Heretics

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Yes, I get most of my historical knowledge from this time period from M: TW

I thought Peter of Aragon fought the heretics Fighting a papal sanctioned crusade? Isn't that excommunication material?

Hmm. Now that I think about it Aragon would be a fun realm to play. I mean, a dynasty in that area of course

mediteranean domination is so beautiful.

OK. Prestige is sort of the respect people have for your dynasty and piety is the religious determination I am guessing...

Fighting heathens is a healthy pasttime for any christian ruler but it seems to NOT be without its risks!

 

[Havard]

Originally posted by jaron
Yes, I get most of my historical knowledge from this time period from M: TW

You shouldn't rely on M:TW for historical details . Swashbuckling battles yes, historicity no

I thought Peter of Aragon fought the heretics Fighting a papal sanctioned crusade? Isn't that excommunication material?

Kinda ironic... Peter the Catholic, from being one of the heroes at the defeat of the muslims as Las Navas dos Tolosa to being killed in a battle agains Crusaders the following year...

Hmm. Now that I think about it Aragon would be a fun realm to play. I mean, a dynasty in that area of course

mediteranean domination is so beautiful.

Agaron would indeed be interresting. In addition to the Spanish Reconquista there si the struggle with France over the Occitanian land

 

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lol. Doesn't the game say the Albigenians are an offshoot of the Cathars or something..?

Other than M: TW I get a lot of historical info from EU2


What does Occitanian land refer to?

and on the subject of heretics, could having heretic members of your dynasty ( whether controllable or assigned a la vice and virtues in M: TW) bring about the total downfall of your dynasty?

Whatever dynasty ruled in Toulouse lost their power through the Cathar heresy. I've read the region remained pretty autonomous after it was absorbed into the french crown, though I am unsure who was ruling it. Maybe the counts just lost their independence.

But the question has been made 'game over - how?'. I think being a heretic in the eyes of your peers and having your lands seized would be as good a reason as any to say sorry - try again next time!

 

[Havard]

Originally posted by jaron
lol. Doesn't the game say the Albigenians are an offshoot of the Cathars or something..?

Yep. I got quite a laugh of that one (Bernard of Clairvaux as a military commander was quite good too )

What does Occitanian land refer to?

The Languedoc.

and on the subject of heretics, could having heretic members of your dynasty ( whether controllable or assigned a la vice and virtues in M: TW) bring about the total downfall of your dynasty?

Whatever dynasty ruled in Toulouse lost their power through the Cathar heresy. I've read the region remained pretty autonomous after it was absorbed into the french crown, though I am unsure who was ruling it. Maybe the counts just lost their independence.

The end of the conflict came with the peace where Raymond VII of Toulouse had to agree on the marriage of his only child, his daughter Joan, to Alphonse of Poitiers, the brother of the French king.

But the question has been made 'game over - how?'. I think being a heretic in the eyes of your peers and having your lands seized would be as good a reason as any to say sorry - try again next time!

The matter of how game ends is not fully clear to us yet...

 

[Vandelay]

The matter of how game ends is not fully clear to us yet...

10, 000 Mongols lay waste to your demesne, raze your castle, and turn you into a eunuch and as your new duty you´ll have the pleasure of escorting your female family members and former wife to the bedchamber of the Khan?

Too bad you can´t play the Mongols

/Vandelay

 

[Norgesvenn]

Originally posted by Vandelay


10, 000 Mongols lay waste to your demesne, raze your castle, and turn you into a eunuch and as your new duty you´ll have the pleasure of escorting your female family members and former wife to the bedchamber of the Khan?

Too bad you can´t play the Mongols

/Vandelay

Sounds a bit like having the taxman around, really...

I suppose playing as a heretic will in many ways be against game mechanics. Your goal is to amass prestige for your dynasty. Being a Cathar or adherent to gnostic thought won't help that, I suppose (and hope!).

Still, I hope the heresies will be included as global events, and that their success/failure isn't hardcoded.

 

[Eochaid]

Maybe could one chose to be a heretic and try to get the Church to recognise their point of view as valid. I don't think it would be interesting to play a heretic in order to fight for your faith and then have it recognised!

For example the dynasty of the Counts of Toulouse could have enough power and influence to get an Occitan cardinal elected pope and thus start to work for Cathares to be seen as rightful sons of the Church.

 

[Alexandre]

Originally posted by Aetius
I think the concept of a heretic is a bit difficult to apply in all cases, some "heretics" simply wanted to change the church some followed a separate religion. Parts of Franciscan order was at one point heretical to the pope but not to the HRE. I suppose you should be able to be heretical in that fashion. Being a member of a non-catholic, non-orthodox christianity is trickier.

It would be nice if the system supported a "heretical" version of all religions though

I'd also like to see a special status upgrade for a heresy that takes control of one of the major patriarchates: Rome, Constantinople, Antioch, Jerusalem and Alexandria.

Alexandre

 

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I have a good technigue to make a heretic king, the offical religious King, I raise a army of loyal true believers, and march on rome.

 

[Eochaid]

And what about the Inquistion? THAT would be a nice (dangerous?) toy for a cunning King.... Could the Pope unleash hell on any vassal that does not show proper respect. I know that in the beginning the inquisition didn't have the aura it had later with Torquemada, nor the power, but it would still be fun

 

[Norgesvenn]

If you read "The Name of The Rose", the inquisitors seem to carry enough respect and authority to inspire fear in any former and current heretic.

 

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Hmmm....

..... when it comes to historical background I get a feeling that Medieval is a hasty work to get the product out the door. The feel from the Shogun are long gone. Also when it comes to the tactical battles, it has lost some of it's light and innovation. Even though I have only played the early times yet, I get a feeling that introduction to technology only creates a lot of routining troops in the field.
The concept is great, but I don't think we will see any more "great" surprises come out after this.........