Germany should receive an expansion pack before Romania

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albso437

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the point is the timing. People have been losing faith and consistently disappointed, theres been AI after AI thread, so many issues popping up. Devs pushed out TFV which let down a lot of people, didn't even cover nations people actually play except a minority, acknowledged by podcat himself.

Finally, after seven weeks of radio silence, the first message is "Romania".

Everyone fully understands there will be future announcements, but this dev diary, the breaking of radio silence after 7 weeks of a game that so many people are not happy with set the tone. people are responding to that.

Who are the people you are referring to?

If we look at the OP of yesterdays DD we can see;

Agree: 139
Helpful: 40
Respectfully disagree: 17

That gives that approx. 10% of the people where unhappy with the DD.
That also means that 90% were not disappointed.

You are not speaking for the people, merely for a small (however vocal) minority.

Don't get me wrong - I also want fixes and AI improvement, but I wasn't disappointed with the DD.
 

Number 7

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Who are the people you are referring to?

If we look at the OP of yesterdays DD we can see;

Agree: 139
Helpful: 40
Respectfully disagree: 17

That gives that approx. 10% of the people where unhappy with the DD.
That also means that 90% were not disappointed.

You are not speaking for the people, merely for a small (however vocal) minority.

Don't get me wrong - I also want fixes and AI improvement, but I wasn't disappointed with the DD.

So only 196 people play HOI, and every single one of them rated the developer diary one of those three things. Nobody at all rated it agree but has issues. nobody rated it disagree but has things they like.

i for one didn't rate the DD at all. i see a whole lot of negative posts and a whole lot of agrees on other posts. You can try to handwave the amount of people unhappy with the game away but its much larger than 10%
 

albso437

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So only 196 people play HOI, and every single one of them rated the developer diary one of those three things. Nobody at all rated it agree but has issues. nobody rated it disagree but has things they like.

No, that would be silly.
But that's the statistic we got.
What proof do you have that "the people" was disappointed with the DD?

i for one didn't rate the DD at all. i see a whole lot of negative posts and a whole lot of agrees on other posts. You can try to handwave the amount of people unhappy with the game away but its much larger than 10%

I never said that only 10% are, in one way or the other, disatisfied with the state of the game.
(I, for one, also want improvements and Paradox really need to nail the shuffling this time.)

You were complaining about the DD and stated that "people" are responding to it's content.
I showed you that "people" in this case is only 10%.

(If you read trough the DD thread you can see that there is a small negative group posting over and over and over again, while the others write something like "Nice DD" and move on.)
 

Atlantians

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To the five people who "[not so] respectfully disagree," I challenge you to actually set forth the reasons why you think I am wrong. Not the reasons I am wrong, because I am right, but the reasons you people think I am wrong.

I do not think this matter is anything reasonable minds can disagree about it.

We disagreed with you because you didn't read the parts of the DD that mentioned that they are focusing on the AXIS, it is an AXIS patch/DLC, and the first DD just happened to be about an interesting country that was temporarily aligned with Germany and that Germany players will be able to interact with and deal with Historically or Ahistorically depending on the AI/Player choices within the Romanian Focus Tree.
 

Temudhun Khan

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We disagreed with you because you didn't read the parts of the DD that mentioned that they are focusing on the AXIS, it is an AXIS patch/DLC, and the first DD just happened to be about an interesting country that was temporarily aligned with Germany and that Germany players will be able to interact with and deal with Historically or Ahistorically depending on the AI/Player choices within the Romanian Focus Tree.

I think repeating it is useless, it has been stated multiple times and the guy still insist that the dlc will be about Romania only.
 

Stolen Rutters

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So in other words, it is only SPECULATIVE that the grievances I raise, which are doubtlessly shared by others, will be resolved. I will adjust accordingly once things are confirmed. Until then, it behooves all of us to keep the pressure on.
Yes.

Okay, I see what you are seeing. People disagree and you think they say we don't need flak88s and other stuff for Germany. It's true, you are speculating that we aren't getting lots of stuff for Germany, except we don't know what the larger parts of the dlc will actually contain, except the massive air war rework.

Now I see the lack of Germany teasers would freak the German-only players out (40% of games played? Wow!). I didn't see that before. I intentionally avoided playing Germany when I got the game in March because Oak, the next patch coming up, was "The Big Axis Rework"(TM)(R).

So from my point of view, I saw Romania is getting a small rework as part of a really big Axis rework, so Germany has a minor with flavor nearby it can deal with in the game, and you say we should scale back to Germany alone. When I hear this is the massive Axis expansion, I assume Germany, Japan and Italy are getting most of the love. You say, scale back to just Germany, that would be better. Do Romania later, implying nothing should be done about the rest of the Axis that Germany deals with. This is what I disagreed with.

