Harsh Treatment Or Autonomy For Dealing with Rebels and Absolutism

  • We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Adamgerd

Colonel
77 Badges
Jan 1, 2017
926
2
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • For the Motherland
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Prison Architect
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
If the aim is a WC then if I'm honest that is not a great shape for 1632. Your income is really low, especially production and trade income are low. It looks like you don't have any Trade Company land.

It would be quite possible to have eaten all or at least most of India by that date playing Ottos. Huge, huge money there.

You will need to rely to a large extent on mercs for a WC. Manpower is scarce, money can become functionally unlimited by the late game if you really focus on building your economy early and mid.
I have some trading company land in western India, and I don't really see whey everyone sees trading company land as so good. What's so special about it? The real thing which prevents me from expanding into India is Malwa, which has a 3 tech leap in military tech and combined with allies outnumbers me too. So I guess Ill try to improve my tech
 

Soulburger

Captain
27 Badges
Nov 26, 2012
434
796
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Surviving Mars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Sengoku
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
TC land is insanely OP. For territorial coring cost you get 0 LA land with full production and trade bonuses. Also I have to ask, what have you been spending MIL points on? No one should ever be down 3 to 5 tech levels.
 

ElGranCapitan

Captain
33 Badges
Jun 2, 2017
349
0
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
Trade companies make you A LOT of money and cost only 50% admin point because the are territorial cores with 0% autonomy, that's why they are so good

Sunni makes sense because you keep the Ottoman government that makes bad kings virtually impossible, you get to pick between 3 heir that mosts of the time have at least 1 stat of 5+.
If all heirs suck (like 0/1/5) disinherit, you'll get another 3 choices within a year or so

The Ottomans get so many mission claims in the beginning, and then you should have influence reducing your unjustified demands, making religion not really needed (because you also got tolerancce of heathens, which means you only need to convert heretics)

you are spending way too much on forts, not enough on army and advisors (should be using all +3 advisors especially if you're behind in tech). War taxes is a waste of military points, the only reason to use it is when you play a nation that has to almost go bankrupt in order to defeat a much superior enemy (or when it's free because of the age ability)
You worry way to much about money and not enough about ressources that actually matter like monarch points and manpower

You should use all mercenary infantry, all regular cannons
 

Vulkandrache

General
32 Badges
Oct 11, 2014
2.232
1.878
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Magicka
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Prison Architect
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
has a 3 tech leap in military tech
This is the real headscratcher in this thread.
The Ottomans cannot fall behind in Miltech, its impossible, yet you made it happen.

from expanding into India is Malwa
The screenshot you posted looked like something one might expect to see in 1532 not 1632.
The longer you wait the more united India becomes.

Out of all the european big players the Ottomans have the best position to take all of India while its still fractured.
By 1650 you can not only own all of India you should be running out of places to put manufacturies in
to the point where you go: "*uck it, ill do grain and fish too."

trading company land as so good. What's so special about it?
If you need someone to tell you that then you dont have the WC mindset.

should be using all +3 advisors especially if you're behind in tech
As the Ottomans especially you can run discounted 3/3/1 from Day1.
The real challange is expanding fast enough to spend it all.
 

SKOTy

Freak
79 Badges
Aug 21, 2012
1.172
222
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sengoku
  • Semper Fi
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Surviving Mars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
I suggest restart of the WC attempt with lessons learned, it will be less painful than trying to recover this run.
 

Adamgerd

Colonel
77 Badges
Jan 1, 2017
926
2
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • For the Motherland
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Prison Architect
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
This is the real headscratcher in this thread.
The Ottomans cannot fall behind in Miltech, its impossible, yet you made it happen.
So evidently it is possible then, somehow.

