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HoI 4 - Dev Diary: America Rework

Hello, and welcome back to another dev diary! Today we are going to talk about Freedom. Freedom from Fear. Freedom from Want. Freedom from having to vote for a presidential candidate every four years.


The vanilla US focus tree offered some interesting alternate-history scenarios, but if you wanted to play historical, you pretty much sat around doing very little until the war started. Part of this is the fundamental design problem of the US in a historical grand-strategy game: if we allow the US to freely enter the war when it has even a fraction of its historical economy, the Axis never makes it into Paris and the war ends in 1940. If we restrict the US from entering the war freely until its historical date, the US player sits around until late 1941 doing very little (there is a reason why my usual go-to scenario in HoI2 and HoI3 was “Play France until you lose, then switch to the US”).


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So one of the goals we had for this rework was to give the player a bit more stuff to actually do during the lead-up to the war. Making the path out of the depression a little more involved was an obvious place to start. Instead of a single national spirit, it is now three levels that give a smoother curve out of the depression. But instead of just taking three focuses in a row to do what could previously be done in one, we wanted the player to have to work a lot more to get out of the depression.


Enter the script-based Congress Mechanic. The Congress mechanic is - for now - unique to the US and simulates the shifting majorities in both houses of Congress. It ties into a lot of things that we will get into in a bit. But on a fundamental level, taking the focuses that reduce the penalties from the great depression will require you to have a majority in both houses, but will also reduce your support once you have taken it to simulate members of Congress who voted for the proposal being unwilling to support you further without getting something in return.


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You can gain and lose support from random events as well as midterm and presidential elections. Generally speaking, going with the incumbent means you are more likely to lose support in Congress in the election, and if the situation is particularly dire, going with the challenger will flip support and opposition. Beyond this, a number of decisions allow you to gain support in congress, from simple lobbying to bribing members of Congress by investing in their constituencies to just regularly bribing them.


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Besides getting out of the depression, you’ll also need to get Congress to sign off on the Selective Service Act, which is the gatekeeper focus of the army modernization branch, and the Two Ocean Navy Act, which is the gatekeeper focus for the naval branch. The amount of support you need depends on your war support (in general, you can assume that every focus with “Act” somewhere in its title ties into the Congress mechanic).


Another aspect we wanted to add was to give the US player a choice to become more active in the world earlier. As I said above, that comes with host of issues. We want it to be a viable option, but not a no-brainer. This means that there will be a number of restrictions in the “Limited Intervention” branch. First, you’ll have to have enough support in Congress to take the focus (and a lack of war support means that quite a few member of Congress will break ranks over it). Afterwards, you will have to choose between focusing your efforts on preparing to intervene in Europe or in Asia. Taking either of these focuses unlocks a number of decisions to try and build public support for an intervention. Many of these decisions are tied to events around the world - here the US is protesting the Anschluss.


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However, there is only a small window to utilize these events. Each decision adds something that is internally called an “intervention strike” as in “three strikes and you’re out”, except in this case it’s “three strikes and we start bombing”. A generic decision allows to build support against a target if they do not have specific decisions associated with them. Finally, once a country has two strikes against them, you can petition congress to sanction an intervention, which will again require significant support (it is easier to gain a wargoal against a country that is at war, and easier still if they are in an aggressive war).


This will likely make it harder for you to pursue your other goals - so if you want to intervene in Europe on behalf of the Allies, you will most likely have to forego economic reforms, at least for a while.


The intervention mandates are also used to allow the US to intervene in the Americas if someone violates the Monroe doctrine.


Intervention in general is something you can prepare a lot better now by using war plans. Completing the focuses unlocks a decision to execute the corresponding war plan and gain a temporary bonus against a country, along with some other temporary bonuses.


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Of course, by this point a statistical majority of you might wonder why you even bother with all this busy-work, bribing senators, cutting deals with representatives, when there is a world to be won. As promised, we also wanted to add proper alternate ideology branches for the US. As we said many months ago in the Dev Diary about South Africa, we also look to try and open up new areas of the map for warfare, to allow you to fight in different areas than trudging across the same old parts of Europe.


So we wanted to have a nice big Civil War in the US. We want tank battles south of Chicago. Naval landings in Florida. A brutal slog across the Rocky Mountains. So we decided to not just put in one civil war but two! That’s a whole 100% MORE CIVIL WAR!


You’ll have to fight a civil war in either of the alternate ideology branches. For the curious: the branches straight down from the WPA and Adjusted Compensation Act are democratic ideology branches and will be part of the free update, the branches starting with Suspend the Prosecution and America First will be part of the DLC.


