Ok, that proofs that im right about the province income is directly linked to the no. of people in the province.
Doesnt it BiB ?
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Ok, that proofs that im right about the province income is directly linked to the no. of people in the province.
Doesnt it BiB ?
dralizaar:
Any chance those increases in census tax are coming from tax collector and magistrate?
Any chance those increases in census tax are coming from tax collector and magistrate?
nope no chance..i wnet to start a new game and tested it on polands capitol without any improvements...just using swift for pop increase and checkign the numbers
I didn't think it would , but I figured I would ask for the sake of arguement.
Thsnks BiB.
Originally posted by dralizaar
ok i took chance to double check because i tohught maybe i could be wrong in what i saw..however following is observed results...you can do this test as well using cheat window f12 and typign swift it adds 10k to capitol pop..make sure capitol pop window open so you can see it...
Mazovia <warszaw> starts 10k 14 census 7 production type swift adding 10k
guess what new pop 20k 15 census 8 production type swift again adding 10k
now 30k 16 census 9 production and so one
each 10,000 in population adds another point in census taxes as well as porduction so yes once and for all yes populations do affect taxes not just production anyone can do this test as proof..but as you can see it takes 10k pop changes to make a difference so unless you have large pop to begin with a govenors 1% growth wont change your census anytime in the near future//in big cities where they have 100k..1% is 1k..so what 10years you will see 10k more? so 1 tax increase? if you have 100years to go in game thats 100 in new taxes as result of pop from govenor just from those 10years..so using govenors in high pop cities is defintely worth it they pay for themselves and they start adding up..under 50k i wouldnt use them now that i look at stats more closely..50k and up its a tossup...takes long time before you see results...butif you get them in 1540's or so..the end game will see some growth as result from them..under 50k forget it unless you need to lower infaltion or reduce revolt risk
but yes for one last and final time...do the test yourself go to your capitol of any nation and open cheat window type swift..and watch the numbers...do it several times Taxes are area are affected by population
I'll say it again : census taxes are not affected by population.
I just did ur test. Nothing changed. Apart from the occasional little jump in production income. But the census taxes are only affected by stab (and improvements). U say every 10K adds 1 ? When I add 10K nowt happens to my census taxes, not even production taxes are affected always with a 10K increase. When I do it 3 times in a row, nowt happens. Even more so I from the test I did earlier adding an extra 100K, nothing changed.
If 10K adds 1 every time then Flanders should be bringing in a lot more than what it does come endgame, yet it doesn't. Population does NOT matter when census taxes are concerned. Try doing that an X number of times (swift), then u should have a huge province income. It won't happen.
Hover ur mouse over the income breakdown, the menu that pops up u will find is quite accurate.
Originally posted by PatMaster
Ok, that proofs that im right about the province income is directly linked to the no. of people in the province.
Doesnt it BiB ?
If he weren't wrong, then yes, it would. Sadly it is so wrong
tis wierd cause run the tests on poland as played nation adn you will see its taxes and production both go up...perhaps it has caps as well i stopped at 50k and saw increase each time...plus if you look at base values for chinese japanese and indian provs..you will notice that their taxes values are far higher then their base listed values in province .csv..even before adding tax/justicars etc which they cant build without mobs..even if you set them at stability 3...which means population has to play a part in it...do the test with poland on warsaw and its observable results..perhaps it varies depending on pop? nation? i dont know maybe its not a constant..but its a visible change as poland..ill go try it as teutonic knights and see if i notice change in tax
ok tested on Livonia was at 10, 606 when started 18 tax 1production this is with 4 inf/3stab tax collector and justicar in prov
swift 1 20,606 19 tax 1 production 1 tax increase
swift 2 30,606 19 tax 1 production no change
swift 3 40,606 20 tax 2 production 1 tax increase 1 production increase
swift 4 50,606-190,606 no change
swift "x" 200,606 21 tax 2 production 1 tax increase
210,606 to 999,999 no change
so population made some difference albeit small...perhaps breaking points as to what gains there will be is based off starting values? or starting climate?
swift 1 20,606 19 tax 1 production 1 tax increase
swift 2 30,606 19 tax 1 production no change
swift 3 40,606 20 tax 2 production 1 tax increase 1 production increase
swift 4 50,606-190,606 no change
swift "x" 200,606 21 tax 2 production 1 tax increase
210,606 to 999,999 no change
so population made some difference albeit small...perhaps breaking points as to what gains there will be is based off starting values? or starting climate?
No one ever said population didn't influence taxes as a whole. It influences production and tolls. However census taxes it does not influence.
It did run the test u described on my Polish save and the results were totally conform what I posted earlier. No increase in census taxes whatsoever.
About those Chinese provinces, I just had a look at Fukien in my game. It has a listed basetax of 10. Chine is at +2 stab. In the game the census taxes are 11. Just right. Production taxes obviously are high as Fukien has 140K inhabitants and it produces a good that is very valuable by default. China also has a nice infrastructure level Same goes for the tolls.