The screenshot you posted looked like something one might expect to see in 1532 not 1632.
The longer you wait the more united India becomes.
From latter experience, apparently yes

Out of all the european big players the Ottomans have the best position to take all of India while its still fractured.
By 1650 you can not only own all of India you should be running out of places to put manufacturies in
to the point where you go: "*uck it, ill do grain and fish too."
Wait, so the type of manufactory matters and youre supposed to own all of India by then


As the Ottomans especially you can run discounted 3/3/1 from Day1.
The real challange is expanding fast enough to spend it all.
From Day 1? I had to wait just to hire one lvl 1 advisor
 

Adamgerd

Colonel
77 Badges
Jan 1, 2017
926
2
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • For the Motherland
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Prison Architect
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
I suggest restart of the WC attempt with lessons learned, it will be less painful than trying to recover this run.
I spent too many hours, over 100hrs, playing and replaying times, If I fail, I at least want to see it to the end
 

TheMeInTeam

Field Marshal
54 Badges
Dec 27, 2013
30.279
18.955
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Prison Architect
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Magicka 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
Honestly, the elephant in the room is probably that your economy sucks

You are most likely fighting wars inefficiently and expand into the wrong direction, your bad economy makes you unable to use mercs and thus kills your manpower

Lagging military tech as the Ottomans is questionable too. Even focusing off it being ONE tech behind should be atypical. Efficient point usage, advisers, and economy are the places to start I'd guess.

You will need to rely to a large extent on mercs for a WC. Manpower is scarce, money can become functionally unlimited by the late game if you really focus on building your economy early and mid.

Mercs are important to WC runs, but so is managing manpower consumption. The more manpower you save, the more money you can use to invest in manufactories in upstream nodes + workshops and the easier it is to sustain early +3 advisers. I barely touched mercs after early Muscovy wars in GH run until I switched into revolutionary government. Mercs would have sped that up, but the important thing to work on for him is resource consumption. >3000 development by this point while barely if ever using mercs as Ottomans is a reasonable goal.

Efficient use of mercs would outperform that, but bad habits hurt merc-based military operations too. Losing too many resources/war will block WC runs even if the over-arching strategy is good.
 

Adamgerd

Colonel
77 Badges
Jan 1, 2017
926
2
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • For the Motherland
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Prison Architect
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
Lagging military tech as the Ottomans is questionable too. Even focusing off it being ONE tech behind should be atypical. Efficient point usage, advisers, and economy are the places to start I'd guess.
Did I mention I also lag on diplo and admin tech.



Mercs are important to WC runs, but so is managing manpower consumption. The more manpower you save, the more money you can use to invest in manufactories in upstream nodes + workshops and the easier it is to sustain early +3 advisers. I barely touched mercs after early Muscovy wars in GH run until I switched into revolutionary government. Mercs would have sped that up, but the important thing to work on for him is resource consumption. >3000 development by this point while barely if ever using mercs as Ottomans is a reasonable goal. Efficient use of mercs would outperform that, but bad habits hurt merc-based military operations too. Losing too many resources/war will block WC runs even if the over-arching strategy is good.
So I should buy manufactories (whatever they are) and in upstream nodes, what's an upstream trade node, the one trade flows from? Over 3000 development. That's twice as much. And so I should get resources (where are resources found?)
 

Adamgerd

Colonel
77 Badges
Jan 1, 2017
926
2
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • For the Motherland
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Prison Architect
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
Also, but don't Trade Companies have a massive malus to manpower, sailors and taxation (100%) in return for the trade power bonus? How does it outweigh the malus, you're gaining lots of trading, but losing lots of taxation and manpower.
 

TheMeInTeam

Field Marshal
54 Badges
Dec 27, 2013
30.279
18.955
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Prison Architect
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Magicka 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
I'm thinking you're best served starting with learning the mechanics before trying to learn to apply them. Trade goods have different values for example, and trade value increases as it jumps between nodes before ultimately being collected. Once you're more familiar with the mechanics, the upside of having 0% autonomy land with no penalty to goods produced or trade while completely ignoring your state limit for those provinces should be obvious. I get that it isn't while still learning, but this kind of knowledge is the place to start.

As for manpower consumption, at no point prior to your first war vs Mamluks should you ever be at 0 manpower as Ottomans. If you control very carefully in Mamluk war and go in with a tech lead, you might also take 100% from them without using mercs or hitting 0 manpower. These kinds of things are your aiming point for efficient expansion. If you want to WC and can't do them yet, I'd suggest practicing until you can. The ripple effects of more vs less resource consumption/war across a game are large.
 

