Hitlers plans for Europe ???

[unmerged(1463)]

I have heard that Hitler had a plan on how Europe would be after the war (if he won offcause). What i have heard is this.
Scandinavia would be somewhat independent, but under Swedish leadership, the Scandinavian nations was ruled by Sweden. What was more in his plans ?
and is there anywhere on the web to read about it ?
Sinceriyl
Mikael

 

[unmerged(6219)]

Under swedih control...noooo... Finland I would say, as Finland was their ally.

 

[unmerged(1463)]

Nope that information i have confirmed

 

[Emperor of Europe]

Hm, that's highly speculative isn't it? Germany conquered Denmark and Norway and had Finland as an ally. If these nations should come under Swedish rule, it could only happen in one of two ways:

1. The Germans could simply "hand over" Denmark and Norway to the Swedes, and turn their troops in Finland against the Finns. Assuming they won, they could have given Finland to Sweden. That kinda raises a few questions though:

- why would Sweden accept it?
- why would Sweden keep the 3 countries occupied?
- why the hell would the Germans do it?


2. The Germans could also start a war against Sweden and Finland. Assuming they won, they could have made some sort of Region Skandinavien ruled out of Stockholm. Such a region would not be independent, and it would not be Swedish - it would just be governed from the Swedish capital. That's it. What the rationale is supposed to be eludes me.

I'm sure Hitler had quite a few high-flying plans, but plans are one thing - reality is something entirely else. A Scandinavia under Swedish leadership would require an alliance between Sweden and Germany, and a Swedish willingness to be an aggressor. IMHO that's a flight of fantasy, even quite a few Swedes in high positions flirted with nazism just as they did in every other country.

Regards,

EoE

 

[unmerged(589)]

From what I know I don't think there would be any even somewhat independent states in Northern Europe (except Germany of course!). But since the Dutch, Danes, Norwegians and Swedes as racially acceptable would be invited to join the German ruling race in their 'great' project they wouldn't physically be in jeopardy (except their Jews, handicapped, homosexuals, non-Nazis etc of course). There would probably be some administrative entity in Scandinavia but anything other than the German iron fist would be pointless, why should Hitler settle for less than total power?

The Finns are somewhat problematic, I don't know what Hitler thought of their future. AFAIK he saw them as a pretty strong warrior race but they sure as hell aren't Germanic. My guess is that they would be allowed to live on in their peripheric country, ruled by Germany of course.

The Mediterranean was considered the Lebensraum of Italy so I don't know if Hitler had any real plans for the details of Southern Europe. But since Italy was a junior partner if ever there was one Germany would call the shots there as well.

 

[unmerged(1463)]

Well now you come to realism.
The GROSS GERMANIA plans was not realistic as well.
What i want to know was how Hitler wanted Europe to be, and i have read somewhere that Sweden where to have that perticular position, one reason was that they where arian, never waged war against Germany. And furthermore Sweden was in high regards in germany.

 

[w_mullender]

As I always thought it was not Hitlers intention to conquer the "germanic" states, but create a permanent peace treaty with them. Hitler thought that England and Sweden would oblige (he had much reason to think that after Munich). His lebensraum would be eastern europe.

 

[unmerged(592)]

what would happen to the suiss? There's a german part after all. Dissolution?

 

[Emperor of Europe]

Originally posted by SoleSurvivor
what would happen to the suiss? There's a german part after all. Dissolution?

Dunno. There's actually a thick mother of a German book called: "Aufmarch gegen die Schweiz". I guess you'll find an answer in there somewhere around page 900 or so.

Regards,

EoE

 

[Mariani]

Interesting question. I always wondered what Hitler's intentions for Italy and the Meditteranean were...certainly, the local denizens were antithetical to the "Aryan ideal" in their appearance.

 

[Agelastus]

Originally posted by Mariani
Interesting question. I always wondered what Hitler's intentions for Italy and the Meditteranean were...certainly, the local denizens were antithetical to the "Aryan ideal" in their appearance.

Italy was an ally though-Hitler personally liked Mussolini. The Greeks were actually accorded a measure of respect by Hitler, since he regarded them as the descendants of the ancient Greeks, whom he admired in many respects (despite the massive Slavic influence on the modern Greek racial mix.) The Croats were set up as a puppet state, so I guess they were going to end up on the approved list as well.

As for Denmark and Norway-as far as I know they were areas that were slated for eventual incorporation into the Reich (in the long term at least) as was Holland and areas of eastern France.

 

[unmerged(6196)]

Originally posted by Mariani
Interesting question. I always wondered what Hitler's intentions for Italy and the Meditteranean were...certainly, the local denizens were antithetical to the "Aryan ideal" in their appearance.

