HoI 4 - Summary of inconsistencies of ship technology and designs

[Grzegorz Grzybek]

Description of issue
Summary of inconsistencies of ship technology and designs

Game Version
1.6.2_beta (2bbd)

Enabled DLC
All of the above

Do you have mods enabled?
No

Description
I've prepared this spreadsheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/173miEiXwHrMjxc3FmWiW1mbFeEufs-BmqAwKAAmDNrI where I wanted to collect data about Vanilla and MtG versions of ship designs available for constructions.

This spreadsheet lists all the hulls (MtG) and designs (Vanilla) and tries to calculate derived values (e.g., of lg_attack) based on what given design contains. For example, in MtG it's clear - cost of design from given technology is basically hull + engine_1. For Vanilla it's more complicated, as the designs have to be complete.

Here's a list of strange, confusing, inconsistent values I found:

* "Super Heavy Battleship Hull" technology gives heavy armor tier III, same as "All-or-Nothing Armor Scheme" - shouldn't it be IV?
* Completing Torpedos Cruiser focus for Japan gives empty research window: "ship_hull_torpedo_cruised_desc" instead of image* Vanilla: light_cruiser_4 has fixed_ship_engine_slot=cruiser_ship_engine_3 (despite other slots, except fixed_ship_fire_control_system_slot are filled with _4 modules). all other light_cruiser_X have matching cruiser_ship_engine_X - maybe not a bug, but looks inconsistent
* Vanilla: light_cruiser_2 has fixed_ship_anti_air_slot=ship_anti_air_3 - same as above
* Vanilla: heavy_cruiser_1 and _2 have ship_anti_air_3, heavy_cruiser_3 has ship_anti_air_4 - same as above
* Vanilla: heavy_cruiser_2, _3 and _4 have cruiser_ship_engine_2 - same as above
* Vanilla: heavy_cruiser_2-_4 use cruiser_engine_2. fuel_consumption is 33 in heavy_cruiser_1, but _2-_4 seem to inherit it from archetype = ship_hull_cruiser instead of parent = heavy_cruiser_1, thus have Fuel Usage 36 instead of 49 (hc_1 has 45)
* ship_hull_cruiser_panzerschiff/default_modules/rear_1_custom_slot = ship_torpedo, but there's only ship_torpedo_1-_4, there's no module named "ship_torpedo"
* Vanilla: destroyer_1 seems to have fuel_consumption from itself and from light_ship_engine_1 (14), while destroyer_2-_4 have only from engine
* Vanilla: destroyer_4 seems to have own anti_air_attack = 5 without reason - should have only from ship_anti_air_X mounted
* MtG: GER. ship_hull_cruiser_panzerschiff/default_modules are neither historical, nor complete. There's another design, which is complete ("Deutschland Class", 6796 building cost)
* Vanilla: battleship_4 has own lg_attack=1 without a reason
* Vanilla: battleship_4 has own armor_value=40, SH_battleship_1 has 47 and SH_battleship_2 has 3 (!)
* MtG: ship_hull_heavy_1-_4 has not mandatory fixed_ship_fire_control_system_slot
* MtG: carrier hulls don't have fixed_ship_fire_control_system_slot

EDIT2 (Carriers):
* Vanilla: carrier_1 - _4 all have carrier_ship_engine_1
* Vanilla: carrier_2 has higher own deck size (15) than carrier_3 (10)

EDIT3(2bbd):
* Vanilla: submarine_3 and _4 has now more consistent cost and own torpedo attack

EDIT4(1.9.1 3d42):
* ship_hull_cruiser_panzerschiff/default_modules/rear_1_custom_slot has now correct ship_torpedo_1

My work on this spreadsheet is still WiP - green values are values calculated using different stats from modules and confirmed with what I see in game itself. blue values are calculated but not confirmed. black ones are not calculated and taken from game data files. bold values are indication of possible bug/inconsistency

Steps to Reproduce
Check game data files

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[cnwi]

* "Basic Heavy Battery" technology gives access to tier II and V, Improved Heavy Battery gives III, Advanced Heavy Battery gives IV - why V is from tech II?

I'm pretty sure those are the SuperHeavy Batteries needed for 1936 SHBB, hence why they unlock at that stage. Both are named 46cm cannons, and you don't have main batteries on your SHBB if you haven't researched that.

 

[Grzegorz Grzybek]

I'm pretty sure those are the SuperHeavy Batteries needed for 1936 SHBB, hence why they unlock at that stage. Both are named 46cm cannons, and you don't have main batteries on your SHBB if you haven't researched that.

Agree - sounds clear. I'm removing this item from my list.

 

[Lopus1969]

Could you add the fact that the main battery images on the ship shows guns placed on the bow facing both fore and aft? I think they should be split into bow and rear guns.

 

[Grzegorz Grzybek]

I just checked 1.6.2_beta (1f07) and I see that these are fixed:
* "Early Destroyer Hull" has slot bottom/5 for Torpedoes and slot bottom/6 for Engine. Hulls 1936-1944 have them reversed
* MtG: Destroyers can have max 7.5 sub detection (with active sonar) and 20 surface detection. In vanilla, Destroyer IV has 140 sub and 50 surf. detection - that's probably already known issue
* MtG: Cruisers gave 20 surface detection (radar doesn't add much). In vanilla, Crusier IV has 70 surf. detection - same as above
* Vanilla: too big sub/surf detection for light cruisers and JAP torpedo cruiser - same as above
* Vanilla: battleship_2 and _3 have decreasing build_cost_ic (comparing to battleship_1), _4 has higher (which is logical)
* Vanilla: battleship_1 has heavy_ship_engine_1, battleship_2 has heavy_ship_engine_1, battleship_3 has heavy_ship_engine_2 and battleship_4 has heavy_ship_engine_1 (!)
* Vanilla: SH_battleship_2 has heavy_ship_engine_1

I updated my https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/173miEiXwHrMjxc3FmWiW1mbFeEufs-BmqAwKAAmDNrI and it looks much more consistent

 

[Lopus1969]

I just checked 1.6.2_beta (1f07) and I see that these are fixed:
* "Early Destroyer Hull" has slot bottom/5 for Torpedoes and slot bottom/6 for Engine. Hulls 1936-1944 have them reversed
* MtG: Destroyers can have max 7.5 sub detection (with active sonar) and 20 surface detection. In vanilla, Destroyer IV has 140 sub and 50 surf. detection - that's probably already known issue
* MtG: Cruisers gave 20 surface detection (radar doesn't add much). In vanilla, Crusier IV has 70 surf. detection - same as above
* Vanilla: too big sub/surf detection for light cruisers and JAP torpedo cruiser - same as above
* Vanilla: battleship_2 and _3 have decreasing build_cost_ic (comparing to battleship_1), _4 has higher (which is logical)
* Vanilla: battleship_1 has heavy_ship_engine_1, battleship_2 has heavy_ship_engine_1, battleship_3 has heavy_ship_engine_2 and battleship_4 has heavy_ship_engine_1 (!)
* Vanilla: SH_battleship_2 has heavy_ship_engine_1

I updated my https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/173miEiXwHrMjxc3FmWiW1mbFeEufs-BmqAwKAAmDNrI and it looks much more consistent

I think that the ship engines on the battleships is "inherited" from the previous designs? I've had bb_2s and bb_3s start of with engine 1s if the previous models had engine 1s, if the previous model is engine 2s, then the new ship researched starts at engine 2.