Sfan

Field Marshal
61 Badges
Apr 13, 2016
5.231
4.446
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria: Revolutions
Ok so now that you provided a screenshot I can explain you what is wrong with your economy, and why it's a lot more complex than you think it is. I don't want to be rude, we've all been there, doing these small mistakes which add up until you fall utterly behind.

Your merchant placement is wrong: the one in Persia is absolutely useless. Persia only flows in Aleppo, so the money there is either collected in Persia or steered to Aleppo. You hold every province in Persia, so noone can collect. So by default all the money will be steered towards Aleppo and your merchant literally does nothing. Collect in Constantinople for +10% income.
What I called strategic conquest is conquering areas that will bring you something, either in term of expansion opportunities, AE management, income or blocking of someone else (and culture and religion to avoid revolts, especially at the beginning). Once you're at your state limit, development or trade goods only marginally matter. That's why India is SO important to conquer early on, it gives you the best unstated income of the world thanks to TC. I understand Malwa may be too big atm. But taking Hobyo and Kilwa seems relatively easy, they are probably behind in institutions so they should not be ahead of you in miltech. That gives you a TC, and a merchant, which you can use to transfer in Alexandria and get another 15 ducats from trade, and that opens a new front, Africa, in which you probably have 0 AE atm. Kilwa also usually has several thousands of gold to steal.
Your gold income is 0,5. This means Kosovo is probably not stated and not developped. This could very well have been 5 ducats since 150 years, that only seems like a small loss but that's almost 7500 in total! Think of all the manufactories you get from just thinking about this.
That brings me to my main point, economy is ALL about the snowball. Small gain allows to build one more building, which means more small gains until you drown in ducats. You say your economy is good because you make 50 ducats in peacetime. Sure, that's OK, that means a manufcatory every year, considering you also spend money on other things. But that should be so much more, which would mean even more, and more, and more, and that's quite easy to fix.
You have 13,66 state maintenance. That seems a lot to me, but maybe you don't have edicts at all. Check it, still.
You have 19 freakin fort maintenance. In peace time. As the Ottomans, you will probably literally never have to defend. Tear down every fort on day 1, and don't build any. Destroy every fort you conquer. Sure, that means some unit might sneak and start carpetsieging you ocasionnally, but that's so small compared with what you lose. 200 years of game, 10 ducats per month on average, literally almost 25000 ducats! Think of all the buildings that fuels, or the mercs that buys to save manpower and conquer faster, which allows to reach India earlier, before it's united, and then to have trade companies there earlier, and more merchants, and more income, and more mercs, and more conquest, and so on and so on. And that's why a ridiculously small mistake costs you so much in the end.
Army maintenance and fleet maintenance are maxed out in peacetime, with no revolts over 80%. Waste of money again.
You take attrition in peace time with no incoming revolt. Waste of manpower and of money. And so on and so on.

As for tech, I legit do NOT understand what happened with tech. But going coptic and losing the best government form of the game might explain it a bit. Some people will tell you coptic is better and that's probably true... but a lot harder. Play it safe! Sunni means Dhimmi in every heathen province so another 25000 ducats since you started or something like that. It means good rulers all the time, so a lot more monarch points.
With the pace of your expansion, you don't need Deus Vult, you need stability to focus on the basic economy and save up manpower, so why turn all your land into wrong religion because some redditer who onetags in 1700 told you that was better, that's not the same game you two are playing. Use dead tags (Syria, Iraq, Armenia, Transylvania, Persia if possible, ...) That saves AE on top of costing 0 dip to reconquer. Admin is a must have first, then Influence, and this synergizes perfectly with vassals. That gives you "unjustified demands", a godlike modifier that allows you to conquer more land for less dip even with conquest CB. Now that Deus Vult is last in Religious you can't have it before 1530. Absolutism unlocks in 1610, I'd make sure I have Humanist instead of Religious anyday. That's trading dip points (almost useless resource, as only dip 17 is a meaningful dip tech if you don't colonize) for manpower (you don't have it so that's good) and absolutism in the long term (godlike resource).
Another explanation might be institutions, but even by totally messing up I don't understand. When I start a game as the Ottomans I can have positive income even when I build mercs up to force limit with level 2 advisors, and this insane 6/6/5 ruler (but that's because I micro estates to squeeze every ducat). That brings you all the techs you could ever need, especially as you'll have over 50 PP once you annex Byzantium. You'll drown in MP by the time you can forcespawn Renaissance (with proper estate management once again to reduce dev cost).