In the left branch, appropriately enough, you soften up your stance towards the communists. You can do this even if you don’t intend to go fully communist, as it opens up new ways of gaining support in Congress. If you do decide to be more radical, you can desegregate the American society, which will trigger protests from the usual suspects. The protests by themselves don’t do anything, but if you decide to push harder towards communism, the protests will intensify and eventually spill over. The Unions Representation Act is another such trigger that will cause protests.


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Before the civil war breaks out, there is a “Point of No Return” after which it is merely a question of time until hostilities start. In the time between the Point of No Return and the actual start of the war, you’ll get a number of events telling you how the situation develops. These events have actual effects on how your position is like at the start of the war.


For example, if an event tells you that a state has mobilized the national guard, the revolter gets a fully-equipped and quite capable division when the war starts. These events aren’t intended to make the difference between winning and losing but to give the war a bit more flavor.


Once the war starts in the communist branch, it is not quite like a regular civil war. Instead of the country and the military splitting in half, it spawns a new tag (CSA). This allows us to do a few things, like removing CSA territories as cores for the US (which means that they, for example, create resistance when conquered into). Depending on how far down you’ve gone in the communist branch, a part of the country might also declare its neutrality during the war. You can still interact with this part through decisions, but so can the other side.


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Where in other countries, a civil war is something we must be very careful with to ensure that the country is not completely crippled by the time the real war starts, here, we want ACWII to be “the war” the US gets into and which merges into the greater World War. So there are limited objectives for you after you have won the American Theater of World War II, but you can push decolonization in Asia and intervene in the Chinese Civil War, while also working to reintegrate the breakaway states.


The Civil War in the fascist branch works along similar lines. You also get a branch leading down from America First that you can use even if you don’t want to go full fascist - a sort of flirting with fascism, allowing you, for example, to investigate the opposition through the House Committee of Un-American Activities. The Voter Registration Act ensures a comfortable majority in every election, but triggers a wave of protests.


If you decide to push even further and publicly ally with the Silver Legion, you will trigger additional protests that put the country on the road to civil war. Like in the communist branch, a number of events determine what the starting position is, but the roles are reversed. Where in the communist branch, a part of the country tries to break away, in the fascist branch the country revolts against your leadership and tries to oust you from power, forcing you to fall back into a powerbase you set up in advance (you set up a powerbase in advance, right?). Parts of the country will declare in support or in opposition, leading to different front lines.


With much of the professional military on the other side, you’ll have to rely on hastily-raised militias to hold the line until you can get back on your feet. You might have to cut some deals and appeal to the locals to get them to accept that you are on their side.


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Once you have won that war, you are left with a US that is now safely fascist, which means that you are ideally poised to conquer the rest of the world. So we decided we might as well give you the focus tree to do just that. The War Powers Act lessens the stability impact of being in a war, and you can take your first steps abroad as you politely ask Canada to give you the territory between you and the Alaskan border (the event may or may not be called “Vancouver Or War!”) and politely ask Cuba to please stop being independent.


You continue in this fashion until at last you demand global hegemony and give all other majors an ultimatum to either become puppets or go to war. Along the way, you will most likely have gobbled up all the small countries that otherwise make conquering the world such a pain.


That is all for today. Next week we will be back with another look into the naval side of things.



Rejected Titles:

You will want fries with this focus tree

Making the world safe for fascism

Josh Lyman Simulator 2018

All focus trees are bigger in Texas

Communism is the right of all sentient beings

While writing this dev diary a bald eagle sat down outside the window and cried. True story.

My favourite state borders are Colorado’s

My google search history now makes me unemployable in most of the US

Fight them over here so we don’t have to fight them over there

This dev diary may contain trace amounts of political commentary

There was supposed to be a monarchist path but the Americans in the office rebelled and threw away all the tea

Team America saves the day

“Three strikes and we start bombing” would dramatically improve Baseball as a sport

https://twitter.com/alflandonlover gets the love he deserves

Actually rejected title: Make America <literally anything> Again

“Five score and two days ago our game director brought forth, upon this world, a new DLC announcement, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all gamers like American Civil Wars.”
 
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Of course, what did the US army do besides fight a two front war and define military doctrine in the West for the next century? :^)
It’s a question about balance. The US historically was far more powerful than in game. It wouldn’t be balanced to give them army focuses especially tank ones. But I do believe they should have a significant land doctrines research bonus as their doctrine was superb for the entire war, just not tank research.

