Hive Minds are OP in 2.2

[Flame13223]

Well the Devouring swarms are supposed to be stronger than normal with the main penalty balancing it being that they are hostile towards everyone and everything thus risking attacks from others early on.

The problem is the AI is worse than ever now in 2.2 so they offer no real challenge.

 

[Relwin]

I should of shut up. Hive minds are getting some tested nerfs on beta. Less pop growth and taking away their scavenger jobs

Yesterday appeared new limitation to hive mind. Now habitability also causes maintenance cost to increase as well. Planet with 10% habitability will give 90% maintenance cost increase along with food so if u colonize bad planets every third drone is maintenance drone. Also Maintenance drone is removed from hive district. I can admit that this change is kinda harsh. Upgrade to hive warren building that gives 12 housing and 2 maintenance drones now costs crystals upkeep. So if it comes live in that state i think hive mind will be most likely limited. It forces hive mind players to play charismatic trait pops for sure.

 

[Madzai]

Now habitability also causes maintenance cost to increase as well. Planet with 10% habitability will give 90% maintenance cost increase along with food so if u colonize bad planets every third drone is maintenance drone.

Not really a nerf, unless you playing without pre-generated planets of your type. Low hab planets will still be used as breeding ground. The only thing it actually do is make habitability irrelevant. You just use your planet types until Terra-forming\genemodding.

Also Maintenance drone is removed from hive district. I can admit that this change is kinda harsh. Upgrade to hive warren building that gives 12 housing and 2 maintenance drones now costs crystals upkeep.

That's super harsh. Hive minds supposed to be about numbers and now we cannot afford those numbers. Having more workers by district is cool, but useless if everything goes into maintaining them.

They better to just buff normal Empires\ME instead of nerfing GC who, for the first time since introduction felt like there are in place they should be.

Oh and it also make Synchronicity tradition pretty mandatory, since it's like +10 POP per building.

 

[Siri]

is it a bug though? Tomb World Habitability always gave 60% everywhere since stellaris 1.0 (either from empires who've chosen the TW as their starting planet or fro Cockroaches from tombed earth)

the only inconsistency came when they've introduced 2 civics that gave tomb world start (which is apparently now fixed)

But it's not supposed to give Tomb World Preference. It's supposed to give the Survivor Trait that gives a bonus to the habitability on Tomb World planets. They are two different things and they're not supposed to have the latter because that is exclusive to events and primitives like the cockroaches. Compare it to Life-seeded which very specifically says you get Gaia World preference. If that's how Post-Apocalyptic was templated it wouldn't be bugged, but it's not, so it is.

 

[Relwin]

I figured out build and opener for hive mind to deal with new penalties in form of amenties. Baiscally:
Civics: Ascetic (-15% amenities usage), One Mind (+15% unity)
Pops: extremely adaptive, charismatic, slow breeders + 2 other any negative traits to compensate
Policies: Nutrimental Plentitude, Extraction Policy (at least till eco will handle balanced economy)
Traditions: Start Adaptability, take 10% habitability then +1 building slot, then move to synchrocity and pick trait for +2 maintenance drones from depot and -10% amenities usage, then whatever u want, i recommend max out prosperity for more synaptic drones and get that juicy unity and society research by the way.

Results: Bad planets have 50% habitability, normally pop will consume 1.4 food, 1.9 on nutrimental plentitude AND 1.25 amenities per pop. Every colony can start with spawning pool at day 1. Meantime maintenance drone produces 6 amenities, so depot generates not 25 but 30 total. Green tech will eventually slap 4x5% habitability research, which will eventually make bad planets even better. Unlock genetics and hive worlds - once hive world spam is real it's possible to scrap traits on pop for something more useful then.

Conclusion: nerf on organic species for habitability penalties caused some issue but it was doable to deal with it with specific build. Amenities costs increase nerfed just one thing which is no longer you can use non-adaptive with strong production traits if you plan mass colonizing unless u accept having every third pop doing something on planet, while one is getting maintenance and other is getting food.

 

[Wolfgang I]

Damn now that I'm aware how purging works in this version I realize thr FP are by far the strongest civic now. I take everything back...

All purgers are strong if you resettle pops to one planet...

 

[Sequence7]

I really miss scavengers being a job. It feels really silly having events trigger because of unemployment for a hivemind.