All of the things I point are things that are not required for a WC, just required for a successful campaign, even if there is no shame in not knowing them. That's why I asked you if you were sure you wanted to do a WC in the first place.
Because on top of that, WC requires a lot more agressivity in the pace of your expansion, which requires yet other skills and complete understanding of coalitions, overextension and absolutism.

Maybe try to play a tall game to understand some mechanics, around Italy or Germany for instance. With 4-5 provinces it's a lot easier to see that it isn't "just putting merchants in trade nodes, where you have provinces, giving estates provinces if they have less than the required provinces and taking monarch points from estates every 20 years and building manufacturing/taxation buildings everywhere?"
And once again I do not say it to be rude even if that may be hard to have so many flaws pointed. And feel free to PM me for any detail or any generic question.
 

Adamgerd

Colonel
77 Badges
Jan 1, 2017
926
2
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • For the Motherland
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Prison Architect
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
I'm thinking you're best served starting with learning the mechanics before trying to learn to apply them. Trade goods have different values for example, and trade value increases as it jumps between nodes before ultimately being collected. Once you're more familiar with the mechanics, the upside of having 0% autonomy land with no penalty to goods produced or trade while completely ignoring your state limit for those provinces should be obvious. I get that it isn't while still learning, but this kind of knowledge is the place to start.
Ah, ok. I never really bothered learning trading, economy or manpower until now, not seeing them as useful and yeah, now I am starting to regret it

As for manpower consumption, at no point prior to your first war vs Mamluks should you ever be at 0 manpower as Ottomans. If you control very carefully in Mamluk war and go in with a tech lead, you might also take 100% from them without using mercs or hitting 0 manpower. These kinds of things are your aiming point for efficient expansion. If you want to WC and can't do them yet, I'd suggest practicing until you can. The ripple effects of more vs less resource consumption/war across a game are large.
I did not have 0 manpower till after the first war for clarification
 

Sfan

Field Marshal
61 Badges
Apr 13, 2016
5.231
4.446
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria: Revolutions
Another thing I forgot to mention is that doing a WC is hard, even as the Ottomans. The reason why so many people succeed with it is that most of us play the game since years and have thousands of hours of experience. There is really no shame in not doing it, you have time to improve. Keep it up and go step by step.
 

Adamgerd

Colonel
77 Badges
Jan 1, 2017
926
2
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • For the Motherland
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Prison Architect
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
Ok so now that you provided a screenshot I can explain you what is wrong with your economy, and why it's a lot more complex than you think it is. I don't want to be rude, we've all been there, doing these small mistakes which add up until you fall utterly behind.

Your merchant placement is wrong: the one in Persia is absolutely useless. Persia only flows in Aleppo, so the money there is either collected in Persia or steered to Aleppo. You hold every province in Persia, so noone can collect. So by default all the money will be steered towards Aleppo and your merchant literally does nothing. Collect in Constantinople for +10% income.
So I should not collect in places where I have all provinces?

What I called strategic conquest is conquering areas that will bring you something, either in term of expansion opportunities, AE management, income or blocking of someone else (and culture and religion to avoid revolts, especially at the beginning). Once you're at your state limit, development or trade goods only marginally matter. That's why India is SO important to conquer early on, it gives you the best unstated income of the world thanks to TC. I understand Malwa may be too big atm. But taking Hobyo and Kilwa seems relatively easy, they are probably behind in institutions so they should not be ahead of you in miltech. That gives you a TC, and a merchant, which you can use to transfer in Alexandria and get another 15 ducats from trade, and that opens a new front, Africa, in which you probably have 0 AE atm. Kilwa also usually has several thousands of gold to steal.
I do have AE in Africa from annexing Makuria, etc. and Kilwa and Hobyo are too strong, they're also ahead in military tech and combined outnumber me currently.