As to the rest of your post, I really don’t see how this tree is an improvement at all to the current tree. There’s no clear historical path (its blended with the bleeding communist path for some reason) and the ahistorical options are a bit bland for my taste. Additionally, the Congress mechanic is going to make PP a very sparse resource for any aspiring US player.
 
I don’t get why the war plans weren’t merged with the political tree. Right now it seems like the new political tree, especially the historical path, lacks an actual direction of what the country’s aims are, which is a change for the worse.
 
modern Europe-style socialism rather than a worker's council communism
That’s confusing social democracy (which is modern Europe) with actual socialism. The tree should just switch the subideology of the Democratic Party to ‘Democratic socialism’ instead of magically making you communist.
 
@Bratyn Are we going to see a change in the US Rule that it can't join a different ideology? As far as I can see there's no "real" Communist or Fascist path and joining countries by focus is somewhat cringy. Although I can see the idea behind the US not joining anything but like-minded countries, it's very limiting in terms of non-standard multiplayer sessions. Just as an idea: would it make sense to remove the restriction or add "can join communist/fascist faction" if you flirt enough with one side or the other?
 
After watching the Stream yesterday, I had a few thoughts and impressions on the new historical flavor in the US focus tree and faction, specifically for the added ministers.

Why no Democratic Limitations? It seems odd to me that the ministers already available (Stimson, Taft, Nelson, Hull) aren't limited in their availability if the player decides to go Communist or Fascist. I don't think it's unreasonable that they would remain available as the player might flirt, but none of these guys would have actively supported the Communist Party or a Fascist regime.

Stability Increase from Reformers? It also seems odd to me that the Anti-Communist Crusader would increase stability in a country. Really, logically, any of the political reformers ought to be lowering stability to indicate how society is being turned on its head and the existing government's fundamental legitimacy is being challenged. It would make far more sense if all reformers in the game decreased stability by 5% when chosen (especially since, as more of the population converts, there is less need and should be less desire for the player to keep that minister active in the government).

Thoughts on Specific Ministers
  • Joseph McCarthy: He should not be in the game. I know he's the anti-communist crusader we all remember from history, but at the time of HOI4 he was only just out of law school and starting his professional life and political career. The actual HUAC Chairman at the time was Martin Dies, Jr., a conservative Dixiecrat from Texas. He would make far more sense as the Anti-Communist Crusader. (And don't tell me you're going for familiarity among the gamers here, because no one knows who Donald Nelson is).
  • Robert Taft: He probably shouldn't be a Silent Workhorse in the game. A better fit would be the Backroom Backstabber, especially if he was limited to only working in a Democratic government. He was a traditionalist and, if in power, would have seriously hampered the efforts of any reformers to increase the power of the central government.
  • Other Ideas
    • Fritz Kuhn: You added the focus to work with the German-American Bund. Why not make Kuhn an available adviser when that focus is chosen?
    • De-Segregation Focus: It would be nice if moving down this path made an African-American adviser or two available.
    • America First: Certainly some names here, like Robert E. Wood (the Chairman), Joseph Patterson and Robert McCormick (Publishers), and William Regnery (Businessmen).
    • Minister Availability: One of the ways to increase the Historical Accuracy of the ministers would be to put all of them (except maybe Morgenthau, Nelson, and Stimson) behind Focus walls. Taft and other conservatives (both Democrats and Republicans) could become available at places down the Gold Standard tree, and certain important names from Roosevelt's Administration (Byrnes, Wallace, Hopkins) or more liberal names (Wheeler, etc) could become available down the New Deal tree.
I was surprised that there wasn't more built out beyond the mechanics, though in hindsight reworking the tree and adding the Congress system must have been significant effort. I'm hoping the Developers aren't done with trying to build out the flavor here though, especially since Ministers, though not a huge part of the game, can add some fun history and play style to the game.
 
I think HOI4 is a wonderful game for Paradox. However, this latest addition to the U.S. is something that I think the developers are going to regret. I think it is going to suck. The U.S. will be some divergent sub-game that doesn't come close to modelling reality or branches of reality that had any likelihood. I suspect in subsequent versions of the game, a great deal of effort is going to be needed to modify/delete this effort and the forums are going to be chocker-block full of complaints.

Regards,
Feltan
 
Just a flavor suggestion - Is there any way to lock the HUAC focus (or at least McCarthy) behind the Soviets (or better yet any communist major) generating world tension?
 
