Generic or historically accurate?

[artalas]

I was wondering, as I haven't seen it adressed in any of the dairies/WWW (maybe i missed it), will vehicles have generic stats or more historically accurate. E.g will russian tanks be cheaper, but be less powerful than german tank.

Will we see in the game the effects of germany focusing on quality before quantity, and sovets doing the opposit.

I know they've covered the effects of constantly updating your production, which kills of your efficiency in creating them, but e.g a german medium tank, while more costly, was more powerful in general than a russian medium tank. Will this be reflected in the game or will all medium tanks have the same base stats? Same goes for planes etc.

 

[Zaku]

Oh, one of these threads.

Get ready boys for the 20 pages long tank arguement.

Op: the stats are generic.
Every tank will have the same stats on the same tech level for every nation. You can customize them with the variant system.

 

[safe-keeper]

Yeah, the pictures/models and whatnot are just there for fluff, basically. A level one tank is a level one tank.
That said, their performance will be affected by things like the national spirit (unique modifiers for various nations), techs, and doctrines.

 

[LordOfWar16]

Vehicles at their base start with the exact same stats for all nations, just their name and visual appearance differs.

• You have the Companies, which alter the stats if you research something while they are active.

Those are country specific for the major countries, like Porsche, Henschel, Renault, Skodâ etc.
An Porsche Tiger has different stats than an Henschel Tiger for example.
Their stats get permanently altered upon research by that specific Company. You can always switch out the company and will still produce Porsche Tigers for example. You could have Porsche PzIII, Henschel PzIV, MAN Tiger I and Henschel Tiger II for example.
​

• On top of that we have the variant system, which allows you to create upgraded variants of your vehicles with field experience.

You can improve your vehicles in 4 different aspects like range, armament, Engine and reliability for fighters, for example.
Those aspects will be different for different types of vehicels. Carriers have Deckspace, Engine, Armor and Reliability.

​

At their core an T-34, PzIV and M4 Sherman might share the same stats, but on the battlefield an russian T-34 and german PzIV will differ in their stats due to those systems. Infact you might even have different tanks each campaign you play, depending on your choices.

Here is an example of the Scharnhorst vs the King George V Class Battleship, both Tier 2 battleships. Note the icon on the right side of the portrait, which shows the Company used to design it. The research time alters because of different variables that influence that speed.

 

[Denkt]

Stats are generic and everyone use the exact same tech tree but stats can be influnced by:

• Variant
• Doctrines
• Ministers
• Companies
• National focuses

Also national focuses may effect things such as how early you may be able to research stuff, Germany for example will be able to research way ahead in tank tech because of national focuses that remove the ahead penalty for tank research.

 

[Kikaider]

One thing I'm not sure we know is if the stat cap on variants is ALSO affected by design companies and the like. I believe the devs said the cap is +5 in each stat, but would that (in the end) mean a fully maxed variant is the same in spite of which design company was active? If one for example gives +1 armor, would the cap for armor then be +6? If not, and everything caps out at +5 no matter what, then the uniqueness of companies and all other bonus might blend away, which would be a shame.

 

[Denkt]

Design companies and variant are two differen't things so no matter what company you use you will start with 0-0-0-0 tank but they will have different stats.

 

[artalas]

If thats the case, it seems like a missed opportunity to create variation in the game.

 

[Denkt]

If thats the case, it seems like a missed opportunity to create variation in the game.

How do you mean? I posted many factors which effect the stats of each equipment.

 

[Zaku]

If thats the case, it seems like a missed opportunity to create variation in the game.

Why?
You can customize the stats of the tanks to your preferences.
That's far more variation then some arbitary bonuses to certain nations.

 

[Denkt]

If you wan't cheap tanks go with the streamlined choice in production tech, if you wan't to field the best tanks go with flexible and change out your tank every time you make an improvement.

 

[Hans_Schnitzel]

If thats the case, it seems like a missed opportunity to create variation in the game.

Wat? They made it possible for you to design your OWN tanks. You couldn't possibly have more variation than that! You want your Sherman to be the uber tank killer with no armor, slow speed but a gun that can crack a Tiger? Do it! You want your Pz IV to be he uber cruiser tank and give it a small gun, thick armor and okay speed? Go for it!