Your gold income is 0,5. This means Kosovo is probably not stated and not developped. This could very well have been 5 ducats since 150 years, that only seems like a small loss but that's almost 7500 in total! Think of all the manufactories you get from just thinking about this.
That brings me to my main point, economy is ALL about the snowball. Small gain allows to build one more building, which means more small gains until you drown in ducats. You say your economy is good because you make 50 ducats in peacetime. Sure, that's OK, that means a manufcatory every year, considering you also spend money on other things. But that should be so much more, which would mean even more, and more, and more, and that's quite easy to fix.
You have 13,66 state maintenance. That seems a lot to me, but maybe you don't have edicts at all. Check it, still.
You have 19 freakin fort maintenance. In peace time. As the Ottomans, you will probably literally never have to defend. Tear down every fort on day 1, and don't build any. Destroy every fort you conquer. Sure, that means some unit might sneak and start carpetsieging you ocasionnally, but that's so small compared with what you lose. 200 years of game, 10 ducats per month on average, literally almost 25000 ducats! Think of all the buildings that fuels, or the mercs that buys to save manpower and conquer faster, which allows to reach India earlier, before it's united, and then to have trade companies there earlier, and more merchants, and more income, and more mercs, and more conquest, and so on and so on. And that's why a ridiculously small mistake costs you so much in the end.
Army maintenance and fleet maintenance are maxed out in peacetime, with no revolts over 80%. Waste of money again.
You take attrition in peace time with no incoming revolt. Waste of manpower and of money. And so on and so on.
Well for me, it's lot, its the highest income I've ever accomplished in any play through and the first one where I have a positive income with advisors.
I did not develop Kosovo, because I am behind on tech and if I develop it, won't I get more behind in tech?
I think I do have the Autonomy Decrease edict in my states.
But if I did not have the forts, I'd have lost even more land to Genoa and Austria and due to lower tech, every fort helps in getting my army there from the opposite end.

As for tech, I legit do NOT understand what happened with tech. But going coptic and losing the best government form of the game might explain it a bit. Some people will tell you coptic is better and that's probably true... but a lot harder. Play it safe! Sunni means Dhimmi in every heathen province so another 25000 ducats since you started or something like that. It means good rulers all the time, so a lot more monarch points.
With the pace of your expansion, you don't need Deus Vult, you need stability to focus on the basic economy and save up manpower, so why turn all your land into wrong religion because some redditer who onetags in 1700 told you that was better, that's not the same game you two are playing. Use dead tags (Syria, Iraq, Armenia, Transylvania, Persia if possible, ...) That saves AE on top of costing 0 dip to reconquer. Admin is a must have first, then Influence, and this synergizes perfectly with vassals. That gives you "unjustified demands", a godlike modifier that allows you to conquer more land for less dip even with conquest CB. Now that Deus Vult is last in Religious you can't have it before 1530. Absolutism unlocks in 1610, I'd make sure I have Humanist instead of Religious anyday. That's trading dip points (almost useless resource, as only dip 17 is a meaningful dip tech if you don't colonize) for manpower (you don't have it so that's good) and absolutism in the long term (godlike resource).
Another explanation might be institutions, but even by totally messing up I don't understand. When I start a game as the Ottomans I can have positive income even when I build mercs up to force limit with level 2 advisors, and this insane 6/6/5 ruler (but that's because I micro estates to squeeze every ducat). That brings you all the techs you could ever need, especially as you'll have over 50 PP once you annex Byzantium. You'll drown in MP by the time you can forcespawn Renaissance (with proper estate management once again to reduce dev cost
Estates increase economy and decrease dev? And I did have the tech behind even before going coptic. Well I do have admin and influence as the first 2 idea groups (which I kind of regret, as they got me even further behind in tech). But don't you need diplo points for annexing vassals, and to not get further behind on the tech.

