2. Tag switch to PRC. Use the console command "it" to instantly put all of communist china's 700k manpower in the field via large infantry divisions. Use "ae 100000 Basic Infantry Equipment" to give them the equipment they need to deploy. Move the infantry away from the border so that you can capture the capital easily.

3.Tag switch back to China. Declare war on PRC and capture their capital so that they will capitulate. You may need to take a few other provinces to trigger the capitulation.

4. In the peace conference, annex them. Check your manpower. It will not increase at all, because the 700k manpower that PRC had in the field simply vanished into thin air and did not return to the manpower pool.

Example 2 :

Same as above, except instead of annexing PRC, puppet them. Tag switch to PRC and check their manpower. They will have 210k free manpower. Not sure why they get 210k back, but not the full 700k.

Example 3 :

Instead of declaring war on PRC, annex them using the console command. China's manpower pool will increase from 2.79m to 2.85m which is the correct increase, the 700k manpower in the field did not dissapear. Annexing them via a peace conference will cause the manpower to dissapear however.

Example 4 :

Puppet PRC, then annex them via the console command. China's manpower pool will increase from 2.79m to 2.85m which is the correct increase. I do not know why you are getting the full 700k manpower while puppet PRC only gets 210k.

So in short, peace conferences are not giving you the manpower from the newly annexed states.

Steps to Reproduce
See above.

Upload Attachment

 

[bitmode]

About example 1:

After step 2, there is no manpower left in Shaanxi:

So you do get the manpower of this state, but it is 0. (Or more precisely the recruitable pool is empty at 10% recruitable population). After step 3 you are the controller of the state; the state's manpower pool will now only change in response to manpower changes in your country, not PRC. Step 4 does not change anything about this situation as Shaanxi is one of your core states, so it behaves the same regarding manpower whether you are the owner or just the controller.

About example 2:
When I follow these reproduction steps, the puppeted PRC has the full 700K manpower after the peace conference. When a division gets disbanded, it returns its full manpower and equipment unless their supply chunk is not connected to the capital. In the latter case they return no equipment and only 20% (NMilitary.ENCIRCLED_DISBAND_MANPOWER_FACTOR) of their manpower to the country. How exactly did you capture the state? I suspect there's an inconsistency in how the supply chunk looks like at the time of capitulation.

 

[Question]

Uh...not sure what you are talking about. My point is that in example 1, the 700k manpower that was in the field just goes POOF and doesnt return to the state. It WILL return to the state if you use the annex console command however. But annexing the state via the peace conference will not.

Example 2 : I moved the PRC divisions to a corner so there was no combat, then simply walked into their capital. They capitulated and I puppeted the PRC after the peace conference. I tag switched to PRC, moused over the manpower figure, and they only had 210k free manpower. They should have 700k as they had 700k in the field.

 

[bitmode]

the 700k manpower that was in the field just goes POOF and doesnt return to the state.

The manpower gets attached to PRC, the country. It can't return to the state Shaanxi, because that is controlled by an enemy country now. Manpower can only ever return to controlled states or, failing that, gets stored in the country itself. This is no different than when you disband part of your army after having lost part of your country. The disbanded soldiers won't go into enemy territory. How else could it work?

Example 2 : I moved the PRC divisions to a corner so there was no combat, then simply walked into their capital.

Just walking into the capital does not capitulate the PRC, at least 3 other provinces need to be captured. I'm assuming you did it roughly like in the left picture:

In the left example, the PRC has 200K manpower after the peace conference and in the right one it has 700K. The difference between the two is whether the capitulation of the country immediately triggers the peace conference or not. This will happen if there are no other allies in the war and the war lasted for at least 7 days.

So the bug is that countries capitulating at the moment of the peace conference are treated differently than ones capitulating earlier.

 

[Question]

The manpower gets attached to PRC, the country. It can't return to the state Shaanxi, because that is controlled by an enemy country now. Manpower can only ever return to controlled states or, failing that, gets stored in the country itself. This is no different than when you disband part of your army after having lost part of your country. The disbanded soldiers won't go into enemy territory. How else could it work?

And yet, when you annex a country using the console command, you do get the manpower as per normal...obviously after the war ends it should not treat the state as an enemy country anymore because there is no enemy country anymore.

And yes, you do have to take tose provinces on the way to the capital but thats because you have to walk through there. But they have no VPs anyway so that shouldnt matter, you just need to take the capital for the VPs which causes the AI to capitulate.

What do you mean by capitulate after 7 days? You mean the PRC will automatically capitulate if the war lasts at least 7 days and they have no allies? I have never seen the AI do that unless you take most of their VPs.

 

[bitmode]

And yet, when you annex a country using the console command, you do get the manpower as per normal...obviously after the war ends it should not treat the state as an enemy country anymore because there is no enemy country anymore.

I agree, there are inconsistencies between the different ways that countries get taken out of the game.

And yes, you do have to take tose provinces on the way to the capital but thats because you have to walk through there. But they have no VPs anyway so that shouldnt matter, you just need to take the capital for the VPs which causes the AI to capitulate.

You don't have to walk there if you use the teleport (or occupationpaint) console command, which I assume the QA people do to save time.
Each province is worth 1 victory point, the cities are just worth more. In this case it matters because the capital Yan'an only has 31 victory points and the surrounding provinces 11 points. It does not have 80% of the victory points by itself to trigger capitulation.

What do you mean by capitulate after 7 days? You mean the PRC will automatically capitulate if the war lasts at least 7 days and they have no allies? I have never seen the AI do that unless you take most of their VPs.

They won't trigger a peace conference before 7 days even if they did already lose their VPs. There is a special rule for that. A very small country like Luxembourg might get capitulated within one or two days when attacked and this rule gives them some extra time to join an alliance or at least call in countries guaranteeing them. This rule does not often come into play normally, but in testing it does. For example when I first tried to reproduce your bug, I capitulated PRC using teleports one day after declaring war and that lead to the difference in results.

I merely pointed out these things so a QA person can reliably reproduce the problem when they do take a look at the bug. Keep in mind that they usually try to reproduce the bug not in the version you report it for, but in their much newer development version. If they do it slightly differently than you, they can't reproduce it and might (wrongly) assume that the bug already has been fixed.

 

[Question]

STILL not fixed as of 1.10...come on paradox....

Heres a new example :

View attachment 683553

See that manpower Turkey has? When you annex them, they go POOF.

This is Edirne's manpower assuming that I annex Turkey and then core the state later :

View attachment 683554

Now this is assuming I were to puppet Turkey instead :

View attachment 683556

And this is how much manpower Edirne has after annexing Turkey and coring them :

View attachment 683557

Ever noticed how "total manpower" and "deployed manpower" figures have a huge disparity after you annex and core a country? This is proably why. (Assuming you win the war with barely any casaulties of course).