Heat banks - is there a reason to use them?

[Pherdnut]

I never understood them either. Why would I devote space/tonnage to more capacity when I could devote it to eliminating heat? They only weigh a ton per increment but at 2 spaces per 10/5 heat, they take a lot of space which is valuable on a build with enough weaponry to have a serious heat problem. Exchangers are nice for being biome-neutral but they're also great because they only take up one slot. I often use them at less heat-eliminated/ton than DHS simply because of the space efficiency. I tend to prefer lighter weapons in quantity though, so there's plenty of spare tonnage for exchangers and sinks.

I'm curious though. How would you use a bank to improve on this? Or wouldn't you unless it had a different loadout?

 

[Edmon]

That design is too heat neutral to benefit from a heatbank. You also have the luxury of both exchangers and a ton of rare double heatsinks.

Honestly, the Atlas is a "bad" mech for a high alpha / high heat design because it has very limited energy hardpoints.The two ballastic points are basically wasted and if you do use them, the autocannons eat a lot of tonnage and aren't that hot.

Unless you strip out the +3 Hit Defence Gyro, which I personnally wouldn't if I had one.

So that leaves you with 4 workable hardpoints for Energy and 2 for missiles.

It works best with something like a Stalker, Awesome or Battlemaster...

However, I would say, you could definitely take out double heat sinks here and put banks in and still be firing all weapons for a long time. Then use them on something else. I dunno about your campaigns, but I wouldn't put so much amazing gear into a single mech.

 

[Pherdnut]

My longest running game has a lot of good gear. I cheated for the exchanger ++ though. That thing was impossible to find before 1.3, The other exchangers and gyro +3s pop up somewhat regularly in stores if you check every system you pass through. And DHS is unlimited now since SLDF highlanders pop up in the black markets occasionally. I used to never put it in arms because it was to easy to lose to a crit.

I'll have to mess with the lower-weight assaults. I always found it hard to get what I wanted out of the battlemasters.

 

[Shake Appeal]

for me when i play battletech regardless of whether it is TT or video game i will run my meks right up to the threshold and even past that.

i never intentionally run it to a shutdown (though sometimes shteiner happens)

In Career, the only time I do this is if the mech has already suffered structure damage in some form, or I'm gambling on an immediate kill here sparing me more structure damage in future. Even a one-day repair of minor overheat damage is a nuisance in Career.

 

[GridLink]

In Career, the only time I do this is if the mech has already suffered structure damage in some form, or I'm gambling on an immediate kill here sparing me more structure damage in future. Even a one-day repair of minor overheat damage is a nuisance in Career.

There is also the last mission you plan to do on a planet. I've never seen a travel time of less than 10 days. So on that last mission you can run a bit more aggressively since you've got a buffer of days to handle repair so if it'll reduce the cost of repair by taking things out quicker it can be worth it. You can also use that to put on the hardest mission you plan to face last to give you maximum usage of your best mechs.

 

[newageofpower]

Far less likely? 15 heat points. I just don't see what difference that makes when a single medium laser uses 12 heat.

So, if you have a hot mech, you can fire a full alpha strike on the first round. Then, on the second round, you either turn off one medium laser or not, depending whether or not you're using a heat bank. If not, you can actually fire more in the rounds that follow.

Does getting that extra ML off on the second or third round matter that much when compared to the higher overall output with a heat sink, assuming the entire combat encounter lasts 5+ rounds?

The philosophy is like Investment. 500 damage NOW could be more important than 3000 damage over ten turns.

Let me quote myself from reddit (one bolded paragraph explains everything):

Heat bank lets your mech hold more heat before it starts melting or shutting down on you, which is great, because a shutdown mech loses it's turn and everyone gets to do called shots on it for free.

Heat banks good are if you have a huge amount of weapons that will likely kill anything standing next to you, but are impractical to cool down continuously (at least until we get DHS for engines as well).

For example, my SLDF Royal Griffin CQB build generates 89 heat whenever it alpha strikes, dealing out 418 damage every full salvo (which is amazing for a Medium carrying maximized frontal armor). I have spent 3 tons on heat management, and the rest on armor and mobility, because you need those things to get into CQB range.

