HEAVY METAL ON IT'S WAY!

[Prussian Havoc]

Yes, but that's still over the top. You don't need big #s to make a measurable impact.

That’s just it, Jordan and FASA were going for more than “a measurable impact.”

The Clans were meant to represent an existential threat to the Inner Sphere.

Jordan puts it best in a gameasutra article, “‘Of course, the result was not a resplendent Rime, but a technological and sociological decline into the dark ages, setting up the opportunity for the Mongols to invade,’ Weisman explains. He adds that people who know the history of Rome will see parallels to BattleTech touchstones like the Noble Houses of the Inner Sphere and the Clan Invasion.”

It took Clan Tech to set the stage for the numerically inferior Clans to offer the combined might of the Inner Sphere the manner of existential threat Jordan and FASA were going for. Of course that existential thread was doomed to failure... at least in the 3050-era. : )

 

[Jade_Rook]

I recall the quote as well. I have not played TT, but as I recall:
IS ML: 5 damage, 1 ton
IS LL: 9 damage, 5 tons
Clan ER Medium Laser: 8 or 9 damage, 1 ton, range comparable to the Large Laser...and matched with double-strength heat sinks

So, for example, the Nova is walking around with the firepower of 6-7 IS large lasers -- assault mech firepower -- with much better cooling, speed, and maneuverability, all at 50 tons.

The clans have better engines, better weapons, better cooling, bigger payloads, and more armor. There's basically no area of tech in which they aren't superior to the IS.

I am concerned by how powerful the ++ gear is... I think a ++ laser at +5 damage would still be meaningful - these +50% damage bonuses feel/seem over the top to me, and don't reflect the stagnant tech base of the setting. +stab weapons, even more so.

IS ML: 5 damage, 1 ton
IS LL: 8 damage, 5 tons
Cland ER ML: 7 damage, 1 ton and the range of an IS LL

The Nova mounts 12 Clan ER Medium lasers on a 50 ton mech. Granted, it can only fire about 6 without major heat issues, but that is still effectively 6 large lasers.

I thought it was the Hbs q&a where Randall was a guest. Because Randall spoke on it too.

Was CGL in on one of the interviews as well? I thought they had someone from CGL talking about how they probably shouldn't have made all of the Clan stats better. They could have improved just one or two aspects on each weapon and it would have been noticeable, but acceptable. Instead they have some weapons where they improved practically every stat and people screamed about it being OP. *cough*pulse lasers*cough, cough*

 

[Kereminde]

Was CGL in on one of the interviews as well? I thought they had someone from CGL talking about how they probably shouldn't have made all of the Clan stats better. They could have improved just one or two aspects on each weapon and it would have been noticeable, but acceptable. Instead they have some weapons where they improved practically every stat and people screamed about it being OP. *cough*pulse lasers*cough, cough*

"Randall" is Randall Bills, who is one of the big names in CGL.

 

[xtfoster]

... a Wolf’s Dragoons mini-Campaign.

Correct me if I am wrong, but it isn't a Wolf's Dragoons mini-campaign, but more likely a Black Widow Company (or more likely just a Natasha Kerensky (aka Lady Death)) vs. the Bounty Hunter mini-campaign, likely during one of their unsanctioned foraging expeditions to avoid the "Company Store Syndrome".

 

[Prussian Havoc]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it isn't a Wolf's Dragoons mini-campaign, but more likely a Black Widow Company (or more likely just a Natasha Kerensky (aka Lady Death)) vs. the Bounty Hunter mini-campaign, likely during one of their unsanctioned foraging expeditions to avoid the "Company Store Syndrome".

During last night’s HEAVY METAL Livestream, Mitch and Ryan mentioned that during the Endgame of the mini-Campaign (the 5-Skull Level) that we would be facing BOTH the Black Widow and The Bounty Hunter.

I took that to mean that the mini-campaign’s CAPSTONE Mission will be at least a three-sided/winner-takes-all affair, as I for the life of me I can’t see HBS crafting a story where the Widow and Hunter are working hand-in-Hans. :bow:

As to the whole Natasha Kerensky / Black Widow Company / Wolf’s Dragoons distinction... Natasha is an agent of Wolf’s Dragoons. Though Indo admit that Andrew is a fantastic storyteller and while that agency may be in place when we begin the mini-campaign, who knows what twists and turns Andrew May have planned for us! : )

 

[Havamal]

Was CGL in on one of the interviews as well? I thought they had someone from CGL talking about how...

Yes. Randall.

"Randall" is Randall Bills, who is one of the big names in CGL.

^
Thanks K'

 

[Gauntlet]

It took Clan Tech to set the stage for the numerically inferior Clans

PH, you keep saying this but it's not true.

The Clans were NOT numerically inferior. They just chose to be.

 

[Prussian Havoc]

PH, you keep saying this but it's not true.

The Clans were NOT numerically inferior. They just chose to be.

I disagree.

In 3049 the Clans had 38 worlds to draw their forces from. The Inner Sphere had over 2000 worlds to draw their forces from. The Inner Sphere clearly had a massive quantitative advantage in material and manpower. While the Clans had the qualitative advantages afforded to them by their Tech.

While the Clans effort was fractured along individual Clans boundaries, so too was the Inner Sphere fractured along Great House and Periphery Power lines. Over time, the Inner Sphere managed to set aside past grievances and feuds to better marshal their forces and take advantage of key Clan martial and cultural vulnerabilities.

What I believe you are taking about is the Clan process of Bidding in advance of a combat operation. This mainly occurred where the Clans had the advantage of LOCAL OVERMATCH, and does not abrogate the fact that the Clans force was numerically inferior overall.