It's why my earlier response opened with describing what the real operation oak was about, Germany dealing with her neighbors. I was trying to hint to you that everything they have been telegraphing to us about this expansion, from the name on down, relates to Germany, even down to the details in the Romania focus tree.

At least that is what I had read. I think I understand now. Paradox better get us some juicy Germany unit teasers next week! ;)

Final edit - Aww, next week's dev diary is about mechanics (yay!), not units (boo!). ;)
 
Last edited:

GeorgieBest

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Improving the minor European axis powers will benefit playing as Germany, even if there was no direct changes to Germany itself. I also think you'd have to be stupid to think that there won't be at least some changes to Germany.
 

rjohansen

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Well, I didn't jump out of my chair when reading the DD, but still, it is only the first of, probably, many. I don't even care about the "national focus" stuff - it would be better if they scrapped that stuff all together and we had normal events again instead. However, I bet Germany will also get some work done, this will be an axis DLC as I understood it, and probably all axis nations will have work done to them.
 

RELee

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Easy does it, everyone. No law against having an opinion, and certainly there is no law in respectfully disagreeing with an opinion.
 

Constans

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Who are the people you are referring to?

If we look at the OP of yesterdays DD we can see;

Agree: 139
Helpful: 40
Respectfully disagree: 17

That gives that approx. 10% of the people where unhappy with the DD.
That also means that 90% were not disappointed.

You are not speaking for the people, merely for a small (however vocal) minority.

Don't get me wrong - I also want fixes and AI improvement, but I wasn't disappointed with the DD.

Same here. I of course would have loved to have seen some stuff on mechanics changes/fixes and information on how they're upping the overall game experience. But, they addressed that by saying they were working on it with information to come. And they showed off how they're trying to make nations more immersive with the Romania tree.

I, personally, just don't get the outrage here, I thought podcat did a good job of recognizing and acknowledging what a lot of us here want to hear (the the AI issues are paramount), and letting us know we'll hear their solution in the future when they've locked it down. Saying anything else would've been way worse.
 

rjohansen

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PS: I also bet (as this is an axis expansion) that we will see Waffen SS units this time around. Hopefully with good mechanics behind it. Like volunteers depending on what nations Germany has occupied/allied with and more.
 

albso437

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How is Waffen SS different from any other unit designated as elite?

They are not. But I think people wish for special gfx and some mechanics for when/how you can recruit them.
 

hkrommel

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How is Waffen SS different from any other unit designated as elite?

They are not. But I think people wish for special gfx and some mechanics for when/how you can recruit them.

Yeah I'm pretty sure people just want more flavor (bring back automatic unique division names!) which is something that's pretty badly needed in general.
 

safe-keeper

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A couple of thoughts:

1. HOI4 is a sandbox game, and all nations basically have the same units, hence "Bismarck" or "88mm" are for flavour so the weapons aren't called things like "AT gun 1" or "Battleship 2". One nation's "AT gun 1" might be highly effective, while another nation's "AT gun 1" might be horribly flawed. So you're meant to spend XP points to modify each unit to your liking. If you want true-to-life 88mm guns, you spend XP accordingly.

I don't want to derail the thread with stuff I've written before, so I'll try to keep it short: I feel the problem lies in the variants designer itself, not in which flavour units were picked specifically for Germany. Some people suggested letting the player pick a design company for then to basically ask that company to produce, say, a Battleship with good engines and firepower. Then some time would pass and when the ship was fully researched, it would be roughly what the player asked for, give or take a couple points of stats. Then the AI could be scripted to lean towards historical stats, for example high speed and agility for the Japanese Zero fighter.

2. Naval combat and naval everything, for that matter, needs a rework, yes. I wouldn't call this a "German problem", though, and it's something they can throw into any patch or DLC.

3. I agree some models need work, the lack of jet fighters being the most obvious example.
 

ringhloth

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the point is the timing. People have been losing faith and consistently disappointed, theres been AI after AI thread, so many issues popping up. Devs pushed out TFV which let down a lot of people, didn't even cover nations people actually play except a minority, acknowledged by podcat himself.

Finally, after seven weeks of radio silence, the first message is "Romania".

Everyone fully understands there will be future announcements, but this dev diary, the breaking of radio silence after 7 weeks of a game that so many people are not happy with set the tone. people are responding to that.
The devs will talk about what's basically finished and going into the game for sure. That's how every almost single communique with the players devs will work for almost every single game. We won't hear about bug fixes or AI fixes until near the end, because they're going to be working on it until the very end.
 
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