Hearts of Iron IV - 34th Development Diary - 20th of November 2015

[Cardus]

Not really. Catalonia fought both because ideological issues and self-government, but no independence was wanted.

BTW, without any option to split both sides in two countries, there is no possibility to recreate the Chinese Civil War.

I clearly said (at least I think that I was clear) that "Catalonia" wanted to gain "the independence (or at least greater autonomy)". It seems that we agree on the second but not on the first. Regarding that who had the real control of Catalonia was the Confederación Nacional del Trabajo-Federación Anarquista Ibérica which as you well know was anti-statist. As you well understand the issue of independence/greater autonomy, as well as the formal control of Catalan government, was to be settled after the war.

 

[Viden]

I clearly said (at least I think that I was clear) that "Catalonia" wanted to gain "the independence (or at least greater autonomy)". It seems that we agree on the second but not on the first. Regarding that who had the real control of Catalonia was the Confederación Nacional del Trabajo-Federación Anarquista Ibérica which as you well know was anti-statist. As you well understand the issue of independence/greater autonomy, as well as the formal control of Catalan government, was to be settled after the war.

First: The CNT never controlled Catalonia.
Second: They lost most of their influence in May 37.
Third: The closest thing to independence calls back then was the proclamation of the "Catalan Republic as member State of the Iberian Federation" in 1931 and the proclamation of the "Catalan State of the Spanish Federal Republic" in 1934.

 

[Cardus]

First: The CNT never controlled Catalonia.
Second: They lost most of their influence in May 37.
Third: The closest thing to independence calls back then was the proclamation of the "Catalan Republic as member State of the Iberian Federation" in 1931 and the proclamation of the "Catalan State of the Spanish Federal Republic" in 1934.

Maybe this can help

Revolutionary Catalonia (July 21, 1936 – 1939) was the part of Catalonia (a region in northeast Spain) controlled by the anarchist and socialist trade unions, parties, and militias during the Spanish Civil War. These included the Confederación Nacional del Trabajo (CNT, National Confederation of Labor) which was the dominant labor union at the time and the closely associated Federación Anarquista Ibérica (FAI, Iberian Anarchist Federation). The Unión General de Trabajadores (General Worker's Union), the POUM and the Unified Socialist Party of Catalonia (which included the Communist Party of Catalonia) were also involved. Although the Catalonian Generalitat was nominally in power, the trade unions were de facto in command of most of the economy and military forces.

During the Spanish coup of July 1936, anarchist and socialist militias, along with Republican forces including the Assault and Civil Guards, defeated the forces controlled by Nationalist army officers in Catalonia and parts of eastern Aragon. The Confederación Nacional del Trabajo-Federación Anarquista Ibérica now came to the forefront as the most powerful organization in Barcelona, seizing many arms and strategic buildings such as the telephone exchange and post offices. Through the various factory and transport committees, they dominated the economy of Catalonia.[2] In spite of their militant anti-statism, they decided not to overthrow the Catalan government

 

[msaaim89]

Scenario : As Germany, launch a successful coup in Switzerland. Swiss now on friendly terms and allow military access but decline joining in an alliance.

Will German forces, positioned in Switzerland, still be able to attack France from Swiss territory? Same question applies for reverse situation with France and Belgium.

 

[Thure]

Aye, that's fair for all of them except the Russian Civil War, sorry, I was getting confused and going for anything involving conflict within the state rather than between states (although, technically, a war within a state rather than between a state is a civil war, but you were right in terms of my intent ). In the Russian case, though, there was a civil war (whites vs reds) which some countries took advantage of to gain their independence (as far as I understand, I'm no expert). That was kind of the thing I was angling at - was there the potential for a civil war to lead to national minorities breaking away. I wouldn't have put it past Cuba to snatch independence in the SCW if it hadn't have already gained it - but that's all theorycrafting.

My main point, garbled as it was, was to suggest that if the UK, France, Belgium or the Netherlands had a civil war, were it happening 'IRL' (ie, alt-universe real life ), then there might be the possibility of some independence movements taking advantage of events, and if it was possible for HoI to cover this off at some stage it'd be nice (particularly in terms of laying foundations for longer timeline), but definitely not essential (particularly if it was a tonne of work).

But this were small seperate wars This is not how Civil Wars work ingame. They are between two parties who both want to controll the whole country.

The wars of independence could be part of a civil war... but they are not the civil war itself. The Russian civil war ingame would just be White vs Red. The independent wars have to be seperate wars.

 

[misterbean]

Scenario : As Germany, launch a successful coup in Switzerland. Swiss now on friendly terms and allow military access but decline joining in an alliance.

Will German forces, positioned in Switzerland, still be able to attack France from Swiss territory? Same question applies for reverse situation with France and Belgium.

In previous HOI games, you couldn't attack through military access, so I suspect you won't be able to do it now either.

 

[diegosimeone]

this looks awesome

 

[Nicolas I]

So more than half of Germany's population were sent to jail after the 1933 election?