I think HOI4 is a wonderful game for Paradox. However, this latest addition to the U.S. is something that I think the developers are going to regret. I think it is going to suck. The U.S. will be some divergent sub-game that doesn't come close to modelling reality or branches of reality that had any likelihood. I suspect in subsequent versions of the game, a great deal of effort is going to be needed to modify/delete this effort and the forums are going to be chocker-block full of complaints.

Regards,
Feltan

I don’t think it will be that bad, but compared to the British and Dutch trees, the new US tree’s potential “story” looks rather milquetoast.

One confusing thing that we touched on earlier, that I still haven’t seen a satisfactory answer to is why all many of the “fascist” NF’s are centered around privatisation. You know why that seems so bizarre? Vicky 2 modeled fascists appropriately being tied to state capitalism...but HOI4 is now insinuating Libertarian(read Laissez Faire) policies are fascist...huh?
 
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Still think it is utterly ridiculous and nonsensical to have the Silver Shirts restore the CSA in the 1930s. Nobody in the period wanted to do anything like that (that particular 'evolution' of the Lost Cause started up after the civil rights movement picked up steam in the ~1960s) and the Silver Shirts were explicitly not Lost Causers in any event. They were nationalists who were in the camp of people who thought the CSA were traitors, and their founder/leader William Dudley Pelley - the man who in HOI4 will now almost always go on to become President of the new CSA if he takes power - liked to rant about how he was convinced the CSA was a Jewish and French plot to destroy the Union.

Just cause some of your players have a weird fixation on the CSA doesn't mean you have to shove it into everything even where/when it makes no sense guys! If you insist on the CSA being restored for no reason as part of the focus tree, you could at least make it Non-Aligned or an alternate fascist path under a different fictional party (since I don't think you'll find any historical party from the period calling for that sort of thing).
 
Still think it is utterly ridiculous and nonsensical to have the Silver Shirts restore the CSA in the 1930s. Nobody in the period wanted to do anything like that (that particular 'evolution' of the Lost Cause started up after the civil rights movement picked up steam in the ~1960s) and the Silver Shirts were explicitly not Lost Causers in any event. They were nationalists who were in the camp of people who thought the CSA were traitors, and their founder/leader William Dudley Pelley - the man who in HOI4 will now almost always go on to become President of the new CSA if he takes power - liked to rant about how he was convinced the CSA was a Jewish and French plot to destroy the Union.

Just cause some of your players have a weird fixation on the CSA doesn't mean you have to shove it into everything even where/when it makes no sense guys! If you insist on the CSA being restored for no reason as part of the focus tree, you could at least make it Non-Aligned or an alternate fascist path under a different fictional party (since I don't think you'll find any historical party from the period calling for that sort of thing).

Yeh, I have to agree. The new US tree just seems kind of bleh...not really sure that’s PDS’s fault though. The US’s geographic isolation and overwhelming might has always made it a strange power to fit into these types of games.
 
Still think it is utterly ridiculous and nonsensical to have the Silver Shirts restore the CSA in the 1930s. Nobody in the period wanted to do anything like that (that particular 'evolution' of the Lost Cause started up after the civil rights movement picked up steam in the ~1960s) and the Silver Shirts were explicitly not Lost Causers in any event. They were nationalists who were in the camp of people who thought the CSA were traitors, and their founder/leader William Dudley Pelley - the man who in HOI4 will now almost always go on to become President of the new CSA if he takes power - liked to rant about how he was convinced the CSA was a Jewish and French plot to destroy the Union.

Just cause some of your players have a weird fixation on the CSA doesn't mean you have to shove it into everything even where/when it makes no sense guys! If you insist on the CSA being restored for no reason as part of the focus tree, you could at least make it Non-Aligned or an alternate fascist path under a different fictional party (since I don't think you'll find any historical party from the period calling for that sort of thing).
Why would an American fascist regime be 'pro-Confederate' in the first place? The Confederates were separatists, and generally fascist regimes have a very poor opinion of separatism.
 
Why would an American fascist regime be 'pro-Confederate' in the first place? The Confederates were separatists, and generally fascist regimes have a very poor opinion of separatism.
It's Paradox.

Memery > History
 
During the stream today, right as the civil war began the player controlled USA became non-aligned and the president became a generic (I’m guessing placeholder, given the name was Hinchie Mclaws) before the MacArthur event fires.

Was/or will there be an event explaining the fate of President Landon (was he killed it did he step down, flee)? Or was he supposed to become the leader of the non-aligned and they forgot to script him in? Either one (though preferably the latter) would help tie the story together from how the USA descends into a dictatorship in a HoI4 game.

