Harsh Treatment Or Autonomy For Dealing with Rebels and Absolutism

[Adamgerd]

Whats the optimal way to deal with rebels in the age of absolutism. I have an attempted Ottoman WC and after reading the absolutism thing, should I increase autonomy or harsh treatment as one decreases absolutism, while the other decreases military points (which I am already behind on). Or should I let them rebel and then crush them? Any advice is welcome

 

[Badesumofu]

Pick Humanist, lower autonomy everywhere once in Age of Absolutism. You don't want to be raising it if possible. Lowering it costs no mana and raises your absolutism fast.

I dare say there are other workable approaches but this is what I've found is most efficient. Potentially delay doing C&C until most of the +10 unrests have worn off.

 

[SolSys]

It depends on circumstances.
I don't like to waste points so if you don't have manpower issues, let them rebel and go for the kill.

Edit: NVM, you meant in general, not a singular case. Humanist would be more efficient in the long run.

 

[Adamgerd]

I have lots of manpower issues. My manpower is stuck at 0 for the last half century

 

[SolSys]

If it persists you would have to resort to autonomy increase.
Harsh treatment will only delay it for a short time.

 

[Adamgerd]

In that case you would need to resort to autonomy increase.
Harsh treatment will only delay it for a short time.

Ok.

 

[SolSys]

Also remember that stationed troops can reduce unrest in a province -- effectively, delaying the revolt.

 

[Adamgerd]

Also remember that stationed troops can reduce unrest in a province -- effectively, delaying the revolt.

Yeah, although they're never fully repaired and the endless attacks don't help (I am 3-5 techs behind everyone else in military tech) and so while the economic strength and numbers help in eventually defeating them, I lose massive manpower in doing so

 

[Sfan]

No manpower never happens in a WC, that's a much bigger issue than revolts. As the Ottomans you can have full infantry merc and still drown in money because you sit at the best position in the game to make insane money with that free route into India.

Humanist is a must have to WC, and excellent on the Ottomans anyway. They are a primechoice tag to WC without Religious between their missions and ideas, and the fact they're Sunni, and that they can easily stack unjustified demands. If you have Humanist and an advisor you should barely have any revolt so long as you don't go over 100% OE. You don't convert anything, do you? You should not, that's a waste of time with Ottomans NI and Humanist.

If you want to WC, the most important resource is admin efficiency, as it solves all your problems: Admin points, overextension, agressive expansion, truces (as you can get more land for 100% warscore wars). Therefore, if you find yourself at a point where you can't handle a revolt and don't have the monarch points to buy it down (which is really surprising, you're european so you're probably drowning in monarch points with these level 3 advisors and that PP), I want to say that it's a sign that something went wrong. The only scenario where you can raise autonomy after age of absolutism starts if if you're capped in absolutism already. Farm it with vassal integration and estates revolts. Spawn particularists and accept their demands to get started.


Edit: Wait WHAT? How are you behind in miltech? Don't tell me you got military ideas early on. I don't wanna seem patronizing but are you sure you should try to World Conquest?

 

[SolSys]

... I am 3-5 techs behind everyone else in military tech ...

Go into a stabilization period.
Don't get involved in new wars [unless really important] and prioritize mil tech over mil ideas.

Manpower takes 20 years to fully replenish so you may be able to start warring again in half that time.

 

[ElGranCapitan]

Honestly, the elephant in the room is probably that your economy sucks

You are most likely fighting wars inefficiently and expand into the wrong direction, your bad economy makes you unable to use mercs and thus kills your manpower

 

[Sfan]

If you really want to get a WC conquest going, feel free to MP me (I one tagged before last level of admin efficiency, in 1735 if I remember correctly). I don't want to be overly negative, but I think there are issues with the economy, especially the trade, the target prioritization, the idea groups and probably also the estates management, or else you could not have 0 manpower for 50 years and be behind in tech as the Ottomans. All of this can be solved, and EU4 has a very harsh learning curve, so with enough screenshots I could point your mistakes and help you to get over them for next time.

Doing a WC requires to master all the basics of EUIV, to be able to create a strong and stable empire by optimizing building, trade, estates and idea choices. And then there is another difficulty which is not to overextend and at the same time not to lose too much time, prioritize targets based on trade routes, alliances, future opportunities, religion and culture, dodge coalitions and play around truces and alliance webs. It seems you're still missing on the first part, at least to a certain extent.

 

[Adamgerd]

Honestly, the elephant in the room is probably that your economy sucks

You are most likely fighting wars inefficiently and expand into the wrong direction, your bad economy makes you unable to use mercs and thus kills your manpower

No manpower never happens in a WC, that's a much bigger issue than revolts. As the Ottomans you can have full infantry merc and still drown in money because you sit at the best position in the game to make insane money with that free route into India.

I do have a relatively strong economy (at war, + 64 gold per month), why does everyone assume my economy is weak. I am just hesitant to use mercenaries, because their maintenance is high when I have some regular infantry I can use.

