HELP : Personal Union breaks, war goal is to take a province - what do I do?

[Xiathorn]

Hi all,

I won the HYW after literally hours of restarting. I've had France under me now for about 40 years. For some reason, the Personal Union broke - despite me having positive relations and high prestige. I assume that this is an independence war, but the wargoal is to take a province.

I have defeated France (barely, with the help of Austria), but I don't have the option to reinforce the union? It looks like a normal war. If I white peace, will the union return to how it was? I don't want to just test it, as it's Ironman and I'd be furious if I selected 'white peace' and it didn't restore the union.

Please help - I can't continue my game until I know!

Xiathorn

 

[herrhals]

Go to the war screen, and in the top part of the screen, it will show you what kind of war it is. Did France declare war directly on you? Most likely it is an independence war. As long as you don't lose, then you will be ok. I think even a white-peace counts as your victory. I would wait until someone else can confirm my statement.

 

[Xiathorn]

The type of war is Reconquest, which is why I'm utterly confused. France did directly declare war on me, and that was the only information I got about the break in the PU.

 

[ChildeR]

Did your ruler die? IIRC, if they dislike you enough when he does you don't even need negative prestige for the PU to end.

 

[Xiathorn]

They were at +200. My ruler died *after* the war started.

 

[ChildeR]

If it's a reconquest war then the PU must have broken before it was started. Sure you didn't lose a war that could have broken it either?

 

[Xiathorn]

Definitely sure. I just checked my CBs though - I have one to restore the union. I guess they must have declared the instant the PU broke, and I'm remembering my ruler's death incorrectly.

Thanks guys - looks like I'm going to have to cripple them, then trucebreak. CB will expire too soon otherwise.

 

[atwix]

Definitely sure. I just checked my CBs though - I have one to restore the union. I guess they must have declared the instant the PU broke, and I'm remembering my ruler's death incorrectly.

Thanks guys - looks like I'm going to have to cripple them, then trucebreak. CB will expire too soon otherwise.

Pretender rebels maybe?

Anyways, look at your popup settings. If a union breaks, you should set it to get a pop up.

Likely a pretender stack held ile de france 2 years without you noticing. You can set a popup for your PU subject events, you should be able to see when they get a pretender event.

 

[herrhals]

Try and post a screenshot, if you haven't played any further, then we can try and figure out what is up.

 

[Arizal]

I wouldn't like to hijack this thread, but my question is very close to the OP's one, I think.

I have a PU with a country stronger than me (which is also France, actually), and i would like to keep it. If I read correctly the wiki, are they saying that you have to have 200 relations at all times or the country will try to revolt? And I suppose even if it is virtually at +300, can they still insult me to death?

 

[RobRoy3]

The type of war is Reconquest, which is why I'm utterly confused. France did directly declare war on me, and that was the only information I got about the break in the PU.

Sorry. You're screwed.

I've been doing a bunch of run-throughs with England, and this happened to me. Not sure why they're allowed to use the reconquest CB, but they can. Winning doesn't restore your PU.

For next time, you can try to remove some of the cores when you do the PU, but you can't afford all of them, if you do the PU.

Not sure it's a 1.8 bug or an old one. Guessing it's new and guessing it has something to do with removing the ability to annex the whole thing after winning a liberation war. But won't swear it isn't an old bug; I tend to play England only when a new patch comes out and I usually quit when/if I succeed in taking France apart.

 

[atwix]

Sorry. You're screwed.

I've been doing a bunch of run-throughs with England, and this happened to me. Not sure why they're allowed to use the reconquest CB, but they can. Winning doesn't restore your PU.

For next time, you can try to remove some of the cores when you do the PU, but you can't afford all of them, if you do the PU.

Not sure it's a 1.8 bug or an old one. Guessing it's new and guessing it has something to do with removing the ability to annex the whole thing after winning a liberation war. But won't swear it isn't an old bug; I tend to play England only when a new patch comes out and I usually quit when/if I succeed in taking France apart.

It still worked in 1.7.3.

 

[atwix]

I wouldn't like to hijack this thread, but my question is very close to the OP's one, I think.

I have a PU with a country stronger than me (which is also France, actually), and i would like to keep it. If I read correctly the wiki, are they saying that you have to have 200 relations at all times or the country will try to revolt? And I suppose even if it is virtually at +300, can they still insult me to death?

If they are at +200 relation they likely won't revolt. Not sure if they won't EVER, but you can never be sure i guess.

I Always tricked France to declare independance, and then fully occupied them and then fully annexed them, only to release them as a vassal right after. They won't rebel after that.

And if you say it doesn't work in 1.8, please prove it. I almost got to post patch screenshots of it working each patch (after trying it out in console), because people forget to occupy one colony of them.

Guess i'll prove it again, i'll try out now with console commands.

 

[RobRoy3]

And if you say it doesn't work in 1.8, please prove it.

Doesn't work for me in 1.8.

Not sure what kind of "proof" you want or need. You should be able to verify via console, for yourself.

 

[atwix]

i did, thanks.

At least i help the op now, i can CONFIRM it is a bug.

A country that is in a personal Union, can use their vassal reconquest CB to circumnavigate declaring independance. I'll post in Bug forum.

So, OP, its a bug

Proof:



and here is what happens if i declare reconquest:

 

[atwix]

Doesn't work for me in 1.8.

Not sure what kind of "proof" you want or need. You should be able to verify via console, for yourself.

i did, i can confirm they finally fixed this.



France won't accept full annex even when you have complete victory.

 

[RobRoy3]

At least i help the op now, i can CONFIRM it is a bug.

A country that is in a personal Union, can use their vassal reconquest CB to circumnavigate declaring independance. I'll post in Bug forum.

So, OP, its a bug

No. You can CONFIRM that your observations jibe with those of others who previously CONFIRMED the observations/suspicions of the OP. Though I suspect it is a bug, whether it is a bug or whether it is working as designed is not something you can CONFIRM, at this point.

 

[atwix]

Point taken At least the bug is reported now in bug forum.

 

[Arizal]

So even at 200+ they could declare independance. Well, I will live with the incertitude, but the "trick" that would be vassalising them would never work for me, since I'm too weak and had this union per chance. I'm not England.

 

[RobRoy3]

So even at 200+ they could declare independance.

Unclear. In the examples I've seen, the Lesser in the Union has had access to another CB (reconquest, in this case). If they don't have access to that CB, it is possible that they would behave as in prior patches (though I suppose it's also possible they might be able to engage in even a no-CB war). If they behave as they did in previous patches, I've never had anyone with +200 relations declare a liberation war. But I'm not sure that higher relations was ever sufficient deterrent, if they are significantly stronger than you.

Staying at war IS a sufficient deterrent. And if France is your lapdog, you might not stay significantly weaker for long...