Furor Teutonicus - Archaeology and Tribes of the Ancient Germanics

Furor Teutonicus - Archaeology and Tribes of the Ancient Germanics

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Welcome forum viewers, @Trin Tragula and @Arheo ,


Today @vanin and I are going to explore the ‘filthy barbarians’ of the cold north – also known as Germanics - with you. We decided to do this to write an overview of the ‘Germanic’ archaeology and written sources of the Pre-Roman Iron Age (pRIA) for all who are interested, to propose several improvements for Imperator’s map and to counter some misconceptions that have been circulating. Among these are this map of the pRIA, in which the House Urns culture, which vanished between 525 and 450 BC and wasn't a contemporary of the Oksywie culture, and a large gap between the Harpstedt-Nienburger and La Tène cultures is shown, although there were many findings in the latter region. The Harpstedt-Nienburger concept is also not very appropriate for the period of our interest, as it describes some inhomogeneous groups sharing two pottery styles of the middle pRIA (570 to 330 BC). Additionally, some space will be devoted to discussing the myths that are still overvalued by some in comparison to archaeological evidence.

To summarise this quite long thread:

Starting with what Germanics actually were in the view of ancient authors and our more modern interpretation, Germanics are introduced as speaking a Germanic language because there was not one but there were many ‘Germanic’ archaeological cultures; bilingualism is discussed in this regard, too. This is followed by the archaeology of four regions. Firstly, the north-east of Germany with the Jastorf culture, its peripheries and its expansion to the south, which lead to the replacement of the House Urns culture, are discussed. This is followed by the north-west of Germany and the Netherlands, which both built a quite inhomogeneous Contact Zone between the La Tène and Jastorf cultures. This zone was more advanced than Jastorf, and a strong Celtic influence on the region’s tribal names might indicate bilingualism there.

In the second part written by @vanin , the archaeology of Poland and Scandinavia is going to outlined. The section on Poland is centred around the question of what evidence there is that Germanics lived in the area, as well as around the Celtic influence and appearance of Celtic religious practices. Thereafter, the Scandinavian part is made up of Jutland’s relation to the Jastorf culture and the remote character of the Scandinavian peninsula for the first half of Imperator’s time frame. An ansatz for a Swedish and Norwegian setup based on ancient sources is proposed, as overemphasizing the medieval accounts of Jordanes and the medieval names of particular Swedish and Norwegian regions leads to the wrong impression that the Vikings had been living on the Scandinavian peninsula since time immemorial.

The proposed setup would look like this:

GermaniaMappa_2.png


Who was Germanic?

Inventing a culture is a deed not many can claim, but Caesar did exactly this in his Commentarii de Bello Gallico. There he simply called everyone from east of the Rhine Germanic opposed to the Gauls west of the Rhine. When he describes the 'lifestyle' of these tribes, differences between his so-called Germans become apparent, e.g. he states that the Suebians lived only in small villages whereas the Ubians are described to have lived in oppida.

Caesar's definition of culture based on geography is far from our modern culture term, however. We consider customs, behaviour and language indicative for a somewhat abstract culture. Neither of these are easily accessible to us, as we lack self-written sources and we certainly do not know how many and who spoke which or what language. Archaeology can somewhat help us with customs, but we only see the unanimated used objects and not what was done with them.

Therefore, for the purposes of this text, a Germanic will be considered to be a person who spoke a Germanic language. This may sound straightforward, but not so, for many people in the past may have spoken more than a single language, one in their immediate community and another for communication with more distant neighbours. If Germanic was the language of the family, then they might be reasonably regarded as Germanic, but if they used Germanic only as a lingua franca to facilitate external interactions, then should they be called Germanic? Probably not. Otherwise in transitional regions, there might have been proper bi-lingual areas where two languages (or even more) were used on a daily basis. What were they? Probably calling them Celto-Germanic, Germano-Celtic or there like might be an appropriate way. As they need to be part of one culture group for in-game purposes, we can look to archaeology and determine whether or not they were closer to one group or to another one.


Short overview over the early Germanic language


Germanic is a part of the Indo-European (IE) language family. Pre-Germanic developed from IE and became later proto-Germanic, which is mostly placed around the middle of the first millennium BC (in the Kurgan and Anatolian hypotheses). This development was gradual, so it gives only a rough date when significant change happened. The first attested Germanic word(s) date(s) to the late 3rd century BC; they are the names of the Sciri and Bastarnae tribe. For the latter the name origin is still a matter of dispute, while it is less so for the Sciri.

In 300 BC, proto-Germanic was still spoken and underwent some more changes before it became Germanic. Two important ones are described by Grimm’s law and Verner’s law. Grimm’s law is dated to the early first century BC, as the Cimbri’s name would’ve been Chimbri if it had spread before that date (at least for the area from where they originated). It’s first attested when the Cheruski and a bit later the Chatti tribes are mentioned. Verner’s law is sometimes dated to after Grimm’s law had already become the norm, but others argue that it’d be too much change in a short period of time, so that they suggest Verner’s law occurred before Grimm’s law.

There are many theories about how the Germanic language spread, but only DNA studies in the next couple of years will probably give us enough hints to reconstruct its history. We only know in which regions Germanic constituted the majority’s (at least of the elite) primary language from the first century BC onwards based on the name evidence.



Archaeology of ‘Germanics’ and Germanic Tribes

For a long time, there was the assumption that a unified archaeological culture would indicate a unified culture and language of these people, however in modern times this is no longer thought to be true. Transition zones are included in modern models.

When it comes to who lived there then we only know about people living in these areas from ancient sources. The first mentions of Germanic tribes dates to the first century BC, when Caesar campaigned in Gaul. As a huge part of the map would be uninhabited if one would only use certain information, PDX chose to extrapolate from the first mention back to our start date. Archaeology is a good indicator to track down any major population shifts or migrations from or to an area. What one shouldn’t forget is that such a fickle society also means that names could change, but they are the only names we have so it’s not that wrong to use a possibly later name for the same people (from whom that later name also emerged). This is however no longer possible when one has names like Heruli who seem to emerge from a mix of Sarmatian, continental Germanic (Goths) and Jutish people (possibly also others). In such a situation, using the name would lead to the wrong impression of a long-standing continuity that did not exist.


