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Padre Pio

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I keep reading about how awesome and unforgettable this family is for a CK2 gameplay. Having just bought Legacy of Rome, I'd like to try them as my very first v1.07 game. Mind you, I've never played any one-province count before so I don't really know what specific strategies--if there are--that I need to follow to have a very successful and rewarding gameplay experience. I almost always play as a Duke or a King. Additionally, it seems to me that this dynasty is in the worst possible spot to be in, i.e., sandwiched between war-freak muslims in the south and catholic fanatics in the north with no emperor or king to protect you from harm and ward off, or at least, soften the blows. :sad:

Any tips?
 

OrdepNM

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Haven't actually gotten around to play Spartenos, but I believe your best bet is to become a vassal of the bizantine empire and slowly try to clay away at the De Hauteville's.

When playing a count, it really helps to have good intrigue btw.
 

NezzeOne

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Fabricate claims on Capua and form the Duchy of Capua. Swear fealty to Byzantium, claw your way up the power tree via inheritance and war against your Norman Catholic neighbors.
 

unmerged(159054)

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You could swear fealty to the ERE to gain protection from the muslims and normans. I usually save up some money to buy a mercenary force and opportunistically grab land from the other counts and dukes in the area when they are already involved in other wars. Capua is usually your first priority, but also the small muslim counts in sicily make for easy conquests, especially if the bigger muslim nations are busy in a war or something and don't have time to help defend against any holy wars. Also becoming a vassal of the ERE helps a lot because you can call in some larger dukes in greece to fight for you if you manage to get some alliances with them.
 

Yenzen

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One way to get ahead is marrying the niece (Rocca) of the starting duke, swearing fealty and then saving up for mercs while doing your best to put a child on the ducal seat followed by pressing her claim. The success of this largely depends on Sicily not being created.

Otherwise, swearing to Genoa is a pretty safe move since they have a decent starting army and can thus protect you, yet when the time comes, they are quite easy to break free from. (Just inherit a duchy or hit them hard and fast)

Always remember to take the lone muslim counts in Sicily when you have decent protection, they may take a while to become productive, but they are a very wise investment.
 

HabemusZlatan

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Hoard money
Inherit Capua
Hire mercs
Destroy Shiite counties in Sicily
Swear fealty to Byzantium
Become Despot of Sicily
Conquer Africa
Break Free/Become the Emperor

Easier said than done though.
 

Satyros

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Can't really say how easy is with this patch , haven't tried it yet , previously it was not even CLOSE to Nubia .

I have actually conquered Italy WITHOUT any help from the Byzantine Emperor ( or allegiance ) , and boy did he hate me for that .
 

unmerged(445219)

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I play Sergios quite differently than what is suggested, separate from the Byzantine empire at first. The main goal of this playstyle is to become a Greek Catholic powerhouse and eventually extend the ERE.

Starting moves:
1) Fabricate on Salerno. When you get this claim, go for Catanzaro (part of the Duke's demense, you want to weaken him so he is in constant civil war. Also is part of a 2 county duchy). Capua isn't worth fabricating on, as you can duchy-claim them.
2) Educate your son by a Catholic when he is born.
3) Your main goal at the start is to try to get the other barony in your county. It will double your strength. If you started out with a good enough arrest chance, go for that. If not, save about 110 gold for mercs and wait for step 4 to occur.
4) Look out for the heathens in Sicily joining any wars. If they join in the defense of someone, you can easily strike with mercs and take one of them out without intervention. Use your gold for mercs to take as many of them out before they can react. REMEMBER that the owner of Palermo is Shia, while the 1 county heretics are Sunni. They will call different allies and will not help each other out.
OR if Palermo attacks one of the smaller guys, make sure to war them as well and get to the siege first. With a ship, you will be able to get there first if you are watching carefully.


