Maybe the March Revolution shouldn't just be a number of events happening but a diplomatic congress of all German Powers. A way where players can inflence the outcome depending on what compromises they are ready to make. In history they asked the Hohenzollern to be Emperor, but before that tha Austrian diplomats made clear they will not divide the Austrian Empire. But if the Austrian Player is like, okay with me, I give up every Territory outside of the borders of the German Confederation the player just might be able to sway the Frankfurt Prliament to go for Greater Germany. In this Case the Empire should use the modern Flag of Germny, Black Red Gold.
If Austria forms the Empire trough strenght like Prussia did it propably should be able to form the Empire with all it's territories, german nationalist pops and most liberals pops won't be happy tough, In this Case the Empire propably would use Black and Gold and the 2 headed Eagle. While not calliing it HRE Austria propably would want to stick to the leagacy of the Empire for prestige and legitamacy. The name is tricky tough. In history this conept was known as Großösterreich, Greater Austria, but I can't see the germans accapting that. So maybe Empires of Germany and Austria, Reiche der Deutschen und Österreicher. Or they pull something like the british did, United Empires of Germany and Austria. Central European Confederation of Free peoples. Unidted States of Europe. Fantasy and RP knows no limits.
I agree with all of this, especially that dropping transleithania is nescessary for the Austrians to get the Germans to vote for them. This could be however just be a fluke independence. Release it under a Habsburg Branch and have the entire bureaucrazy be loyal to Vienna. Placate the Germans, deal with the Prussians one last time, maybe annex the Magyars back into your new empire at some point. I think they'd probably officially call it just simply German Reich btw. The Austrians see themselves as better but they wouldn't consider themselves a different people group. The name Großösterreich would still stick inofficially. Used by the Austrians with pride and the Protestants very cynically. Also I think rearranging the colours on the flag works for Austria. Knowing the history of the German flag there's no reason for the colours to be in that order and Austria might prefer to keep black and gold together while adding red as lip service towards their new subjects. Also what do you think about "Rhein-Donau Monarchie,, as an inofficial name for greater Austria? It would combine the "German,, and "Austrian,, rivers. I'll write more on your suggestion about making the march revolution a mechanic in the next segment.
All options were pretty much on the table during the formation of Germany and I think all options should be on the table in Vicky3. The important part is what consequences you are willing to endure. Historically Kleindeutschland was the path taken, because Bismarck didn't want to be the big boogyman that everyone else joined up to fight. Every bit more than the historical path should have some significant downsides. Let's go through the optional parts of Germany and lets see what would have been the plausible outcome.
1. Austria proper: Taking the german parts of the Habsburg Monarchy shouldn't by itself be a big red button. There are two reasons why Bismarck didn't want to do this. The first is that Austria-Hungary is besides all differences a natural ally to Germany. The Habsburgs had direct rivalries to Russia, the Ottomans, Italy and France. If Germany unites with Austria proper then it looses its lowest hanging fruit when it comes to future alliances. The second reason is time. Bismarck was fearful that going for anything other than Kleindeutschland in the Brotherswar would prolong the fight and make it highly likely that other great powers would intervene. This worry should be very legitimate in Vicky3.
2. Luxembourg: The grand duchy would have easily been a part of the new Germany if it wasn't controlled by the dutch. Making any attempts to take it should be met by declarations of war by both the dutch (that ruled it) and France (who wanted it a lot more than Prussia did).
3. Denmark: The quirky one, because this discussion wasn't started by any German (who basically all see the Danish as a different people), but by the king of Denmark. He made the offer at the end of the second danish war to let the Kingdom of Denmark as a whole join the German Confederation instead of loosing Holstein and Schleswig. Historically Prussia and Austria said no, because they wanted only the german Parts of the danish Kingdom. If they had agreed to the offer it would have either resulted in Denmark as a Kingdom within the new Kaiserreich (like Bavaria was), or Denmark being a very closely guarded vassal of the german Kaiser. Both would be a no go for the UK, Sweden and Russia, because Berlin would control the Öresund.
4. The non-german Habsburg lands: These would be iffy for several reasons. Generally the more independence each nationality got the easier it would become. A annexation of all of Austria-Hungary into the German Empire would have meant inheriting it's problems. Having one nation state for all germans would have meant Hungarians asking for one too .... and the Polish ... and the Czech, Ukrainians, Croatians, Slovenes and so forth. This could either be solved by turning all (or some) into vassals or create a giant hungarian vassals who's only job it is to keep the other non-germans in line.
On a foreign policy view any inclusion of the non-german Habsburg lands (even as vassals) would have meant war with Russia and France for the simple reason that it would make them fear for their own existence as independent nations.
Straight up annexing them would almost certainly lead to war with every european country that can put boots on the ground. A Greater Austria is nothing less than a napoleon level threat to the rest of europe and it should be treated just the same.
The 1848 revolutions affected all of Europe and deserve tons of content and what ifs. When it comes to Germany it should lead to the Germans electing their Kaiser. The problem is that this Kaiser historically did not accept the election and this means that the march revolution is a bit pointless. It was obvious that the reactionaries would win. Not just when the Prussians refused the crown but from the start. But that's the power of 170 years of hindsight. The german confederation lost all its meaning after the defeat of the revolutionaries as well. Considering this a mechanic around the revolutions and the Bund is probably not a very high priority. If the revolutions succeed and a new Emperor is crowned he'll have to deal with The issues mentioned in the quote above. These could be issues brought before the parliament of the Reich where it is decided how to deal with each of these and depending on the choice certain interest groups will gain or lose approval. There probably doesn't have to be a mechanic of a Kaiser keeping the kings and dukes happy as they're already integrated and don't play a role anymore in the game.
Bismarck did not want any Austria in because he did not want anny rival for prussia in the Empire. Bismarck was a Prussian nationalist and for him the german unification was the way to go to serve prussia. With catholic Habsburgs in there was a rival in the new empire whom other catholic germans could rally behind to threaten prussian dominance.
The same would be true if Austria unites Germany with the Prussians in it just the other way arround.
Yes they wouldn't allow the Prussians to enter. But an Austria that actually somehow beat Prussia they'd liberate a lot of land from them. The entire Rhineland, Mecklenburg, Pommern up to including Stettin... They'd also return Prussian land to Saxony and annex Silesia. Man these borders would look weird. On the other hand, if Austria unifies diplomatically Prussia will give no quarter and the new German Reich will be relatively small with all the Prussian land missing. Finally there's the minor state option and they probably wouldn't go to war against Prussia and Austria so even if they unify everything left by the two giants, it wouldn't even be that much. Prussia should also be abke to take more land from Austria. If certain conditions didn't apply they would have. Salzburg as a new member state and Tyrol to Bavaria would suit the new German Reich very well.
1. I hope the german federation is represented
2. I hope there are multiple ways to unite Germany
Including 1848 liberal revolution, Uncontested hegemony (historic way of Prussia), diplomatic (german federation unites into nation-state; possible if there are less than 2 great power in the federation).
3. AI can do it
Agree! I think this is the minimum we all hope we'll receive.
Cool forum avatar btw. Just wished they had something that looked less than a round wooden shield and more like... Just a regular flag like in the hoi I set
I really would like to see a sort of default unification that the AI can reliably attain if all other methods fail like centralization of the German federation, it's weird when by 1910 there is still no progress towards Germany. I would also like to see unification methods that are possible without owning all German territory, such as if Prussia loses Poznan or something unification is still possible without necessarily needing to retake it.
I generally support this suggestion but I can imagine this to be quite a hard thing to make believable. If by 1910 they haven't unified it's proably for a reason and forcing the AI to do it might bear problems