North-Eastern Germany and the Jastorf Culture

Since its introduction over a hundred years ago, the Jastorf culture has become a well-accepted concept. The Jastorf culture lasted from around 600 BC up to Christ’s birth and developed from the local Bronze Age culture with settlements and graveyards were continuing to be used throughout the transition. Nowadays, it is divided into two periods I (divided into a, b, c, d) and II (divided into a, b, c, d) of which the latter is characterised by southern influence from the La Tène culture; there was still influence from the Celtic south in the first phase, however. A century ago the second phase was divided in two and named Ripdorf (300 BC to 150 BC) and Seedorf (150 BC to 1 AD), but this would imply a major cultural shift that didn’t occur. La Tène culture mostly impacted the pottery, some tools and some jewellery (see [1.1]), while other cultural elements such as burial rites did not change in the long run.

Jastorf’s characteristics are (apart from its pottery, tools and jeweller), cremation followed by burial the urn with the remnants in a simple earthen pit. During the early phase of La Tène influence other burial rites appeared, but vanished soon afterwards, leaving only the ‘ordinary’ Jastorf burial practice. Because all burials are the same until the 1st century BC, Jastorf is often considered to be a very egalitarian society with no clear elite. The burial sites are often very large in the core territory (see section about subdivision), e.g. Mühlen-Eichsen is the largest one with about 5000 burials (c. [1.2]). In its southern periphery (see section about subdivision) the cemeteries are smaller with Chörau being the exception. The Jastorf people lived in three-aisled byre-dwellings in its core territory, whereas the people lived in pit-houses in the southern periphery.

5-2831f53ed4.jpg
From [2.1]

There are some concepts about how to divide the Jastorf culture spatially (see figure "Divisions of Jastorf", [1.3]), but its core territory is north-eastern Germany, from which it expanded westwards, southwards and into Jutland. The southern periphery came into being at the end of the 6th century BC and replaced the preceding House-Urns culture. It is nearly identical to the core, the differences being the habitation type and the smaller burial sites. Reasons for this might be the lower population density in general and another geographical situation.

12-2b478f4af3.jpg
From [1.3]

Jastorf also expanded into the north, the west and to a lesser extent to the east in the 6th and 5th centuries BC. On the eastern periphery, Jastorf blended into the Pomeranian and later Przeworsk cultures, while on the northern periphery it did so into the Nordic iron age (c. [1.4], see the part about Scandinavia). The western periphery is somewhat different, as a drift away from Jastorf can be observed there with the appearance of La Tène influence. Some, therefore, place it among the cultures of the Contact Zone (see the part about NW-Germany and the Netherlands) during the period of our interest.

In the 2nd century BC, a migration from the east to the land of the southern periphery appears to have happened (c. [1.5]). Burials and settlements of the Przeworsk culture appear around the Saale river and to a lesser extent the Unstrut river (so-called Saale-Unstrut group), both regions with a lower population density. The number of migrants was relatively small, however, and around the time of Caesar’s campaigns these people leave again. Although the Przeworsk pottery had a much further extending distribution area, only one quarter of this pottery was used for Przeworsk burials and had stylistic influences from Poland. The other three quarters were a stylistic mix between Jastorf and Przeworsk. This phenomenon also spread further west to Hesse, where some Przeworsk settlements and burials were found in lowly populated peripheral areas; there are, however, no finds in or around the La Tène oppida or any other larger settlements.

Screenshot_2019-03-05 Frühe Germanen in Hessen.png

blue: Przeworsk settlements, yellow: Przeworsk cemetries, black squares: Preworsk burials on Jastorf cemetries, black dots: Przeworsk pottery or pottery inspired by it. From [1.5].

Tribes of the Regions:
In the following, some tribes of the region together with their first mention are listed. Caesar’s Commentarii are dated to 58 BC to 51 BC, the Germanic campaigns are dated to 12 BC to 14 AD, Plinius left Germania before 59 AD and Tacitus’s Germania is dated to around 100 AD.

  • Semnones (Ger. Camp., possibly even Caesar as ‘Suebi’)
  • Langobardi (Ger. Camp.)
  • Cheruski (Caesar)
  • Fosi (Tacitus)
  • Varini (Plinius)
  • Hermunduri (Ger. Camp.)
  • Marcomanni (Caesar)
  • Quadi (Ger. Camp., their name is related to the north German word for bad, ‘quade’ or ‘quaad’)
  • Nuithones (Tacitus)
  • Suardones (Tacitus)
  • Reudigni (Tacitus)

Discussion
GermaniaMappa_2.png

There are only a few changes necessary here. The addition of the Hermunduri and Quadi should be made, and together with the Marcomanni they could represent southern periphery, as all three migrated in the late 1st century BC fitting with the archaeological evidence. Although there are areas of sparser population, there are Jastorf findings up to the border of the La Tène culture (in this case the Naumburger culture, which also had some Jastorf people mixing with them).

The Fosi should be far smaller, as they were first mentioned only by Tacitus as a ‘vassal’ of the Cheruskians. The Langobardians should also be smaller (as indicated by Tacitus) and located west of the Elbe, as they moved to the east during the Germanic campaigns. As the Chaucians should be more western (see section about NW Germany), adding the Suardones can fill the vacuum; they are related to Schwerin but otherwise there’s no way to link them to another positions. The Reudigni would take the position of the Chaucians then (as they cannot be linked to a region, too). The border of both would be extended further to the north to make them more in-line with the sub-groupings of Jastorf (see figure "Divisions of Jastorf").

Tacitus also mentions the Nuithones, while Ptolemaios mentions Teutons for the area where I put the Nuithones. It could be an error by Ptolemaios or by Tacitus (or both), however Tacitus seems more reliable and the Teutons are already located on the Cimbric peninsula (I’d also say that Teutones would’ve been more famously mentioned than that). One can also fit their sites to another sub-group of Jastorf.