Mid game:
1) Keep pecking at Apulia whenever possible. Claim priority is the Duke's primary land until he has just 1 county and then your Greek land.
2) Form the Kingdom of Sicily ASAP. Once you take over the muslims in Sicily and press your two ducal claims, all you need is a single county to form it (Salerno, if you fabricated).
3) For marriages, focus on Croatia.
4) Plan your invasion of Africa carefully. They are segmented and are very easy to take over. What you have to be careful about is Mauretenia helping out. Offense is the best defense here, launch a massive campaign and don't stop until they are all subjugated.
5) Keep expanding until the first crusade is called. This is the reason for being Catholic. When it starts up, spend all of your money on mercs and head to Egypt, not Jerusalem. siege everything, especially the Caliph's personal land. Stay near the water for quick escape when the doomstacks come. The caliph will usually be busy doomstacking the catholics in Jerusalem though, so you will eventually destroy his reinforcements. As soon as you are King of Jerusalem, swear fealty to the Byzantines. Stay Catholic for the future crusades, though. You will have "recently conquered" on quite a large amount of your lands which is where the byzantines come in handy. Once you start getting troops from your African and Holy land holdings, you can choose whichever direction to expand.
 
Last edited:

Iron Chariots

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I haven't played them yet specifically, but one good first move when starting small in general is to immediately banish any vassals. You'll get a small pile of gold to start out with because you need to get started as quickly as possible. You can autogenerate new vassals who will be blissfully ignorant of your tyrannical ways. The new vassals will be broke, however, so they won't be as able to upgrade their holdings, you may have to get them started later.
 

whosthebestcop

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I've played them before 1.06 and under 1.07. After 1.06 you have to worry about Genoa and Venice more sometimes then the Muslims since you are a coastal county they get automatic CB's on you and can raise 10x the mercs you can. Before that Republic CB's you really didn't have to worry about that.

My move after 1.07 was to swear Fealty to the Papacy convert to Catholic and convert heir to Italian. You can go independent a lot sooner then if you swear to ERE or HRE. I didn't even need a faction I just declared war on the Papacy for Independence when I could form the Kingdom of Sicily.

Got Capua because of the Duke de jure claim then went after Sicily via Holy War. Sent my chancellor to fabricate on Apulia right away to get the Duchy claim. Then since the Duke of Apulia actually had 3 Duke titles what you want to do is get an invasion CB on Apulia from the Pope. Take over every county capital and instead of just winning Apulia you will win all de facto Apulia which includes all of their dukedoms. Then you have 100% of the land to create Sicily.

I declared Independence from the Papacy while he was on a crusade. Once you conquer Rome you basically have enough warscore to win. And the Pope is too busy in the Holy Land to send troops to squash you. Win Independence form Kingdom of Sicily.

Then work on creating Kingdom of Italy. I inherited the Duchy of Verona and a decade later all of the HRE's Italian vassals revolted. So you can invite claimants who have De jure Duchy claims give them a barony or county then declare war on the rebellious Italian realms.

I didn't actually have any Dukes in de jure Kingdom of Sicily so when I created the title Kingdom of Italy I was able to destroy the kingdom of Sicily title with no penalty.

Important things you want to convert to Catholic and Italians. Once you swear to the Papacy you can just use a decision to convert to Catholic. And another decision to convert to liege's culture sometimes the Pope is Italian and you are set. If the Pope is Frankish you just want to get an Italian to educate you heir. Or I guess you could just use the ruler creator.
 

Ravenous.BE

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Hoard money
Inherit Capua
Hire mercs
Destroy Shiite counties in Sicily
Swear fealty to Byzantium
Become Despot of Sicily
Conquer Africa
Break Free/Become the Emperor

Easier said than done though.

Not really. I did that in 1.05 I think. Was one hell of a game but I managed to get on top and even become Emperor.

Was an awesome game.. Should try again in 1.07.
 

AndreasPhokas

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interesting strats but it seems like going italian and catholic is the easy way out <.<
 

generalolaf

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No need to go Italian, just go Catholic and swear fealty to Apulia. Work up to the kingship/take back Muslim Sicily from there (lots of 1-prov counts!) and then convert back to Orthodox if you want.
 

Viljainen

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Going for Catholic and Italian doesn't really play Spartenos much. What's the point of starting as a Greek Orthodox count if you just want to become like the other counts in Italy?
 

Satyros

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Going for Catholic and Italian doesn't really play Spartenos much. What's the point of starting as a Greek Orthodox count if you just want to become like the other counts in Italy?

This .