Do you question this?

 

[Gauntlet]

I disagree.

In 3049 the Clans had 38 worlds to draw their forces from. The Inner Sphere had over 2000 worlds to draw their forces from. The Inner Sphere clearly had a massive quantitative advantage in material and manpower. While the Clans had the qualitative advantages afforded to them by their Tech.

While the Clans effort was fractured along individual Clans boundaries, so too was the Inner Sphere fractured along Great House and Periphery Power lines. Over time, the Inner Sphere managed to set aside past grievances and feuds to better marshal their forces and take advantage of key Clan martial and cultural vulnerabilities.

What I believe you are taking about is the Clan process of Bidding in advance of a combat operation. This mainly occurred where the Clans had the advantage of LOCAL OVERMATCH, and does not abrogate the fact that the Clans force was numerically inferior overall.

Do you question this?

Well, when put like that . . . no.

 

[Prussian Havoc]

Well, when put like that . . . no.

:bow:

I really like the narrative FASA and our earliest BattleTech fiction writers crafted around the CLAN INVASION through the Battle of Tukayyid.

And I readily acknowledge that this same narrative (specifically ClanTech) frustrated a significant portion of my fellow BattleTech gamers as “Quality vs Quantity” translated poorly on all too many BattleTech tabletops across our community.

But I am very excited for HBS to get the chance to craft their “take” on the CLAN INVASION. : )

Ah well, maybe someday. :bow:

 

[Gauntlet]

But I am very excited for HBS to get the chance to craft their “take” on the CLAN INVASION. : )

To be honest, I'm interested in this too.

 

[xtfoster]

...for the life of me I can’t see HBS crafting a story where the Widow and Hunter are working hand-in-Hans. :bow:

Depends on which Bounty Hunter...remember the actual person changed multiple times. They did work together on Benet III in 3027 so it isn't much of a stretch even if it was the same person. Also, following Benet III he? reportedly dropped from sight, so maybe that was one of the times the actual person changed.

 

[xtfoster]

In 3049 the Clans had 38 worlds to draw their forces from. The Inner Sphere had over 2000 worlds to draw their forces from. The Inner Sphere clearly had a massive quantitative advantage in material and manpower. While the Clans had the qualitative advantages afforded to them by their Tech.

Manpower: Definitely, and then only in numbers. The Clan Breeding and Training programs were definitely superior.
Material: Not necessarily. It has only been about 20 years since the Helm Core was recovered and decoded and the Inner Sphere industry was still extremely limited on what they could produce. Even in 3049 much was still LosTech, even 'basic' Mech components like fusion engines and gyros were very rare.

 

[Prussian Havoc]

Manpower: Definitely, and then only in numbers. The Clan Breeding and Training programs were definitely superior.
Material: Not necessarily. It has only been about 20 years since the Helm Core was recovered and decoded and the Inner Sphere industry was still extremely limited on what they could produce. Even in 3049 much was still LosTech, even 'basic' Mech components like fusion engines and gyros were very rare.

I’ll see your Clan Breeding and Training program, and raise you the Inner Sphere having the better Military Education System(s)... the Clans completely missed the boat when it came to the concept of Total War. RIP Clan Smoke Jaguar.

 

[PauloBrito]

About the tech - you get several conflicts about that.
If you see the dates of re-introducing the tech in IS and the Kerensky novels they say very different things.
If you put the Stackpole novels away, you get much of the tech available at the time / or even before the clans arrive.

 

[Kereminde]

RIP Clan Smoke Jaguar.

After Turtle Bay, I don't know if I can wish them peace beyond what they eventually got. Karma's a female dog, all right.

 

[MeiSooHaityu]

After Turtle Bay, I don't know if I can wish them peace beyond what they eventually got. Karma's a female dog, all right.

+1

As the Mechwarrior 3 narrator says..."By destroying Clan Smoke Jaguar, the Star League taught all the Clans the true horrors of war as it is practiced in the Inner Sphere...Elite, vat born, bred for battle, Clan forces were defeated by the common Freeborn hardened veterans of the Inner Sphere. They are the TRUE MechWarriors."

 

[stjobe]

the common Freeborn hardened veterans of the Inner Sphere. They are the TRUE MechWarriors.

Hear, hear.

 

[Mabberton]

About the tech - you get several conflicts about that.
If you see the dates of re-introducing the tech in IS and the Kerensky novels they say very different things.
If you put the Stackpole novels away, you get much of the tech available at the time / or even before the clans arrive.

The tech notes would suggest that much of the technology existed, but the implementation of that tech was spotty at best. Which makes sense, without an existential threat re-equipping your entire military force would be monumentally expensive to achieve. Some weapons and simpler tech might be able to be refit into existing and chassis, but implentation of XL engines, endosteel structure, and (to a lessor degree) ferrofibrous armor in a large scale probably requires building all-new mechs to be efficient.

Another "realish-world" question is reliability. In lore, the new/recovered tech was used is relatively small numbers during conflicts like the War of 3039, which were probably test-runs in a lot of cases. Until you knew that the tech was reliable, most nations would probably be hesitant about spending lots of time and money refitting their whole army with untested tech.

When the Clans arrived, the whole equation changed. It was now do-or-die, and any small chance was better than nothing. Not to mention benefits like the Wolf's Dragoons sharing tech specs and captured clan gear (eventually).

Mike

 

[Soulyss]

Hey... when are we actually going to be able to pay for this thing? I am surprised we can't place our pre-order yet. (I didn't buy the season-pass, it's a policy on a first time title / studio release... I'll clearly buy a round two if they offer it.)

My concern is that they may be struggling to hit their release date?