It is hard to assess which tribe (or whether they just joined an existing one) is related to the Saale-Unstrut group, but as there were only few people related to these the tribe they might have belonged to was quite small. The Naristi or Buri would be two candidates; the latter because they were said to speak Suebian (Tacitus) but were part of the Lugian confederation (Ptolemaios).


1) Egon Heinz, Die Keramik der Jastorf-Kultur, 2015

2) Peter Ettel, Das Gräberfeld von Mühlen Eichsen, Mecklenburg-Vorpommern. Zum Stand der Ausgrabung, Aufarbeitung und Auswertung, 2014

3) Frank Nikulka, Zur Regionalisierung der Jastorf-Kultur Theoretische und methodische Grundlagen, 2014

4) Jes Martens, Jastorf and Jutland (On the northern extent of the so-called Jastorf Culture), 2014

5) Michael Meyer, Frühe "Germanen" in Hessen, 2012

6) Vladimír Salač, Zwei Beispiele des Beharrungsvermögens in den Eisenzeitinterpretationen: Die Oppida und die Markomannen, 2013

7) Jochen Brandt, Martin Schönfelder, Die Latènisierung der Jastorfkultur. Kulturkontakt als Folge germanischer Raum-Zeit-Konzeptionen, 2010

8) Harald Meller, Glutgeboren. Mittelbronzezeit bis Eisenzeit, 2015



North-Western Germany, the Netherlands and the Contact Zone between Jastorf and La Tène

As I’ve already mentioned, the archaeology of north-western Germany is a ‘mess’ compared to the quite clear cut Jastorf concept. There aren’t any globally applicable characteristics. The Harpstedt-Nienburger group concept tried basing it on singular objects that were more widespread (mostly throughout the mid-Iron Age), however these haven’t been found in all areas of this zone, leading again to zones with no affiliation. Some, thus, extend the Harpstedt-Nienburger group to encompass all of north-western Germany and the Netherlands, but then the term becomes quite misleading. A more appropriate term is ‘Contact Zone between Jastorf and La Tène’ for this period. In fact, this is one of the few connecting elements; the influence of both well-defined cultures degrades the further away an area from the core of the respective cultures is (c. [2.1]).

According to Barry Cunliffe [2.2], the best way to look at the Europe of that time, is to see it as a series of peripheries of decreasing social and economic complexity the further one moved away from the Mediterranean. What can be deduced of the Germanic society of the 1st century BC and AD from Caesar and Tacitus gives the impression of communities differing little from the Celts of the fourth and third centuries BC. In other words, degree of social complexity cannot be taken as a distinguishing factor between Celt and German. This model neatly ties in with the Contact Zone, as generally speaking the ‘civilisation value’ (in-game term) decreases the further away from La Tène and the closer one to Jastorf is in this zone.

Burials.png

1) urn burial 2) bone bed 3) "Brandschüttungsgrab" - pyre burial with urn 4) "Brandgrubengrab" - pyre burial without urn. From [2.5].

From around 330 BC, the Late Iron Age or Celtic iron age started in the continental area [2.3], while the start is put to 300 or 270 BC for the Netherlands [2.4]. In the Late Iron Age, the burial customs changed through the adoption of Celtic-inspired ones (all four of figure "cremation types", c. [2.5]), new jewellery and art styles were introduced, and new technologies were adopted. The changes varied from region to region, creating a tremendous puzzle (c. [2.1] and [2.6]). Other phenomena tied to the burial rites are the sporadic appearance of Celtic influenced wagon burials (c. [2.7] and [2.8]) and highly furnished barrows mostly in Drenthe (e.g. Fluitenberg, c. [2.9]), possibly indicating the growth of elites from time to time in contrast to (east German) Jastorf, where burials were very egalitarian until the late 1st century BC. The Late Iron Age ends with a transition period (50 BC to 12 BC/16 AD), which was caused through the disruption created by Caesar’s Bello Gallico. The interaction between the people of the Contact Zone and Jastorf, then started to increase until Drusus started his campaign, causing another disruption. The first few situlae from the east were imported and adapted in this period [2.10].

Wagengrab.png
From [2.6].

Situla.png
From [1.6]

Situlaspread.png

Dark green: early form, lime: late form. From [2.10].

There were three main habitation types in the Contact Zone. Firstly, along the Dutch and the North Sea coastline, terps (dwelling mounds) were used with a quite high population density of 15 inhabitants per km².The Dutch terp region was colonised by inhabitants of the interior parts of the Netherlands in the 6th century BC, whereas the East Frisian terp region was settled in the 1st century BC by the people of the Wildeshausen Geest (c. [2.11] – [2.14]). In the terp region, excarnation by dogs and inhumation are rarely practiced, while cremation is assumed to have made up most burials [2.15]. Secondly, byre dwellings occurred in areas with sandy soil, where livestock was needed to fertilise the land (see figure, c. [2.16]). Lastly, in more arable regions (e.g. southern Westfalia), farmsteads specialised in either animal husbandry or agriculture appeared instead. Surpluses were sometimes produced which were stored in pits shaped like truncated cones [2.17]; this contrasts with Jastorf and the other two types. Additionally, some defensive sites were built (or re-built from older sites dating to the 6th and 5th centuries BC) in the more mountainous zones in the 4th - 3rd century BC, indicating some form of social organisation [2.18].

Byre.png
Byre dwelling

farm.png
Farmstead. From [2.1].

Byres.jpg

red dots: byre dwellings, green triangles: other types. From [2.16].

