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In short, situation is this: I want to lose my primary empire title to a member of my family not from my dynasty so that I could start over with my heir elsewhere as a small tribal county. For that purpose, my firstborn son is from another dynasty to make him have primary succession right (failsafe precaution since I anticipated election method not working). But this for some reason doesn't work. He just doesn't appear anywhere in election. Some grand something from another dynasty appears so wrong dynasty electives are definitely possible but not those that make the most sense and title relevance for some reason. I don't think that anywhere in Scandinavian Elective rules there is reason for excluding him, it just says member of extended family. And in fact it specifically says "and any available claimants" and my firstborn son claim is the truest.
In short, situation is this: I want to lose my primary empire title to a member of my family not from my dynasty so that I could start over with my heir elsewhere as a small tribal county. For that purpose, my firstborn son is from another dynasty to make him have primary succession right (failsafe precaution since I anticipated election method not working). But this for some reason doesn't work. He just doesn't appear anywhere in election. Some grand something from another dynasty appears so wrong dynasty electives are definitely possible but not those that make the most sense and title relevance for some reason. I don't think that anywhere in Scandinavian Elective rules there is reason for excluding him, it just says member of extended family. And in fact it specifically says "and any available claimants" and my firstborn son claim is the truest.
Hmm, there are a lot of candidates, true. But many of them are his half-brothers that were born in-dynasty later and are much younger. He is just straight up excluded from vote and simply does not appear there.
I want to lose my primary empire title to a member of my family not from my dynasty so that I could start over with my heir elsewhere as a small tribal county
Are you doing an achievement run? Because if not, the easiest way to switch who you’re playing as is to switch characters via the menu or console. You can also use the console to give the correct county to your preferred character and switch over to them immediately.
Are you doing an achievement run? Because if not, the easiest way to switch who you’re playing as is to switch characters via the menu or console. You can also use the console to give the correct county to your preferred character and switch over to them immediately.
No, I don't play iron man at all and don't care for achievements. But I don't like to bypass game rules and restrictions with external tools too much.
Also, that game is finished more or less and it was a while ago. I marked it down to better understand the system however and perhaps learn something for the future play through. It simply made me scratch my head, by all accounts it should work.
So going through the files it seems your son meets all the requirements for being a claimant, except potential the claimant part. My best guess is that characters with implicit claims are not included in the list of claimants of a title and so your son was never checked for this metric.
As for the second way to be included, extended family, I can't help but notice that your family has had some incest. This is probably why they were excluded from this metric (feudal_elective_potential_landless_dynastic_candidate_trigger). Essentially to exclude grandchildren whose parents are valid player candidates, it excludes all family members who's parents meet the parent_for_elective_succession_trigger (basically the ruler's child that is eligible to be elected). But for family members in realms that allow incest (or who are the child of incest), probably due to the messy family trees, it instead just applies the check parent_for_elective_succession_trigger to the family member in question in attempt to just add the ruler's children at least. Problem is that check also has a dynasty check in it. So it excludes your son. A fix, though maybe incomplete, would be for the devs to add all the ruler's eligible children (and probably also siblings) to the candidate list (without a dynasty check) and then add more extended family the way they currently do.
Code:
feudal_elective_potential_landless_dynastic_candidate_trigger = {
save_temporary_scope_as = potential_candidate
#Either the candidate is in the realm, or is landless, or the title is independent, or the realm of the title does NOT have protected inheritance.
OR = {
any_liege_or_above = {
this = scope:holder
}
is_ruler = no
scope:holder = { is_independent_ruler = yes }
scope:holder = {
exists = liege
NOT = {
any_liege_or_above = {
has_realm_law_flag = titles_cannot_leave_realm_on_succession
NOR = {
this = scope:potential_candidate
target_is_vassal_or_below = scope:potential_candidate
}
}
}
}
}
NOT = { #Landless characters should not be heirs to Theocracies/Republics.
any_heir_title = {
exists = holder
holder = {
has_unelectable_government_trigger = yes
}
}
}
OR = { #If the title controls the faith, candidates must be of the same faith.
scope:holder = {
NAND = {
exists = faith.religious_head
this = scope:holder.faith.religious_head #TODO_CD:It might need to be changed to check only for the title rather than the holder. (controlled_faith = scope:holder.faith)
}
}
faith = scope:holder.faith
}
#Grandkid block
trigger_if = {
limit = {
NOR = {
#Check to see that you're not the product of incest
AND = {
exists = mother
exists = father
mother = {
relation_with_character_is_incestuous_in_my_or_lieges_faith_trigger = { CHARACTER = prev.father }
}
}
#Let's make the incredibly bold assumption that if incest is completely allowed we'll just default to check the child instead of parents
scope:holder.faith = {
has_doctrine_parameter = consanguinity_unrestricted_incest
}
}
}
# We don't want grandkids to show as candidates if their parent is eligable and still alive
NOR = {
AND = {
exists = mother
mother = {
is_alive = yes
parent_for_elective_succession_trigger = yes
}
}
AND = {
exists = father
father = {
is_alive = yes
parent_for_elective_succession_trigger = yes
}
}
}
}
#if incest is allowed, check if you're the child of the holder since you can be both their kid and grandkid at the same time...
trigger_else_if = {
limit = {
OR = {
AND = {
exists = mother
mother = {
is_alive = yes
}
}
AND = {
exists = father
father = {
is_alive = yes
}
}
}
}
parent_for_elective_succession_trigger = yes
}
trigger_else = {
#Your parents are dead and you're eligible for title inheritance. Congrats.
}
has_unelectable_trait_trigger = no
has_unelectable_government_trigger = no
}
Code:
parent_for_elective_succession_trigger = { #This trigger is used to prevent grandchildren from being selectable when their parent is still available as a candidate.
NOT = { this = scope:holder } #Not the current ruler.
dynasty = scope:holder.dynasty
is_child_of = scope:holder
OR = {
is_female = no
scope:title = {
NOT = { has_title_law = male_only_law }
}
}
OR = {
is_female = yes
scope:title = {
NOT = { has_title_law = female_only_law }
}
}
OR = { #Candidate should not be a landless Courtier that is about to inherit a Theocracy or Republic
AND = {
is_ruler = yes
is_landed = yes
has_unelectable_government_trigger = no
}
NOT = {
any_heir_title = {
exists = holder
holder = {
has_unelectable_government_trigger = yes
}
}
}
}
OR = { #If the title controls the faith, candidates must be of the same faith.
scope:holder = {
NAND = {
exists = faith.religious_head
this = faith.religious_head #TODO_CD:It might need to be changed to check only for the title rather than the holder. (controlled_faith = cope:title.holder.faith)
}
}
faith = scope:holder.faith
}
has_unelectable_trait_trigger = no
has_unelectable_government_trigger = no
}
TL;DR: I don't think the devs foresaw the edge case of an incestuous realm wanting to elect a non-dynasty member.
I assumed that was the case as well. I wanted to see how much incest you needed to go through to get natural pure blooded. Only to be completely discouraged when I actually learned how hard it is.
A fix, though maybe incomplete, would be for the devs to add all the ruler's eligible children (and probably also siblings) to the candidate list (without a dynasty check) and then add more extended family the way they currently do.