I love how this dlc is shaping up so far, and I can’t wait to see the finished product!

Edit: Also will any generals switch to the Loyalist side along with MacArthur?
 
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During the stream today, right as the civil war began the player controlled USA became non-aligned and the president became a generic (I’m guessing placeholder, given the name was Hinchie Mclaws) before the MacArthur event fires.

Was/or will there be an event explaining the fate of President Landon (was he killed it did he step down, flee)? Or was he supposed to become the leader of the non-aligned and they forgot to script him in? Either one (though preferably the latter) would help tie the story together from how the USA descends into a dictatorship in a HoI4 game.

I love how this dlc is shaping up so far, and I can’t wait to see the finished product!

Edit: Also will any generals switch to the Loyalist side along with MacArthur?

They need to get rid of that placeholder neutral guy. They also need to get rid of that Victoria II Monarchist flag relic and use a proper American flag - something with an eagle perhaps. They could just draw inspiration from Kaiserreich as they've already done with "American Caesar".

I'd be interested in knowing why the rebels are democrats (small d) as opposed to communists. Are your opponents also Democrats if you take the Communist path? Happy that they share the same tree though, just with a different path selected.

And please get rid of that awful orange color.
 
They need to get rid of that placeholder neutral guy. They also need to get rid of that Victoria II Monarchist flag relic and use a proper American flag - something with an eagle perhaps. They could just draw inspiration from Kaiserreich as they've already done with "American Caesar".

I'd be interested in knowing why the rebels are democrats (small d) as opposed to communists. Are your opponents also Democrats if you take the Communist path? Happy that they share the same tree though, just with a different path selected.

And please get rid of that awful orange color.
I think the idea is that the rebels are democrats but they are able (and probably will be scripted) to take the communist path to show the increasing radicalization of the war, kinda like how the Loyalists start off non-aligned (and can stay that way) instead of going immediately fascist. Hopefully though the placeholder will be swapped with Alf Landon (or Wendel Wilkie) to show that he's still in charge but no recognized by democratic supporters, propped up only really by the fascists and nationalists.

I strongly agree with both.

As I've said earlier in the thread, the idea of Southern fascist separatism as a response to desegregation is a great idea, but it's a horrible idea to have the United States itself become the Confederacy.

Neo-Confederate ideology is very specifically a manifestation of Southern nationalism. That's all the Confederacy ever was: a Southern nationalist movement.

It looks like embracing the confederacy isn't required for the American civil war (or at least you can stay non-aligned and fight the civil war), so I predict either
1.) Going fascist does not mean you have to embrace the confederacy and there is a way to go fascist during the civil war and put Pelly in charge. If this is the case embracing the confederacy will probably give boosts in the Southern states at the cost of making reconstruction harder and probably create a new fascist leader like Fritz Julius Kuhn
2.) "Traditional" fascists like the ones you described will be represented by non-aligned and be allied with Authoritarian-Capitalists and other nationalists like MacArthur. The "fascist" USA will represent the Confederacy and emphasize their racism (without mentioning their distrust of central government, which was detrimental during their rebellion
 
There was no need to turn to the memory of the CSA for support for racism during this period though - the entire USA was structured around a racist white consensus at the time. Fascists in the US were looking to Nazi Germany and Fascist Italy abroad and the 2nd KKK at home (which you'll note also didn't call for a restoration of the CSA) for inspirations, not a failed rebellion restricted to the South from before they were born.

I'll also be the second person here to point out that the only fascist coup that was actually seriously plotted and which we know about in the 1930s was the Business Plot, which was based in New England and again had no intention of restoring the CSA.
 
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I think it would be cool to see the Japanese conduct some kind of "Committee of American Affairs" that would invite key interested nations(i.e. Canada, Panama) who would be interested in dividing up American islands and colonies/ outlier states (e.g. Alaska, Panama Canal) with the Japanese if ever there were some kind of American Civil War.
 
    • Minister Availability: One of the ways to increase the Historical Accuracy of the ministers would be to put all of them (except maybe Morgenthau, Nelson, and Stimson) behind Focus walls. Taft and other conservatives (both Democrats and Republicans) could become available at places down the Gold Standard tree, and certain important names from Roosevelt's Administration (Byrnes, Wallace, Hopkins) or more liberal names (Wheeler, etc) could become available down the New Deal tree.
Speaking of Morgenthau, it would be nice if there were some options for the Allies as to how they deal with Germany in the immediate aftermath of the war, with the Morgenthau Plan being one option. Basically destroying Germany's economic base and military manpower with no real hope of rebuilding it.