I don't know how are things today with the latest patch , but I'd say that I wouldn't even like becoming a vassal of the Byzantine throne , unless it was a thematic/role playing choice on the way of acquiring the crown of the empire .
 

grancheater

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Playing as the Spartenos right now, did pretty much what was already said: Fealty to the Byzantines, fabricated claims on the small catholic counties. Couldn't holy war muslims because of their allies coming in to ruin the fun, so I joined in on Byzantine Holy Wars (arrived first so I controlled the siege, ended war ASAP) until I could create the Kingdom, grabbed all of de jure Sicily though de jure claims, installed a claimant on the Byz throne and was emperor by the fourth character.

Independence might be tricky because you're not dealing with other kingdoms: Your territorial rivals are the HRE and jihading muslims, which can manage quite a lot of troops.
 

Sleight of Hand

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What about playing as Salerno? The Lombards rock (even if they're Italians in vanilla) but they only have one province, and are destined to fall to Apulia.

Any tips? I'd love to play a game as them, making sure to give all my children Lombard names. :cool:
 

Padre Pio

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Gracias for the tips guys, but no, turning Catholic and Italian is not an option. Surviving--even thriving--as the sole Greek and Orthodox dynasty in a land overran by Italian Catholics and Maghreb Muslims is what makes a Spartenos game very unique and rewarding, IMHO.

And here's what happened in my game:



I found out early on that I would be able to create the Dukedom of Capua without the need to invade the province of Capua itself. The only requirement is that I need to be bankrupt. So I saved up enough money (took me years) and increased my prestige (through hunting, feast, etc) a bit more.

First thing I did however, was to swear fealty to the Byzantime Empire and find myself a blue-blooded wife. So I married a Komnenoi (I think she was the 4th daughter of the Paphlagonian duke) whose family line had a weak claim to the Byzantine throne. My first marriage proposal was denied because I was just a lowly count then and I guess the old man (my future father-in-law) didnt think of me as worthy of her daughter's vagina yet. When I was finally invested as the Duke of Capua (bankrupting me in the process), I tried proposing again; this time to her 4th daughter because the 3rd one whom I originally proposed to was already married. The old man accepted.

For the next ten years or so, life was a humdrum affair. Investing myself as the Duke of Capua bled my treasury dry so I remained a one-county duke with no capabilty to start a war, much less upgrade my province. I did manage to fabricate claims on Capua and all of the Sicilian lands. And a claim on the prince-bishopric of Rome was also accidentally stumbled upon by my Spymaster while he was cleaning the castle's stable. (I was so poor then that he had to double as a stable boy.) By this time I haven't discovered the Faction button yet (I'm blaming the noobishness of my cat which was curled up snugly on my lap as I play the game) but when I did, I was surprised to find out that I could start a faction to install my dearly beloved wife to the Byzantine throne. Which I did, just for the lulz.

So I sent an ultimatum to the Emperor telling him to sod off and let my wife take his place. Naturally, he declined and immediately proceeded to raising levies from the entire empire, presumably to erase my offensive existence. But there were rumors from the grapevine that the Emperor just wanted me captured so he could cut my balls off and have it displayed in a glass jar. At that point, my chance of survival depended on one thing only, i.e. rallying support from the other dukes. So I sent out call to arms messages to all dukes of the realm, in the off chance that two or three of them share my suicidal tendency.

More than half of the realm dukes signed up for the mass suicide. But it was the other way around.

Two and a half years later, we all watched with glee as the former Emperor killed himself by not dodging the arrows we shot at him. He was tied to a post in the middle of the Coliseum. He was all skin and bones, no teeth and with a scraggly beard now reaching to his stomach--not surprising since he had been in prison for more than a few years already. My mother Theodora, the new Empress, even joined in on the fun, letting fly a single arrow that pierced the emperor's balls. She said she was aiming for the head. To which I asked, 'Which head, mother?' And my mother replied, after giving me one of those famous impish smiles of hers, 'I always aim for the small head first first before the big one.'
 

unmerged(596990)

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Let me start by saying I am new to CK2 so still trying to understand all the nuances and strats. I just finished as Spartenos and got completely blind-sided by Genoa. I had Capua in my sights - now had an heir, good vassal relations, good income - but they sent an army of 1700+ to take Capua. It was only a matter of time before they moved south, which they did. Game over.

It never occurred to me to swear fealty or convert to Catholicism or anything else like that. n00b :)
 

Ravenous.BE

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Having ruled as Spartenos, I can only advise you to pledge allegiance to Byzantion early on for the protection from Capua. But break free early on..

But I haven't played in Italy since 1.05 so I don't know how much it changed.