I never said that. That's the best with intimidation under a totalitarian regime, you just have to torture, jail, kill the more resisting people to make the remainder obey.

Please don't post a BBC article this time. You should really pick up a history book.

I thought you already said in the past that history books are all propaganda against the poor good nazis.

The fact that the Allies did also make propaganda doesn't mean that nazi propaganda was true.

I have to say I'm rather amused by rabid anti-Nazi revisionists like yourself, who hold vile hatred of the National Socialists....

I don't understand how you can not find the National Socialists vile, unless you share their dubious vision of totalitarian psychopaths.

IYes because in reality the "dangerous" communists are poor victims of history, including communists in Cambodia, China and Soviet.

Never said the communists were victims. Maybe people who don't like the nazis are not all communists as the nazis wanted to categorize them to justify destroying all people resisting to them ?

The three exemples you give were are also totalitarian regimes, as the nazis. Oddly, you should admire them as their methods are quite similar.

 

[DukeFirewood]

Very interesting.
Will players be able to create the conditions for a civil war? For instance, I want to play as Britain and bring a communist regime into power.

 

[Kydax]

Very interesting.
Will players be able to create the conditions for a civil war? For instance, I want to play as Britain and bring a communist regime into power.

Yes.

. There is also 3 slots for Political Advisors. Every country has 1 communist revolutionary, 1 fascist demagogue & 1 democratic reformer that you can employ to mould your nation towards a desired ideology.

 

[Solfall]

When south Norway was occupied by the Germans, the men in charge of north Norway made an effective system and had public support for the war efforts. I understand this could be hard to work out, but I'd like to inform of the history. When the politicians of south Norway made their way up to north Norway, they made a mess out of everything when they took charge of the region.

 

[Cardus]

When south Norway was occupied by the Germans, the men in charge of north Norway made an effective system and had public support for the war efforts. I understand this could be hard to work out, but I'd like to inform of the history. When the politicians of south Norway made their way up to north Norway, they made a mess out of everything when they took charge of the region.

As you are from there in your opinion could have been possible to form a Scandinavian federation with Finland, Denmark, Norway and Sweden?

 

[Super-Soviet]

Time for a Very British Civil War.

 

[Mereneu]

Looks like it'll be great.

 

[Solfall]

As you are from there in your opinion could have been possible to form a Scandinavian federation with Finland, Denmark, Norway and Sweden?

I would like to say yes, but no. In the case of Norway, the politicians wanted to stay neutral at all costs. We also demilitarized a lot in the 30s, with the spirit of remaining neutral that way. The opposite of how we did it in the first WW. Sweden also wanted to remain neutral, even thought they willingly fed the German war machine. Perhaps under right wing prime ministers would the Scandinavian countries have sought to back each other up from the rising threats.
That gave me a thought. The war tension system could potentially do this under the right circumstances.

 

[Cardus]

I would like to say yes, but no. In the case of Norway, the politicians wanted to stay neutral at all costs. We also demilitarized a lot in the 30s, with the spirit of remaining neutral that way. The opposite of how we did it in the first WW. Sweden also wanted to remain neutral, even thought they willingly fed the German war machine. Perhaps under right wing prime ministers would the Scandinavian countries have sought to back each other up from the rising threats.
That gave me a thought. The war tension system could potentially do this under the right circumstances.

The idea is that as German I often wanted to "create" a strong partner/puppet but it should be plausible.

 

[Sharp163]

Another great dev diary so many awesome features! I love how even the scripted elements of the game are becoming more flexible. Keep up the great work guys!

I am however mildly concerned with a few things... Shouldn't the amount of area that the Greek communists control when the civil war breaks out be relative to the percent of the government they control? Or at least something along those lines

Secondly, those provinces are humongous I was shocked when I saw Spain. Are those actually regions, and the provinces can only be seen upon zooming in?

Thank you for reading this I'm psyched for the Germany dev diary!!

 

[FOARP]

Wait - so it looks from the Belgian picture in the DD that Germany could carry out a Communist or Democratic coup - is that right?

 

[Secret Master]

Wait - so it looks from the Belgian picture in the DD that Germany could carry out a Communist or Democratic coup - is that right?

The other options looked greyed out.

Placeholder in the interface? Surely they wouldn't let a fascist dictatorship sponsor Communists?

 

[Axe99]

But this were small seperate wars This is not how Civil Wars work ingame. They are between two parties who both want to controll the whole country.

The wars of independence could be part of a civil war... but they are not the civil war itself. The Russian civil war ingame would just be White vs Red. The independent wars have to be seperate wars.

Good call - so (if they made it into the game at some stage, and I'm not saying they should necessarily, although it could be good for alternative histories were the Allies lose) have independence wars as separate things that are likely to happen when the central state is weak (which is likely to be the case in a civil war). Good thinking, apologies for my rather rough as guts approach .