Greek pre-dreadnoughts built as regular battleships

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Happy Trigger

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The decision to rebuild the decommissioned Mississippi-class pre-dreadnoughts is a very strange one, since the Greeks are one of the only nations that start with pre-dreadnought hulls unlocked. Yet rather than getting relatively-accurate hulls, they end up launching as this (visual mods only):
View attachment 642725

1.) As mentioned originally, the Greeks start with pre-dreadnought hulls. It doesn't make sense for their pre-dreadnoughts to build as regular battleships, particularly since as intact hulls these two ships would probably be pretty fast to rebuild.
2.) The guns don't exactly match; four 12-inch guns on the pre-dreadnought hull are now represented as being better-armed than almost every dreadnought in the game, only excluding the Colorado and Nagato-class battleships with eight 16-inch guns.
3.) Tech-2 armor is particularly strange for a ship with a 9-inch armor belt; that's battlecruiser levels of armor protection (the only dreadnought in-game with less armor is the Spanish España class, at 8-inches).

The only other note is that both the Mississippi-class and the Salamis-class are queued without names matching the Greek battleship namelist, resulting in the battleships having name duplicates if rebuilt (and being the only ships lacking the RHS prefix).
I was reading about the Salamis yesterday. It appear that only the hull was avaliable to the rebuilt of the ship, all the other stuff, like engines, guns, AA, etc, were scrapped, saled or lost. I'm not sure about the american ships, but i believe that, if these ship were to be modernized, they would probably look like a pre-war ship (BB1), not like a pre-dreagnought. I report a bug about the Salamis, because as a battlecruiser, it should be rebuilt like one, not as a battleship.

 
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Paul.Ketcham

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I just didn't think the 38cm guns would be able to fit but perhaps I'm wrong on that.

Now that I think of it they kind of missed out on an oppurtunity to make Vasilefs Konstantinos an option for allying with France over Brittain.

Technically you're correct...but technically the Salamis is a bunch of scrap metal circa 1930. Rebuilding it is basically reversing history (Greece was looking at this 8 years before the start of the game), which offers some hope that Russia might be able to play around with the Borodino-class battlecruiser hulls broken up around the same time too.

In accordance with the fact that an unspecified amount of the hull no longer exists, I'm fine with significant changes to the turrets :p
 
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Caeric

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I was reading about the Salamis yesterday. It appear that only the hull was avaliable to the rebuilt of the ship, all the other stuff, like engines, guns, AA, etc, were scrapped, saled or lost. I'm not sure about the american ships, but i believe that, if these ship were to be modernized, they would probably look like a pre-war ship (BB1), not like a pre-dreagnought. I report a bug about the Salamis, because as a battlecruiser, it should be rebuilt like one, not as a battleship.

Technically she is neither, her design was altered and redrawn so many times during the design and keel laying process depending on changes in the geopolitical situation.
In the end the design is something of a lighter budget battleship, it is not fast enough to be classified as a battlecruiser but a few knots faster than the average battleship of the time with only the Queen Elizabeths being faster.

Not to mention the proposed modernization in the late 20's would have probably included revising the armor scheme.
 
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Caeric

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So, what's the consesnus?
should we add these proposed changes to the ship improvemnt guide:
Mississippi class:

Salamis class: downgrade 2x heavy battery II to 2x heavy battery I
Given how this Salamis is basically pure-alt history and basically anything is possible in how she would be reconstructed idk about that one. But nerfing her main battery would make her even more pointless to build than she already is other than for RP reasons.

Given that you can manually research everything you need and aquire the neccesary NXP to design a proper T2 capital ships from scratch in less than the time it takes just to do all the foci neccesary just to start rebuilding Salamis and probably get it comissioned earlier if you start right away. And why wouldn't you if you're going to bother building a surface navy in the first place, you kind of need to go all in on the navy if you're going to bother with it at all, can't just half-ass it, then you might as well just stick to subs and naval bombers.
 
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Fulmen

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Probably an oversight

Hard to imagine given the obviousness of it, particularly in the game code itself. My guess is this was an intentional decision made so that Greece would at least get some bang for their buck, rather than the outdated heaps of metal the ships were at that point IRL (hence why they were scrapped, plus Greece probably couldn't afford to maintain/modernize them anyway).

As I understand Greece choosing to rebuild the ships and putting them into service is an extremely unrealistic decision anyway, no matter how the vessels are represented.
 

Paul.Ketcham

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So no changes for the Salamis except adding the prefix?

Battlecruiser 2 armor would make more sense, given that the hull had a 9-inch armor belt (and it's even described in-game as a battlecruiser, not a battleship). That's still better than default, but gives you a ship that's both distinct from the two pre-dreadnoughts and also matches the historic armor better (without being equipped with obsolete tech).