Forcespawn institution? You can forcespawn an institution? And what do you term "proper estate management"

All of the things I point are things that are not required for a WC, just required for a successful campaign, even if there is no shame in not knowing them. That's why I asked you if you were sure you wanted to do a WC in the first place.
Because on top of that, WC requires a lot more agressivity in the pace of your expansion, which requires yet other skills and complete understanding of coalitions, overextension and absolutism.
Well I managed successful campaigns even without all this knowledge, so it's not required for them, maybe just for WC.

Maybe try to play a tall game to understand some mechanics, around Italy or Germany for instance. With 4-5 provinces it's a lot easier to see that it isn't "just putting merchants in trade nodes, where you have provinces, giving estates provinces if they have less than the required provinces and taking monarch points from estates every 20 years and building manufacturing/taxation buildings everywhere?"
And once again I do not say it to be rude even if that may be hard to have so many flaws pointed. And feel free to PM me for any detail or any generic question.
Yeah, sometimes criticsm is necessary and even good in helping me in the future. And maybe I'll try a tall game. So far all my games were the opposite, created on conquest, playing mainly European non-colonial conquest powers, especially after my first and after that disaster, only game as castille, let's just say that did not end well at all
 

rinehime

Major
60 Badges
Jul 24, 2012
558
1
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
For reference, I'm currently attempting my first WC+One Faith as Ottomans and I think I'm doing well so far. I went Coptic (b/c it's trendy and ensures your vassals have CCR/+disc/MP recovery/Miss. strength). Playing the game of thrones is also nice. I'm not a power player, but I've played enough to understand the rules.

Here's where I stand in 1601 with 4877 dev. Vassals are (an over-fed) Afganistan & Marehan (released and fed from Ethiopia/Ajuran and about to start integrating), with PUs over Aragon and Castile (who integrated Naples), and I'm about to start a claim throne war over GB. I've been at 99% OE for the last 4-5 years, even with the 16 month core times from -55% CCR. You can't see it on the map, but I also own 2/3 of Sumatra.

coptoman_1601_diplo.png


Economy: (yeah, I'm spending too much on forts. I've kept some around for rebels/-devastation/recent wars and haven't micro-ed them into oblivion/mothball yet. I also picked up an extra colony from Portugal that I thought was a full state....)

coptoman_1601_econo.png


coptoman_1621_GP.png
 

ecrurudesby

Lt. General
38 Badges
Jul 31, 2014
1.697
1.155
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
You hold every province in Persia, so noone can collect. So by default all the money will be steered towards Aleppo and your merchant literally does nothing.
I didn't read your entire post but I just wanted to correct this.

The Merchant will increase the value of the trade between the nodes by 5%.

Also I'm pretty sure Russia owns the two northernmost provinces in the Persia node in that screenshot.
 

Adamgerd

Colonel
77 Badges
Jan 1, 2017
926
2
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Cities: Skylines - Campus
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • For the Motherland
  • Prison Architect: Psych Ward
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Prison Architect
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
For reference, I'm currently attempting my first WC+One Faith as Ottomans and I think I'm doing well so far. I went Coptic (b/c it's trendy and ensures your vassals have CCR/+disc/MP recovery/Miss. strength). Playing the game of thrones is also nice. I'm not a power player, but I've played enough to understand the rules.

Here's where I stand in 1601 with 4877 dev. Vassals are (an over-fed) Afganistan & Marehan (released and fed from Ethiopia/Ajuran and about to start integrating), with PUs over Aragon and Castile (who integrated Naples), and I'm about to start a claim throne war over GB. I've been at 99% OE for the last 4-5 years, even with the 16 month core times from -55% CCR. You can't see it on the map, but I also own 2/3 of Sumatra.

View attachment 309663

Economy: (yeah, I'm spending too much on forts. I've kept some around for rebels/-devastation/recent wars and haven't micro-ed them into oblivion/mothball yet. I also picked up an extra colony from Portugal that I thought was a full state....)