I will now list a few groups of this area outside of the aforementioned Frisian Terp group and their characteristics, but they did not necessarily correspond to tribes, because of at times only small differences (c. [2.1] and [2.6]):

sicherl-2015-in-gaffrey-cichy-zeiler-s-35-fertig.jpg


  • Pestruper Group (1; Meppen-Oldenburg-Cloppenburg-Vechta): barrows above the funeral pyres, signet neck rings (E10), complex pendants (Wölpe), long hollow humps, bronze earrings (bat ear shape)
  • Eilshausener Group (2; Osnabrück-Bielefeld-Minden-Nienburg): mostly Brandgrubengrab – rarely Brandschüttungsgrab, brooches (Babilonie), Jöllenbeck-Lahde fibulae, the trade hub Schnippenburg was there
  • Three small Münsterlander groups/regions (3-5), which are still being investigated
  • Pipinsburg group (6; Göttingen-Hildesheim-Braunschweig-Nordhausen): ornate pendants (Manching-Hadmersleben/Amelungsburg), vividly ornated needles, pottery produced with turntables, flat Scheiterhaufengräber
  • Paderborner region (7): triangular loom weights, pit silos, usage of Hessian coins, no bangles, no pottery created with turntables
  • Lippe-Ruhr region (8; area between those rives up to Dortmund): few imported bangles, Hessian coins in its east, nearly no loom weights and turntables
  • Wupper-Siegengebirge region (10): hard-burnt simple pottery, only few bangles, nearly no coins but a huge treasure was found at Stieldorf, defensive sites (refuge castles) of Erdenburg, Rennenburg and Petersburg
  • Betuwe-Ijssel region (9; Nijmegen-Wesel-Arnheim): many bangles (partially self-produced), triangular loom weights, many slings and their projectiles, vanishes after the Bello Gallico
  • Maas-Rur region (11; Roermond-Grevenbroich-Venlo-Nieuwegein): many bangles (partially self-produced), no own coins but foreign ones used for trade
Loom.png
From [2.1].



Excursus: La Tène in Central Germany
Although the confluence between the Rhine and the Main was one of the ‘birthplaces’ of the La Tène culture, its spread towards the north was quite limited. The border is often drawn based on the extend of the oppida civilisation. The northern most are the Dünsberg, the Amöneburg, the Heidetränke, the Steinsburg and the Menosgada oppida. Even before these oppida were built, the vegetal and plastic style of La Tène art had spread there in the 4th and 3rd centuries BC, and one can therefore rightfully place them among La Tène as its northern periphery. The most notable difference between central and southern Germany is the absence of Viereckschanzen in the north (the northernmost point of their extent is the Finsterlohr oppidum). Except for the Amöneburg, which is related to the Dünsberg, all of these are a centre of their respective region (Heidetränke and Dünsberg had a different coinage system).

NorthernOppida.png

Based on numismatic evidence and Caesar’s descriptions, the Ubii are nowadays linked to the Dünsberg oppidum. Their name can be either based on the Germanic uβjaz or the Celtic uϕor/uϕer for superior [2.20]. Some 2,500 personal names from inscriptions show an overwhelming majority of Latin and Greek names (77% for civilians and 79% for soldiers); Celtic (6% and 7%) follows next and is more popular with persons from an earlier time, and Germanic (4.5% and 4%) is on the third place [2.21]. Likewise, there are three other tribes described as geographically Germanic by Caesar. The Nemetes, the Tribocci and the Vangiones settled in Alsace at Caesar’s time. Although the latter has a clearly Germanic name, which means people of the field and contrasts with the Nemetes’ Celtic name (people of the forest) [2.22], only La Tène objects have been found in Alsace dating to that time. Based on settlement continuity for at least the 1st century BC and AD, Vangiones serving as auxiliaries for Caesar, Celtic names and Celtic gods being prevalent in that region as well as Worms bearing their name (Civitas Vangionum) the conclusion can be reached that the Vangiones were part of the La Tène cultural sphere [2.23]. Germanic objects only appeared when the Neckarsuebi were resettled to the area around modern Ladenburg, but by then the Celts had been heavily Romanised.

20190308_111759.jpg


20190307_191231.jpg
Viereckschanzen - ritual rectangular ditched enclosures (Both from [2.2]).

Tribes:
Again, some tribes mentioned for this region will be presented. Etymologies for some will be given:
  • Tencteri (Caesar): Celtic tencteroi or Germanic tenhteraz, both mean the unified people [2.24]
  • Usipetes (Caesar): Celtic uxsipits, luminous in the heights [2.24]
  • Chamavi (Ger. Camp.): Germanised (Grimm’s law) Celtic of comavus/camavus-, the powerful [2.22]
  • Sugambri (Caesar): various versions of their name, gambri either Germanic (avid) or Celtic from camavus, su- is a Celtic prefix for good or strong
  • Chatti (Caesar indirectly, Agrippa's 1st governorship of Gaul): Germanised (i.a. Grimm’s law) Celtic of cassis (Celtic god; c. Baiocasses) [2.25]
  • Batavi (Caesar): Fully Celtic (batav-) for fighter or Germanic batawiz = better, Batavian place names are Celtic (Batavodurum, Lugdunum, Batavorum, Noviomagius), there are Celtic person names like Briganticus but also Germanic ones like Chariovalda [2.21]
  • Bructeri (Ger. Camp.): Germanic like brook/broek or Celtic brogilo (district, wood, c. Allobrogae), ending Celtic or Germanic see Tencteri
  • Angrivarii (Ger. Camp.)
  • Ampsivarii (Ger. Camp.)
  • Frisii (Ger. Camp.): Germanic for free (Old Germanic fri, Gothic freis) [2.22]
  • Chauci (Ger. Camp.): Germanic like Old Germanic hôh = high or might be Germanised Celtic with Grimm’s law (c. Irish Cauci or Celtiberian Cauca – modern Coca) [2.26]
What’s quite striking is that some have (Germanised) Celtic names and other tribes have names that could be both. The names of the Cheruskians (Ger. deer people or Celt. brown clothes) and Ubians (Ger. superior or Celt. sword blade) could be both, too. It is, therefore, hard to judge the language situations in this region for the period of our interest.