If I used 3x DHS the Griffin would remove 48 heat a turn, and build up 41 a alpha. This means my mech would start melting after shooting everything twice, and shut down after shooting three times. Instead, I put on only 1x DHS and 2x heat banks. The mech only removes 36 heat a turn, and now builds up 54 heat per alpha. However, with 2 heat banks it has 130 overheat and 160 meltdown. Now the mech will not start melting until it has fired everything three times, and won't shut down until it has fired everything four times, which is how much ammo it has for the SRMs anyways!

Also, if smacking your opponents with 1600+ damage isn't enough, you need to bring more mechs, and probably at least 1 bigger mech.

-|-

TLDR use DHS on LRM carrier/long range fire machines, and heat banks on CQB machines. A mix of both for general purpose machines; enough DHS to cool your long range weapons (remember you get 30 cooling per turn 'free' on normal biomes) and heat banks to keep your mech from shutting down when you fire everything.

Unfortunately, heat bank++ seem to be almost as rare as thermal exchanger++... I have over twenty DHS, but only five ++ thermal banks and three ++ exchangers...

Note the Griffin build shown is an rather extreme design, but it demonstrates my point.

Burst damage gives you options.

 

[LemurFromTheId]

The philosophy is like Investment. 500 damage NOW could be more important than 3000 damage over ten turns.

Let me quote myself from reddit (one bolded paragraph explains everything):
Note the Griffin build shown is an rather extreme design, but it demonstrates my point.

Burst damage gives you options.

Thanks! That, I think, really was the most helpful answer so far, nothing beats a solid example.

And yeah, I certainly see the sense in using DHSs on LRM platforms and other sustained fire specialists and HBs on heavy hitters with massive spike damage.

--

In fact, thanks to everyone who's posted in this thread; it was never my intention to start an argument, but to gain some understanding on what is it about heat banks that makes them so highly valued by so many.

I'm still not entirely sure how I could make the best use of them with my particular playstyle, but seeing that almost everyone seems to agree that they're highly useful and valuable, I'm certainly going to give them a solid chance to prove their worth.

 

[Kereminde]

I see the benefit of having 'more heat on the scale' through Heat Banks basically in order to be able to cope with hot biomes having otherwise neutral builds steadily gather heat over time. It allows you to fire another turn in exchange for perhaps a small amount of heat dissipation (due to the penalties from the biome). If you're talking neutral biomes or cold biomes, I don't think the two odd "heat management toys" will be as useful unless you're way over-using your heat with those fancy lostech laser systems.

Or lots of PPCs . . .

 

[scJazz]

Thanks! That, I think, really was the most helpful answer so far, nothing beats a solid example.

And yeah, I certainly see the sense in using DHSs on LRM platforms and other sustained fire specialists and HBs on heavy hitters with massive spike damage.

--

In fact, thanks to everyone who's posted in this thread; it was never my intention to start an argument, but to gain some understanding on what is it about heat banks that makes them so highly valued by so many.

I'm still not entirely sure how I could make the best use of them with my particular playstyle, but seeing that almost everyone seems to agree that they're highly useful and valuable, I'm certainly going to give them a solid chance to prove their worth.

I'm really glad you asked the question frankly. I enjoyed reading the discussion!

 

[Jade_Rook]

It took me salvaging one, putting it on a Swayback, and trying a few missions with it to really appreciate the value in heat banks. Then that torso got blown off and I was sad.

The value in heat banks isn't immediately obvious, but they do have value.

 

[newageofpower]

Thanks! That, I think, really was the most helpful answer so far, nothing beats a solid example.

Also, 2MLas + 2SLas = 36 heat.

MY MACHINE IS HEAT NEUTRAL ONCE THE AMMO IS GONE!111

=D

 

[LemurFromTheId]

Also, 2MLas + 2SLas = 36 heat.

MY MACHINE IS HEAT NEUTRAL ONCE THE AMMO IS GONE!111

=D

...with the damage potential of a Spider...

Well, it punches a bit harder.