View attachment 309665

View attachment 309666
How did you manage to invade all this in that time frame? Were you continually at war?
 

Vulkandrache

General
32 Badges
Oct 11, 2014
2.232
1.878
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Magicka
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Prison Architect
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
How did you manage to invade all this in that time frame? Were you continually at war?
Thats what we have been telling you thus entire time.

That screenshot shows good progress as the Ottomans.
You look at this and are amazed, i look at it and see that he fed Afghanistan which has ICC.


All the stuff you have been writing about shows that you are missing understanding about basic mechanics of the game.
The Ottomans are insanely strong from Day1, but even they dont play themselves.


I spent too many hours, over 100hrs, playing and replaying times, If I fail, I at least want to see it to the end
Before i first played the Ottomans i had 800 hours in the game.
I restarted over 15 times just to see how far i could get in the first 30 years, because i was blown away by how strong they are compared to the countries i was usually playing.

So I should not collect in places where I have all provinces?
Learn how trade works, i suggest playing half a game as Portugal going around Africa.

I do have AE in Africa from annexing Makuria, etc. and Kilwa and Hobyo are too strong, they're also ahead in military tech and combined outnumber me currently.
You SHOULD have some AE "everywhere".
AE is a ressource. If you dont have any there is nothing to tick down, which is a waste.

And I did have the tech behind even before going coptic. Well I do have admin and influence as the first 2 idea groups (which I kind of regret, as they got me even further behind in tech).
What did you do with all those points that you got behind in tech?
Sure filling out an idea group sucks away some points for a while, but you did not expand enough for you to run out of points with the 5/5/6 Mehmet you start with.

But don't you need diplo points for annexing vassals, and to not get further behind on the tech.
Otherwise you would core the same land with Admin. Vassals are used to split coring between Admin and Dip.

Forcespawn institution? You can forcespawn an institution?
Do you have all the DLC?
If yes, then how do you not know that if you have the Ambition to WC?
Also, the Ottomans are easily close enough to central Europe to not have to Devpush anything.
Just having positive relations with Naples is enough for 99% of cases.

And what do you term "proper estate management"
Estates give you tons of benefits ontop of making high LA land usefull much sooner.
The halfcost Advisors are super strong early game and the other buttons become ever more usefull as the game progresses.
Well I managed successful campaigns even without all this knowledge, so it's not required for them, maybe just for WC.
A "successful campaign" can be alot of things.
EU4 is is neither hard nor complicated. But its complex and has many interlocking mechanics which, if used correctly, amplify each other to get retardedly strong results.

Yeah, sometimes criticsm is necessary and even good in helping me in the future. And maybe I'll try a tall game. So far all my games were the opposite, created on conquest, playing mainly European non-colonial conquest powers, especially after my first and after that disaster, only game as castille, let's just say that did not end well at all

Instead of trying to run around with the big dogs try starting in a quiter area of the world and set yourself a smaller goal.
Start somewhere in the middle of Africa and conquer it, that will force you to learn other mechanics.


Also, but don't Trade Companies have a massive malus to manpower, sailors and taxation (100%) in return for the trade power bonus? How does it outweigh the malus, you're gaining lots of trading, but losing lots of taxation and manpower.
You should learn what Local Autonomy (LA) really does and what a state limit is.
 

TheMeInTeam

Field Marshal
54 Badges
Dec 27, 2013
30.279
18.955
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Prison Architect
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Magicka 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
You look at this and are amazed, i look at it and see that he fed Afghanistan which has ICC.

Only as an ambition. It's a little dicey but if they're < 10 ideas taken or even ~14 and you feed them a bit --> annex you can almost always soak them before they get their ambition. I'd still pick someone else normally, unless this is diplovassal shenanigans.

Overall I agree with everything you're saying though.

Genoa can give a lot of institution spread too with positive relations, and they border a lot of stuff with respectable development via sea zone while typically being allied to Austria and a pain to destroy early. I didn't force any institution in my Ottoman run. Printing press was a bit slow. Iberia feeding me land free did make colonialism a little easier to grab though.