Discussion

GermaniaMappa_2.png

One might now ask what we can deduce from all of this. Firstly, we have local developments which were influenced by foreign people but were unique, so that a large-scale migration bringing a ‘finished’ culture with them can be ruled out. From this the question arises how the majority of these people (or at least their elite) ended up speaking a Germanic language but still seemingly had a strong Celtic influence, because the tribal names are oft Germanised forms of Celtic words or words that could be interpreted as either. One could speculate that the people were slowly Germanised, i.e. that the number of Celtic speakers was higher in 300 BC and was lowered by assimilation over the next few centuries. This, however, has the problem that people of the same tribe would speak a different language and yet somehow needed to communicate with each other. Furthermore, the archaeology doesn’t show any hints towards such a process, while the Celtic world was even more influential in the Contact Zone in the Late Iron Age. This Celtic influence in the tribal names is something that speaks against a migration from far away (e.g. Scandinavia), as the name had to evolve at a place with a strong Celtic influence. Some even argue that the North-Sea Germanic pecularities were introduced from Brythonic [2.27], but what is certain that the people of that area had trade relationships with south-eastern England in the late Hallstatt - early La Tène period, facilitating language exchanges (see figure "Trade Routes and Atlantic Facade").

NorthSea.png
Trade.png
From [2.1].

In my opinion, the most conclusive argument on how to resolve this is a bilingual area or a Germanic and/or Celtic accent that was heavily influenced by the other. One shouldn’t forget that, before the ‘invention’ of modern standardised languages, people along border territories were still able to communicate with each other either by their accents fading into each other or bilingualism. E.g. Celtic in 300 BC had branched out into several groups, and someone from Ireland would’ve had troubles communicating with someone from Pannonia (c. e.g. [2.2]).

This still leaves the problem how to translate something like this into the game. The best way I came up with is to split basically along the La Tène line, i.e. Istvaeones, Ingvaeones, Germani and Cisrhenani as Germanics and Treverian (or perhaps rename it to Germano-Celtic) and (southern) Belgae as Celts. These groups would then need a decision to change their cultural affiliation, as the Contact Zone might have joined La Tène if it hadn’t been for Caesar’s Bello Gallico and some Celtic rebels went to Germania after their revolt against the Romans failed. For the Germanics, the condition could be tied to having a comparable civilisation and centralisation value like a Celtic neighbour, whereas the Celts could ‘degrade’ to Germanics by doing the reverse and reducing their civilisation value and centralisation. This should certainly hamper stability and take some time, i.e. a first larger bump and then a slow assimilation of the rest to the new culture and religion. A Celt becoming a German being less attractive is something that is also historical.

Based on the uniqueness of the Frisian Terp group, there’s no way around putting the Frisii there; a ‘migration’ from the west after 300 BC is contradicting archaeological evidence. The Chauci would then take the current position of the Frisians. Further to the south, the Bructeri would border the Chamavi and the Angrivarii, as the latter expelled the Bructeri in the 1st century AD. The Ampsivarii would inhabit a small area around the Ems river, as that is from where their name derives from. The Sugambri follow below the Bructeri and are bordered by the Usipetes and Tencteri to the west, because both those tribes were expelled by the Suebians and later on admitted by the Sugambrians during the Bello Gallico. This indicates that they bordered the Suebians and had prior contacts with the Sugambrians, but there’s no absolute certainty from where they came. Lastly, the Chatti together with their vassal the Batavi (c. description by Tacitus) get the rest. I’d say that the Batavi’s inclusion is warranted because of their fame.

1. Bernhard Sicherl, Zur kulturellen Gliederung Westfalens in der späten Eisenzeit, 2015

2. Barry Cunliffe, The Ancient Celts, 2018

3. Jürgen Gaffrey et al., Von der "Guten alten Zeit" – Chronologie, 2015

4. Stijn Arnoldussen, Iron Age habitation patterns on the southern and northern Dutch Pleistocenecoversand soils: The process of settlement nucleation, 2010

5. Bernhard Sicherl et al., Spiegel der noch Lebenden, 2015

6. Bernhard Sicherl, Namenlose Stämme – Nordwestdeutschland am Vorabend der römischen Okkupation, 2009

7. Birte Reepen, Archäologische Untersuchungenzu eisenzeitlichen Wagengräbern im nordwestdeutschen Raum, 2011

8. Jürgen Gaffrey, Ein Wagengrab in Westerkappeln, 2015

9. Annet Nieuwhof et al., Von Reichen und Armen - Eliten im archäologische Befund/Over rijken en armen - elites in het archeologisch onderzoek, 2013

10. Bernhard Sicherl, Frühe Situlen im Westen, 2015

11. Annet Nieuwhof, Mans Schepers, Living on the Edge: Synanthropic Salt Marshes in the Coastal Areas of the Northern Netherlands from around 600 BC, 2016

12. Annet Nieuwhof et al., Leben mit dem Meer: Terpen, Wierden und Wurten/Leven met de zee: terpen, wierden en wurten, 2013

13. Annet Nieuwhof et al., De late prehistorie en protohistorie van Holoceen Noord-Nederland, 2009

14. Jan F. Kegler, Sonja König, Hohe Hügel, fester Grund? Wurten als Grundlage der dauerhaften Besiedlung der südlichen Nordseeküste., 2016

15. Annet Nieuwhof et al., Of dogs and man. Finds from the terp region of the northern Netherlands in the pre-Roman and Roman Iron Age

16. Stephan Deiters, Siedlungswesen, 2015

17. Bernhard Sicherl, Kegelstumpfgruben der Eisenzeit, 2015

18. Jens Schulze-Forster, Die Burgen der Mittelgebirgszone. Eisenzeitliche Fluchtburgen, befestigte Siedlungen, Zentralorte oder Kultplätze, 2009

19. Jens Schulze-Forster, Wie Keltisch ist der Dünsberg, 2013

20. Stefan Zimmer, 2006 Ubier, Sprachlich, 2006

21. Joh. Leo Weisgerber, Die Namen der Ubier, 1968

22. Norbert Wagner, Lemovii, Helvecones*, Batavi, Βατίνοι, Chamavi, Cherusci Stammesnamen zwischenGermanen und Kelten, 2015

23. Ralph Haussler, Worms und die Vangiones. Fakten und Fiktionen, 2007

24. Stefan Zimmer, Usipeten, Usipier und Tenkterer Sprachlich, 2006

25. Norbert Wagner, Lat.-germ. Chatti und ahd. Hessi Hessen, 2011

26. Dietz, Karlheinz, Chauci (in Der Neue Pauly), 2006

27. CoverJohn Hines, Nelleke IJssennagger, Frisians and Their North Sea Neighbours, 2017

Special thanks to @Wavey for squashing some textual errors.
 