It allows A LOT of variation! And is way better for balance, too. It would be boring if all tanks perform the same in any campaign, but here... you never knwo how the Pz IV or the sherman or the medium tank I will fare. Will the enemy focus on armor? Speed? Firepower? Or perhaps make their tank so reliable that if you don't destroy them they barely have to produce any of them to keep a large army of them because they simply do not break down?

 

[chaostk]

One thing I'm not sure we know is if the stat cap on variants is ALSO affected by design companies and the like. I believe the devs said the cap is +5 in each stat, but would that (in the end) mean a fully maxed variant is the same in spite of which design company was active? If one for example gives +1 armor, would the cap for armor then be +6? If not, and everything caps out at +5 no matter what, then the uniqueness of companies and all other bonus might blend away, which would be a shame.

One thing you're not taking in account is that variants upgrades reduces reliability, with the upgrades on reliability can't account for maxing all stats. So going fully maxed isn't good (apparently would get you 0 on reliability) so chances are different players will upgrade just the stats that fits more their taste, or which are more needed for their current situation.

 

[safe-keeper]

If thats the case, it seems like a missed opportunity to create variation in the game.

It's a sandbox game, not a railroaded history simulation like War in the East. You're meant to be able to build your army exactly the way you want it, so if you want to recreate the stats of the German tanks, for example, you're more than welcome to do so. If you want to try out your own ideas, you're able to do that, too.

 

[Kikaider]

One thing you're not taking in account is that variants upgrades reduces reliability, with the upgrades on reliability can't account for maxing all stats. So going fully maxed isn't good (apparently would get you 0 on reliability) so chances are different players will upgrade just the stats that fits more their taste, or which are more needed for their current situation.

Thats also true, but I just meant from an implementation point of view I was curious given that the devs said that a fully maxed variant is a little better than the baseline model of the tier above it (which means its possible) and that you needed to add extra XP to offset the reliability (or ignore it if you want). Plus I figure that if I rush the top teir medium tank and unlock it, THATS the one to pour extra XP into to since I can't theoretically make a better tank than that one final model in game.

 

[Secret Master]

If thats the case, it seems like a missed opportunity to create variation in the game.

Well, if I can produce a 1939 light tank with a bigger gun and higher speed than Denkt's 1939 light tank, then the game has all the variation it needs. And when safe-keeper shows up with his light tank with zero reliability that breaks down all the time (because he wanted to slap on twelve extra layers of armor while also having a huge gun on it)....

 

[safe-keeper]

Relia-who? We use duct tape.

 

[Secret Master]

Relia-who? We use duct tape.

You know, duct tape as we know it was a product of WWII...

Bonus to reliability for the US?

 

[Lither]

And when safe-keeper shows up with his light tank with zero reliability that breaks down all the time (because he wanted to slap on twelve extra layers of armor while also having a huge gun on it)....

Pretty sure that the Panther was designed something similar

 

[hkrommel]

I was wondering, as I haven't seen it adressed in any of the dairies/WWW (maybe i missed it), will vehicles have generic stats or more historically accurate. E.g will russian tanks be cheaper, but be less powerful than german tank.

Will we see in the game the effects of germany focusing on quality before quantity, and sovets doing the opposit.

I know they've covered the effects of constantly updating your production, which kills of your efficiency in creating them, but e.g a german medium tank, while more costly, was more powerful in general than a russian medium tank. Will this be reflected in the game or will all medium tanks have the same base stats? Same goes for planes etc.

Tank comparisons aside (we just had one of those threads), the problem with having something like this is that it's horrendously railroading. What if I, as the Germans, decide to go for cheaper mass-produced tanks? Under your system I can't.

What about research? If I'm the Germans and I completely neglect tank research, would my tanks still be better than those of the Swedes, who have been far ahead of me? That doesn't make sense.

Your suggestion is similar to a "Pearl Harbor" event which removes US ships from the scenario even though the US player rebased them all to Norfolk in 1937 and they haven't seen the Pacific since. Basically it makes no sense unless things play out exactly as they did historically.

Remember this isn't a WWII documentary, it's a grand strategy game set in the WWII era. If you want to watch a WWII movie, go watch one. In HoI you can and will do things differently.