But in census taxes pop does not matter.
It did run the test u described on my Polish save and the results were totally conform what I posted earlier. No increase in census taxes whatsoever.
About those Chinese provinces, I just had a look at Fukien in my game. It has a listed basetax of 10. Chine is at +2 stab. In the game the census taxes are 11. Just right. Production taxes obviously are high as Fukien has 140K inhabitants and it produces a good that is very valuable by default. China also has a nice infrastructure level
Same goes for the tolls.But in census taxes pop does not matter.
ok more tests
using normal tax settings on starting nations without any changes in stability or buildings
Sweden 11,211 start pop 27 tax 3 prod
at 21,211 she has 28 tax 4 prod
at 23,211 she has 29 tax 4 prod
at 201,211 she has 30 tax 5 prod
otherwise no change all the way to 999999
France 120,000 start pop 50 tax 2 prod
no effect all the way to 999999
England 75,000 start pop 32 tax 1 prod
at 85,000 33 tax 2 prod
no effect otherwise to 999999
so it does seem to vary nation by nation or prov by prov...also none of them seem to make any gaines past 210/220 area
using normal tax settings on starting nations without any changes in stability or buildings
Sweden 11,211 start pop 27 tax 3 prod
at 21,211 she has 28 tax 4 prod
at 23,211 she has 29 tax 4 prod
at 201,211 she has 30 tax 5 prod
otherwise no change all the way to 999999
France 120,000 start pop 50 tax 2 prod
no effect all the way to 999999
England 75,000 start pop 32 tax 1 prod
at 85,000 33 tax 2 prod
no effect otherwise to 999999
so it does seem to vary nation by nation or prov by prov...also none of them seem to make any gaines past 210/220 area
So u succesfully keep proving that production increases with population, sommink no one disputes at all so I dunno why u keep doing that. Now do the same for census taxes
The census taxes are the things called province taxes in the game. U keep referring to tax but that is the total tax income of a province, not the census taxes and the total taxes obviously are influenced by pop as the production income is part of the total.
Another things that needs mentioning is the religion modifier for taxes. But not pop for census taxes
PS
at 21,211 she has 28 tax 4 prod
at 23,211 she has 29 tax 4 prod
Also in this particular case, may I point out EU is full of rounding errors like these
The census taxes are the things called province taxes in the game. U keep referring to tax but that is the total tax income of a province, not the census taxes and the total taxes obviously are influenced by pop as the production income is part of the total.
Another things that needs mentioning is the religion modifier for taxes. But not pop for census taxes
PS
at 21,211 she has 28 tax 4 prod
at 23,211 she has 29 tax 4 prod
Also in this particular case, may I point out EU is full of rounding errors like these
DOH!! ya now i see what ya mean...i totally forgot when ya click mouse over the tax icon it has break down...i havent been looking at that part of equation..my baaaaaad hehe... my humble pardons hehe i keep forgettign that tax number is grand total form all soruce sin prov not just census..so yes only way pop affects tax income not census is by increased production but even that seems veyr slow to go up in most cases...wonder way ..id figured a high pop be so much more productive somehow... so its true all pop affects then is army recruitment by province in part ,aixnw they affect tax income whicha ffects recruitment..> so otherwise it doesnt matter 5k or better in most provs altohugh there is small improvements by some to 200k but after that it doesnt do diddly... ok add to wish list in futre..higher pop should mean a lot more
I think some of it has to do with city size/level. There are levels (5K,10K,100K,200K is top and I missed some I am sure) to cities (you can see them change when your city picture changes and gets bigger). At those levels your city income value (left value on the resource shield) will increase but I don't know what part of that number increases it (taxes/production). So population probably effects taxes and production but only when it moves up a city level. I read about city levels somewhere and they were listed so I am sure they have some significance other than the little eye-candy pic in the city window.
Laters,
Monadire
Laters,
Monadire
n
That'll be the production.
That base tax thingy influences quite a lot Like how many men u can draft and so
Anyway, sorted
That'll be the production.
That base tax thingy influences quite a lot
Like how many men u can draft and so Anyway, sorted
I was hoping that dralizaar was looking at the display wrong. Phew...
I have a diagram (that is not completely accurate as it turns out), describing this stuff, here. Check out the population mod part of it (the least intellegable). Huszics has the population modifiers well documented in his FAQ. I think Huszics has a column called "trade income" or some such. That is really tolls (which the ingame popups also describe as "trade income". It is something else in the ledger.
The population breaks are 700,5000,10000,20000,40000,80000,200000 as I recall. Note, it is really 701,5001,etc.
I have a diagram (that is not completely accurate as it turns out), describing this stuff, here. Check out the population mod part of it (the least intellegable
). Huszics has the population modifiers well documented in his FAQ. I think Huszics has a column called "trade income" or some such. That is really tolls (which the ingame popups also describe as "trade income". It is something else in the ledger.The population breaks are 700,5000,10000,20000,40000,80000,200000 as I recall. Note, it is really 701,5001,etc.