I liked how it made them feel different to normal empires. You could build up huge population numbers in the late game without it crippling your empire. Not overly powerful at 1 mineral for 1 food, but flavourful.

It's an easy thing to mod though.

 

[Siri]

I really miss scavengers being a job. It feels really silly having events trigger because of unemployment for a hivemind.

I liked how it made them feel different to normal empires. You could build up huge population numbers in the late game without it crippling your empire. Not overly powerful at 1 mineral for 1 food, but flavourful.

It wasn't about the power level of it. A lot of people (myself included) were annoyed that scavenger jobs meant that you didn't get alerts when pops had no district/building to work in, which meant you had to check manually way too often. Would have been cooler if scavengers had just made the red icon pop up but I prefer this to not having the icon at all.

 

[hellatze]

It wasn't about the power level of it. A lot of people (myself included) were annoyed that scavenger jobs meant that you didn't get alerts when pops had no district/building to work in, which meant you had to check manually way too often. Would have been cooler if scavengers had just made the red icon pop up but I prefer this to not having the icon at all.

Rhats make hivemind become obselete now.

Just because you want the game harder. Doesnt meqn you nerf them to oblivion.

RIP hivemind.

 

[Sequence7]

It wasn't about the power level of it. A lot of people (myself included) were annoyed that scavenger jobs meant that you didn't get alerts when pops had no district/building to work in, which meant you had to check manually way too often. Would have been cooler if scavengers had just made the red icon pop up but I prefer this to not having the icon at all.

Yeah, I just don't think getting a notification icon was worth the trade of not having unemployment problems, but that's just my preference. As you say, an icon to show you have scavengers on a planet would have been a better solution. But it's not a hard thing to mod, they left the job code in the files, just commented it out.

 

[EvilKnievel82]

Hiveminds are strong in basic resource production but come midgame hiveminds lack the strongest asset in the game currently: the ecumenopolis.

Alloys are the single most important resource and hiveminds cannot produce it as efficiently:
- No ecumenopolis (except conquered),
- Less productive specialists due to lower stability,
- No access to the ministry of production (+15%) (or is there a hive mind equvalent? Wiki does not have this building yet)

Also the lack of trade becomes quite an important aspect mid-lategame that compensates a lot of the basic resource production difference.

 

[Siri]

Yeah, I just don't think getting a notification icon was worth the trade of not having unemployment problems, but that's just my preference. As you say, an icon to show you have scavengers on a planet would have been a better solution. But it's not a hard thing to mod, they left the job code in the files, just commented it out.

I think having scavenging drones in itself is a problem though so I rather be rid of them as soon as possible, which means I want to find out as soon as I have them so I can either build something for them or resettle them to somewhere useful if the planet is just full. To me that is absolutely worth the very minor hit to minerals in the very late game when everything is full.

 

[westamastaflash]

I played a pacifist with inward perfection on regular difficulty and had nearly 1/3 the galaxy full of my stations. If you increase the difficulty level you'll get less free territory since AI will expand into it faster. Or just add additional AIs.

 

[hellatze]

Hiveminds are strong in basic resource production but come midgame hiveminds lack the strongest asset in the game currently: the ecumenopolis.

Alloys are the single most important resource and hiveminds cannot produce it as efficiently:
- No ecumenopolis (except conquered),
- Less productive specialists due to lower stability,
- No access to the ministry of production (+15%) (or is there a hive mind equvalent? Wiki does not have this building yet)

Also the lack of trade becomes quite an important aspect mid-lategame that compensates a lot of the basic resource production difference.

That why i use mod.

Alloy really hard to get.

 

[Madzai]

So... They didn't implement nerfs to hive minds like not maintains jobs on Capital buildings in 2.2.2?

 

[Astax]

Hiveminds are strong in basic resource production but come midgame hiveminds lack the strongest asset in the game currently: the ecumenopolis.

Alloys are the single most important resource and hiveminds cannot produce it as efficiently:
- No ecumenopolis (except conquered),
- Less productive specialists due to lower stability,
- No access to the ministry of production (+15%) (or is there a hive mind equvalent? Wiki does not have this building yet)

Also the lack of trade becomes quite an important aspect mid-lategame that compensates a lot of the basic resource production difference.

Hivemind need endgame forges that turn food into alloys

 

[hellatze]

At least jobless hivemind didnt revolt.


I hope.