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vanin

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Central-Eastern Europe in 303 BC

This post details the history of a region roughly corresponding to modern Poland and its surroundings in the period related to Imperator: Rome. I have put the large sections within spoiler tags for readability.

Imperator: Rome begins in the year 303 BC, a time which regarding modern Poland and its surroundings is quite well understood archaeologically.

Around 800 BC the fortified settlements of the Lusatian culture, such as the site at Biskupin, arose. These sometimes housed populations reaching a thousand persons, but they were not the norm. Most of the Lusatian population would have lived in farmsteads or smaller villages, far from the safety of any walls. It has been proposed that the people of the Lusatian culture may have dealt with destructive incursions by nomads dwelling on the Pontic Steppe in the east, which gave rise to a warrior elite which would come to construct and maintain such fortified locations. Lusatian was a subset of the Urnfield culture which encompassed central Europe at this time, and was neighbored by the Nordic Bronze Age (NBA) culture in the north and west.
Lusatian_Max.png
Lusatian culture's maximum extent and late NBA influence.

The Lusatian fortified settlements would however fall out of use by around 500BC signifying its end, and it would henceforth be replaced by the new Pomeranian culture in Poland. This culture developed out of a contact zone on the Baltic coast, where elements from the Lusatian culture mixed and intermingled with those from the Nordic Bronze Age (NBA). Archaeological records from eastern Pomerania around this time shows clear influences from both, being stylistically close with NBA but religiously and otherwise materially close with Lusatian. A clear difference from other cultures on the continent is the vast number of monumental structures found in eastern Pomerania, a feature not before seen, and was clearly imported from NBA. A considerable feature of the Lusatian culture which Pomeranian dropped was fortified settlements – those that were abandoned never came into use again.

The result was a different culture with considerable trappings from both, and it would over time come to dominate almost all of Poland and some neighbouring regions. A notable characteristic are the face-urns in which the cremated remains of the dead were kept, which is why it is also often called Pomeranian face-urns culture. It would dominate its part of central Europe until the late 3rd century BC when it began to wane, perhaps due to influx of populations from the Jastorf cultural sphere, and by 200BC the more well-known Oksywie and Przeworsk cultures had replaced it on the coast and in the inland respectively. Similarly, the Elb-Havel and Lüneburg group of northern Germany were a mix of a (central European) Urnfield culture and the NBA. From these the Jastorf culture developed in the Iron Age.
NBA.jpg
The late bronze age cultures.

The Pomeranian culture's disappearance was rather sudden and leaves many questions to be answered. Settlement sites were almost all discontinued in the transition, instead settlements were founded in nearby locations. Burial grounds also fell out of use and after about 200BC see no additions. The pottery style completely changed and shards of Pomeranian pottery are almost never found together with Przeworsk and Oksywie ones.

One view is that the Pomeranian populations migrated; usually a sudden shift in pottery style with close to no overlap would indicate that the population changed character, as pottery is a standard commodity available to the poor. But in that case where did they go? We have no clear hints as to where the Pomeranian populations could have gone if indeed they left – the best relation could be the Poienesti-Lukashevka culture of Moldavia and northern Romania, as these sites have contained fibulae finds very similar to Pomeranian ones. But that is the only lead and it is a weak one.

If they did not go anywhere, what would prompt a large population to wholesale and rapidly abandon not only their material culture but also settlements, way of life and burial customs? Clearly it was a period of some upheaval and we will likely never find a good answer.

The aforementioned Poienesti-Lukashevka culture was a newcomer in south-eastern Europe at the end of the 3rd century BC. It bears striking resemblance to the very distant Jastorf culture, even if it has some additions from others such as the Pomeranian culture. If the Poienesti-Lukashevka is so closely related to the Jastorf culture it must be the result of a migration, and then it is not infeasible that foreign elements were picked up on the way. Truly, the area where the Carpathians, Danube and Steppe zone meet in south-eastern Europe has always been a melting pot, and at this time had influences and populations of Dacian, Thracian, Scythian, Sarmatian, Germanic and maybe even Celtic influences. Whoever took up residence in such a region would be difficulty to classify, but it seems likely that the Poienesti-Lukashevka culture had strong influences from a culture much farther to the north.

Heading back towards the territory of modern Poland, a collection of Jastorf findings have been found in an eastwards arc from the Oder towards the Vistula. These finds are dated to about 300 BC, which is around when the Pomeranian culture began to weaken before its eventual demise around 200 BC. Many scholars attribute the changes that took place and eventually resulted in the Przeworsk and Oksywie cultures rising to this early ”eastern arc” by people of Jastorf culture. They did not stay long – their material culture does not persist far into the 3rd century BC – but most likely it indicates the first case of intense contact between Jastorf and Pomeranian populations.
Jastorf_Extent.png
Jastorf culture and its peripheries and influence.

As mentioned the Oksywie culture would have resulted from this contact, and came to occupy coastal Pomerania from the Oder to the Vistula, leaving most of the inland vacant. Eastern Pomerania seems to have been abandoned for most of the 3rd century BC as habiation sites were discontinued en masse by Pomeranian populations. The area was only resettled in the 2nd century BC, with a helping of populations from northern Germany, Scandinavia and lower Poland in addition to remaining Pomeranian clusters, whose admixture developed into the Oksywie culture. Oksywie would persist on the south Baltic coast until the turn of the era, when it was replaced by the Wielbark culture.

Further down the Oder lies another group of Jastorf origin, the Gubin group. This group is characterised by high quality metallurgy and Jastorf-like burials, but in the 1st century BC the area was abandoned, perhaps as by-product of the Suebi attempting to invade Gaul. The area near Gubin was later settled by Przeworsk populations, whose distinct pottery has been found in abundance at these otherwise isolated sites from later times.
Oksywie_Przeworsk.png
Oksywie and Przeworsk cultures' extent.