This is still a dark area for researchers...but concerning Portugal (it's interesting that, even though Portugal has no mediterranean coast, it's always listed as a mediterranean country) and Spain, Nazi Germany expected they would be cooperative powers (after all, Portugal and Spain were ruled by semi-fascist authoritarian regimes), during and after WWII. You see, "Latins" were the "race" Hitler respected the most, after the so-called "Aryans"...

As for invasions or military actions of some sort, Portugal was never seen as a military target (but I can't say the same about diplomatic/intelligence activities). Nonetheless, it seems that Hitler intended to invade Spain, after Spain hadn't been that cooperative with his plans to invade Gibraltar...but misguided intelligence reports discouraged him from invading Spain.

The embarassing fact is that Spain and Portugal's governments were very glad to cooperate with Hitler...Nazi Germany and Portugal got on extremely well in particular Other forummers perhaps know better than me, but I believe that Portugal was one of the main outlets for the values (gold, movable goods...) the Nazis took away from the Jews.

 

[unmerged(234)]

Originally posted by Mensageiro
...Other forummers perhaps know better than me, but I believe that Portugal was one of the main outlets for the values (gold, movable goods...) the Nazis took away from the Jews.

Yes, but so was all four European states wich stayed out of the War.

 

[unmerged(592)]

Didn't Portugal join the allies? Or was this WWI ?

 

[unmerged(5333)]

Re : Hitler's Europe.

Hello,

Bad luck Michael.

Hitler defined his territorial plans for Europe in :

1. The "Sonthofener Rede" (The Speech in ...) in the year
1937 - 1 9 3 7;
2. The "Graduation Speech for the Class '38" on the 25th of
January 1939 - 1 9 3 9 (Class = Offiziersjahrgang);
3. A MAP, made by him between the 1st and 20th January 1942;
20/01/1942 : beginning of the "Wannsee-Konferenz".

What would have been his "Grossgermanische Reich Deutscher
Nation" ?

1. "Der staehlerne Kern" - the core of steel :
1. Deutschtland + annexed and "German" :
2. Oestenreich;
3. Sudetenland;
4. Memelland;
5. Eupen und Malmedy (eastern provinces, German speaking,
of Belgium;
6. Belgien mit Flandern und Wallonien;
7. Luxemburg;
8. Elsass-Lothringen;
9. Nord- ind Ostfrankreich;
10. Jugoslawien (on his chart an entity;
11. Griechenland mit Kreta;
12. Krim ('Gotenland');
13. Prot. Boehmen- un Maehren - Bohemia and Moravia
14. Reichsgau Danzig-Westpreussen - the north of Poland;
15. Reichsgau Wartheland - the west of Poland;
16. Generalgouvernement.

2. Ausdehnung des Reiches + expansion and "NOT German" :
1. Reichskommissariat Ostland, including Lettland, Estland,
Lituauen;
2. Reichskommissariat Moskau - border : Ural;
3. Reichskommissariat Ukraine - border : Kazachtstan;
4. Reichskommissariat Kaukasus - border : Turkey and
Iran.
This would have been Greater Germany. The other nations :

3. Independent (?) : Slovakia;

4. The Netherlands : "independent" and "germanized".

5. France, Norway and Denmark : "independent but ruled"
by Germany;

6. "Satellitenstaten" : Hungary, Rumenia, Bulgary, Finnland;

7. No longer independent nations : Sweden, Spain, Portugal and
'Swissair';

8. Privilege states : The UK (? + Gibraltar and Malta),
Ireland, Italy.

What's the real meaning of 3-8 ? There is no explication by
"Der Adolf".

You find this map in : Der Zweite Weltkrieg by Jacobsen and
Dollinger.

Predator I.

 

[unmerged(1463)]

Are you certain ?
I know that the Schweden Referent had that vision, that i spoke of,
I know Speer had that vision, but apperntly not the fúhrer . can you scan that map you spoke of and send ?

 

[unmerged(5333)]

Re : Mikael XII.

Hello Mikael XII,

Absolutely sure.

Other sources for the authenticity :

1. Hitler's speech of the 8 of May 1943 for the : "Reichs- und
Gauleitern";
2. Himmler, evil himself, refers to that solution + map, in
his 'Denkschrift ueber die Behaendlung der "Fremdvoelkischen
im Osten" '.
3. Scanning will be impossible :
a. because of the paper used;
b. the books, 3 , were printed in 1963.

Predator I.

 

[unmerged(4253)]

plans

check out the historical atlas of WW2! It has an excelent map and analisis of hitlers post WW2 plans.

 

[unmerged(511)]

Links to the historical atlas???

 

[unmerged(4253)]

links

I don't have any. It's a book. It is titled "Harper Collins Atlas of the second world war"