Edit: And what route into India? The one currently held by Malwa, the country with the third largest military in the world after Russia and Ming

 

[Adamgerd]

Humanist is a must have to WC, and excellent on the Ottomans anyway. They are a primechoice tag to WC without Religious between their missions and ideas, and the fact they're Sunni, and that they can easily stack unjustified demands. If you have Humanist and an advisor you should barely have any revolt so long as you don't go over 100% OE. You don't convert anything, do you? You should not, that's a waste of time with Ottomans NI and Humanist.

Don't Convert? Humanist? Sunni? But what about the Deus Vuit CB? And doesn't coptic have good bonuses, especially since only a few countries are coptic?

If you want to WC, the most important resource is admin efficiency, as it solves all your problems: Admin points, overextension, agressive expansion, truces (as you can get more land for 100% warscore wars). Therefore, if you find yourself at a point where you can't handle a revolt and don't have the monarch points to buy it down (which is really surprising, you're european so you're probably drowning in monarch points with these level 3 advisors and that PP), I want to say that it's a sign that something went wrong. The only scenario where you can raise autonomy after age of absolutism starts if if you're capped in absolutism already. Farm it with vassal integration and estates revolts. Spawn particularists and accept their demands to get started.

And how do you increase admin efficiency? Tech?
Uh, I should be getting lvl 3 advisors in all? What about unbalanced research?

Edit: Wait WHAT? How are you behind in miltech? Don't tell me you got military ideas early on. I don't wanna seem patronizing but are you sure you should try to World Conquest?

No, I did not get mil ideas early on, it's my 4th idea, and where do you get all the PP from to not get behind tech?

 

[Adamgerd]

If you really want to get a WC conquest going, feel free to MP me (I one tagged before last level of admin efficiency, in 1735 if I remember correctly). I don't want to be overly negative, but I think there are issues with the economy, especially the trade, the target prioritization, the idea groups and probably also the estates management, or else you could not have 0 manpower for 50 years and be behind in tech as the Ottomans. All of this can be solved, and EU4 has a very harsh learning curve, so with enough screenshots I could point your mistakes and help you to get over them for next time.

Doing a WC requires to master all the basics of EUIV, to be able to create a strong and stable empire by optimizing building, trade, estates and idea choices. And then there is another difficulty which is not to overextend and at the same time not to lose too much time, prioritize targets based on trade routes, alliances, future opportunities, religion and culture, dodge coalitions and play around truces and alliance webs. It seems you're still missing on the first part, at least to a certain extent.

Optimizing trade, estates and buildings? You mean they can be optimized? Aren't they just putting merchants in trade nodes, where you have provinces, giving estates provinces if they have less than t he required provinces and taking monarch points from estates every 20 years and building manufacturing/taxation buildings everywhere?

 

[Badesumofu]

I do have a relatively strong economy (at war, + 64 gold per month), why does everyone assume my economy is weak. I am just hesitant to use mercenaries, because their maintenance is high when I have some regular infantry I can use.

So you have money but no manpower, but you don't want to you use mercs because they cost money (which you have) instead of manpower (which you do not).

Regardless, based on what you're describing something has gone very seriously wrong with your run.

 

[Regaccio]

A neat little trick for "dealing with rebels" is to spawn and accept peasant rebel demands just before Absolutism is enabled, then once the age starts you can lower autonomy in pretty much every province to very quickly max out your absolutism. Will cost you some prestige for accepting demands though.

If you use low stability/high national unrest to make the rebels spawn, you can also get Court and Country very quickly for a cool +20 maximum absolutism and some prestige once the disaster is over.

Just make sure you're in a safe position before you temporarily cripple yourself with these events, though.

 

[Adamgerd]

So you have money but no manpower, but you don't want to you use mercs because they cost money (which you have) instead of manpower (which you do not).

Regardless, based on what you're describing something has gone very seriously wrong with your run.

Because I am worried about getting too relied on mercs, and I am not sure how many mercs, my army can withstand.
For reference, this is my economy in peace time at high army maintenance (Due to war taxes, its slightly higher in war time):

 

[Zenonira]

Your economy and dev levels are both fine for doing a World conquest, but really, the NUMBER 1 lesson you can get is; Don't be afraid of loans. Loans only cost you 4% of their value per year, as long as you can expand enough to increase your economy to pay for this interest, they're more or less paying for themselves. Mercing up to crush Malwa (After catching up in military tech) will be more than worth even ten or so loans.

Edit; Hell, even running a negative economy for a significant chunk of the year can be acceptable, loans are just THAT strong if you can keep growing your economy. Riding the debt spiral THAT close may be a bit uncomfortable, especially if you're inexperienced with it though since once you get started on it you basically HAVE to keep loaning and expanding or you'll bankrupt. The main takeaway really though is that merc infantry is amazing, especially since money is of little concern.

 

[Badesumofu]

If the aim is a WC then if I'm honest that is not a great shape for 1632. Your income is really low, especially production and trade income are low. It looks like you don't have any Trade Company land.

It would be quite possible to have eaten all or at least most of India by that date playing Ottos. Huge, huge money there.

You will need to rely to a large extent on mercs for a WC. Manpower is scarce, money can become functionally unlimited by the late game if you really focus on building your economy early and mid.