When discussing the Przeworsk culture one should first introduce a concept called Latenisation. The La Tene culture, which is seen as a direct representative of Celtic populations and influence, was the dominant cultural sphere of western and central Europe at this time. Before Rome much of Europe was Celtic, and its influence found its way even to remote places such as Scandinavia and Anatolia. The Przeworsk culture was heavily influenced by the neighboring Celts, who probably found a strong interest in the region in part due to the lucrative amber trade, and as a result adopted many ideas regarding burial rites and material culture from them. This is the process of Latenisation, and the effects of this will be expanded upon in a later section. The Przeworsk culture lasted well into the modern era, eventually in the 5th century AD during the chaos of the migration period.

Tying into Latenisation, throughout Poland many hotspots of Celtic influence have been found, having arrived in the region from 270 BC onwards. One must keep in mind that La Tene material finds do not necessitate Celtic populations – La Tene influences permeate much of Europe, and the contact zone between La Tene and other material cultures was wide and varied. Instead, as the La Tene culture was so dominant, it is very likely that local populations and especially elites adopted Celtic cultural traits as their own. Populations may even have been bi-lingual in an effort to facilitate or as a result of trade, as Celtic could have become the lingua franca of the age.

It is in this light these southern hotspots should be viewed, straddling an area from Silesia in the west to the San River in the east. These settlements and tribes may have had Celtic populations, but it is just as likely that they were not dominant and instead mingled with or ruled over local post-Pomeranian populations. Notable areas are in upper Silesia and the Sudetern range, near Krakow at Tyniec, and on the San River which is a tributary of the upper Vistula. Other Celtic settlements nearby are centered on Puchov in Slovakia, whose influence seeped into southern Poland, and Bohemia. Southern Poland was thus the frontier of Celtic settlement and influence, with Celts taking a heavy interest in the amber trade which went north through the Moravian Gates, passing modern Kalisz up to East Prussia. The amber trade was very lucrative and must have helped cultural and material exchange, evidenced by the wide variety of La Tene findings throughout Przeworsk territories. Celtic influences would dissipate in this region from the middle of the 1st century BC, disappearing entirely in the 1st century AD.
Archaeology_Poland.png
La Tene and other cultures' findings sites in Poland.

While the game does end before the 1st century AD begins, I will touch on the aforementioned Wielbark culture. The Wielbark culture seems to have arisen directly out of the Oksywie culture around 1 AD, only later accruing elements of Scandinavian and other origins from 70 AD onwards. It replaced Oksywie on the coast and then expand inland along the Vistula as land was vacated by other material cultures. The defining trait of the Wielbark culture is its burials, as inhumation was practiced which none of their neighbours or ancestors did, and the burials were largely weapon-less. There is speculation that this change in burials could be due to a stark change in religious practice, perhaps due to the invention of a new warrior cult. This possibility will be elaborated on further in another section.

The final group in modern Poland to enter this list is that of the West Balts. In the pre-Roman Iron Age (pRIA) it is specifically referred to as the West Balt Tumuli culture. This culture arose around the 7th century BC and has three local expressions in east Mazuria, west Mazuria and Sambia, which could represent three different tribal groupings. The nearby Oksywie and Przeworsk cultures influenced the West Balts who contracted throughout Warmia and Mazuria in the 3rd century BC. Iron production only picked up in the region in the last century BC or so, indicating that the West Balts were behind their southern and western neighbours who had ready access to iron much earlier.

There are a number of ancient authors who mentioned the peoples occupying what would become modern Poland. Strabo, Pliny, Tacitus and Claudius Ptolemy are the most prolific and the ones who will be referenced here. Later authors will not be referred to, as enough information can be gleaned from the works of these authors and we are already using writings from the 1st and 2nd centuries AD.

Strabo mentions a set of tribes subservient to the Marcomanni in Geography 7.1.3: ”... and acquired, in addition to the peoples aforementioned, the Lugii (a large tribe), the Zumi, the Butones, the Mugilones, the Sibini and also the Semnones, a large tribe of the Suevi themselves.”

The Mugilones, Sibini, Zumi and Butones are all corrupted forms of other tribes, though only the Butones have a direct equivalent: the Gutones later mentioned by Tacitus.

Speaking of Tacitus, he is the source I personally like the most as he is clear, concise and appears remarkably reliable. Regarding ancient Poland, in Germania 43 he writes: ”Behind them the Marsigni, Gotini, Osi and Buri, close in the rear of the Marcomanni and Quadi. Of these, the Marsigni and Buri, in their language and manner of life, resemble the Suevi. The Gotini and Osi are proved by their respective Gallic and Pannonian tongues, as well as by the fact of their enduring tribute, not to be Germans.”

The Gotini are the Cotini, and Tacitus mentions them working in mines (probably to pay off said tribute).

Going on: ”The name of Ligii, spread as it is among many states, is the most widely extended. It will be enough to mention the most powerful, which are the Harii, the Helvecones, the Manimi, the Helisii and the Nahanarvali."

The Lugians (here Ligii) is specifically mentioned as a large ”state” with several constituents, but Tacitus is content with mentioning the five most prominent. He also elaborates some of the tribes, for example the Nahanarvali preside over an important religious grove where they pray to a deity named Alcis. The Hari are militarily powerful, with a fighting style which perhaps gave rise to the legend of the wild hunt. The Helisii are often linked to modern Kalisz, where excavations have found evidence for contemporary settlements. The Manimi are mentioned by other authors as Omani.

In the next chapter, Germania 44, Tacitus continues: ”Beyond the Ligii are the Gothones, who are ruled by kings, a little more strictly than the other German tribes, but not as yet inconsistently with freedom. Immediately adjoining them, further towards the ocean, are the Rugii and Lemovii, the badge of all these tribes being the round shield, the short sword, and servile submission to their kings.”

