Help me understand indoctrination

[Celulthor]

In my experience indoctrination happens either in a quick sequence of ethics shift events or not at all. Is this a case of observation bias or just a bad RNG being bad. What is the MTTH for ethics shift events? Are there other hidden factors/bugs that occasionally prevent indoctrination?

 

[Archael90]

strategic post, because im also looking for some hints

 

[Foefaller]

Looking at the files, it looks like Indoctrination relies on the Ethics Attraction mechanics that shifts your own pops ethics.

Normally, primitives don't have Ethics attraction, but when you set to Indoctrinate, you activate the mechanic in regards to your ethics and actually just give their civilization a massive ethics pull to those ethics (factor of 20 if you are fanatic. For relevance, the normal factor for your pops as a fanatic yourself is 3) plus increasing the speed in which their pops drift by a factor of 3. Once one of their shifts to that ethic, within 12 months you get an event that triggers their shift change as a civ.

Also looks like Indoctrination can't shift their ethics to fanatic, only to regular ethics. So if you are F. Materialist and they shift to Materialist, you can stop because that's as far as they will go. EDIT: Looks like I read the event wrong; With 1 pop, it will drift to normal, when 2 or more pops are that ethic, it will drift to Fanatic, even if you yourself are not fanatic

Also looks like (and I'll be reporting this in the bug forums shortly) You cannot reliably drift primitive pops to Egalitarian unless you are Xenophile, because the Factor modifiers check for Xenophile, not Egalitarian (it can still happen, it just will be veeery slow compared to your other ethics)

 

[Celulthor]

Thank you! I just knew there had to be something wrong. In my current game the primitives that wouldn't get Indoctrinated are Egalitarian/F.Xenophobes, me being F.Materialist/Pacifist. So if I really wanted to enlighten them, I should embrace Xenophile ethics, which is just way too much trouble.

Can space age primitives turn into an actual FTL empire by themselves, if they are inside your borders?

 

[Niro Namir]

Thank you! I just knew there had to be something wrong. In my current game the primitives that wouldn't get Indoctrinated are Egalitarian/F.Xenophobes, me being F.Materialist/Pacifist. So if I really wanted to enlighten them, I should embrace Xenophile ethics, which is just way too much trouble.

Can space age primitives turn into an actual FTL empire by themselves, if they are inside your borders?

Yes they can, and they will take control of that System.

 

[Secret Master]

Yes they can, and they will take control of that System.

They asked for control of the system the last time it happened to me.

I told them no, and they ended up getting annexed by my DA empire since I still controlled the starbase. So, they got assimilated. (This might not be WAD.)

 

[Niro Namir]

They asked for control of the system the last time it happened to me.

I told them no, and they ended up getting annexed by my DA empire since I still controlled the starbase. So, they got assimilated. (This might not be WAD.)

Huh, I remember one such empire taking my fully develpoed planet once this way… but of course, that was several patches ago, I usually covert infiltrate them

 

[Astax]

I wish you got bonus unity from doing indoctrination missions