Here Tacitus discusses the Gothones (Strabo's Butones) and the neighbouring Lemovii and Rugii, who he pens as a grouping of similar tribes fighting and being ruled in the same fashion. The three are likely minor, peripheral tribes bordering the dominant Lugians to the south. The Rugii and Lemovii are placed further from the coast than the Gothones, which means that the Gothones should inhabit the Vistula delta and parts of the Pomeranian coast, with the Lemovii closest to them and the Rugii a bit farther away towards the Oder.

And finally Germania 45: ”At this point the Suevic sea, on its eastern shore, washes the tribes of the Aestii, whose rites and fashions and style of dress are those of the Suevi, while their language is more like the Britons. They worship the mother of the gods, and wear as a religious symbol the device of a wild boar. This serves as armour, and as a universal defence, rendering the votary of the goddess safe even amidst enemies. They often use clubs, iron weapons but seldom. They are more patient in cultivating corn and other produce than might be expected from the general indolence of the Germans. But they also search the deep, and are the only people who gather amber (which they call “glaesos”), in the shallows, and also on the shore itself.”

Tacitus mentiones their lack of iron weaponry, which would link up with the late adoption of iron among the West Balt tribes, but by the middle 1st century AD the populations referred to should already have used iron widely. Tacitus also mentions their religion, in which a boar was a sacred symbol of ”the mother of the gods”. He also elaborates on the so important amber called ”glaesos” (could be proto-Germanic for ”glass” if the word is from a Germanic source, compare to modern Lithuanian ”gintaras”), which is clearly abundant.

Next, let us move onto Pliny's The Natural History. This magnum opus tackles an unprecedent number of different topics in one volume and he does go over the geography of ”Germania” in book 4 chapters 27 and 28.

Chapter 27: ” There are those also called Glæsaria by our soldiers, from their amber; but by the barbarians they are known as Austeravia and Actania.”

Austeravia is very likely the homeland of Tacitus' Aestii due to the reference to amber, although Actania is an unknown.

Chapter 28: There are five German races; the Vandili, parts of whom are the Burgundiones, the Varini, the Carini, and the Gutones, and the fifth race is that of the Peucini, who are also the Bastarnae adjoining the Daci previously mentioned.

Here is the first mention of Vandals (Vandili) in the sources, and they are clearly a large grouping facing eastwards in Germania, and not a single tribal unit. Next he mentions the Bastarnae who were of the Peucini, dwelling near the mouth of the Danube. More on them later.

Lastly let us turn to Claudius Ptolemy's Geography. Ptolemy is the best (or worst) when it comes to geographically defining the location of tribes and places. His account is however complicated and the coordinates he lists are skewed despite that his latitude is nearly identical to our modern latitude. His longitudes however are difficult to ascertain, but this topic will not be studied more closely until we get to the topic of peninsular Scandinavia. Otherwise it is an excellent source of city names throughout Germania if one can effecticely make use of the coordinates (which some certainly have).

Section 11 Germania: ”Of the people within the interior of country, the greatest are the Suebi Angeili and are spread out further to the east, the Langobardi towards the north between the middle Albios river and the Suebi Semnoni, the Bourgountiones extend between the Albios and a location to the east of the Suebos river and occupy a range of country near the Vistula river.”

The Burgundi are said to control a region between the Elbe, beyond the Semnones, eastwards across the Oder (Suebos) towards the Vistula.

Continuing: ”Then the Langobardi, below these the Dulgumnii, between the Saxoni and the Suebi, the Teutonicri and the Viroli. Between the Farodeni and the Suebi, the Teutones and the Aurpi. Between the Routiclones and Bougouni, the Ailouaiones.”

Here Ptolemy mentions a few tribes we are not very familiar with, but some of them can be made out regardless. The Ailouaiones are usually interpreted as the Helvecones mentioned by Tacitus, and Ptolemy places them between the Rugi (Routiclones) on the coast and the Burgundi (Bougouni) further inland.

”Again below the Semnones live the Siliggi, below the Bougouuntii are the Lougii Omanni, below the Lougii Dounii (or Loggididounii) near the Asciburgis mountains.
Below the Siliggi, the Caloucones, both sides of the Albios river, below these the Chairousici and the Chamauosi near the Melibocos mountains.
Being towards the east, around the Albios river, the Bainochaimi, above these the Bateini and above these, under the Ascibourgios mountains, the Corcontii and Lougii Bourii near the head of the Vistula river.”

Paraphrasing:
”Below the Semnones lie the Silingi, below the Burgundi are the Lugi Manimi, below (them?) the Lugi Diduni near the Asciburgis mountains.
Below the Silingi, (lie) the Caloucones on both sides of the Elbe, below these lie the Cherusci and Chamavi near the Melibocos mountains.
To the east around the Elbe are the Bainoachaimi above who lie the Bateini and above these, under the Asciburgis Mountains, lie the Corconti and Lugi Buri near the head of the Vistula.”

Many of these tribes are not mentioned elsewhere, which could be due to translation errors or poor information, or the tribes mentioned by Ptolemy are later constructs that did not survive into the migration period. Either way these will largely be ignored.

The picture painted by Ptolemy places the Silingi, who we can identify as clear bearers of the Vandal name in later times, near the Semnones, probably on the middle Oder. As mentioned the Burgundi are further east in a band between coastal Pomerania and the Polish lowlands. Below, here read as south, of the Burgundi lie the Manimi below who one can find the Diduni on the Sudetern mountains. Thus the Manimi and Diduni should lie in Silesia by the time of Ptolemy. Going on, the Buri are also near the Sudetern mountains, or perhaps the western Carpathians, but next to the Vistula's "head" which is likely its source ("headwater"), meaning southernmost Poland.

Lastly I want to add a few notes on the Burgundians, whose origin is even today contested. There is a very obvious and easy homeland for the Burgundians and that is the Baltic island Bornholm, whose old Norse name is Burgundaholmr. Burgundar simply means high cliff or stronghold, and has many similar words in modern Germanic languages, such as Swedish "borg" meaning fortress or English "burger" meaning people living inside a fortified town. This name is also first attested in the 9th century AD, and not before. Meanwhile there are a couple much earlier literary sources that deal with the Burgundians in detail, such as the Historie Adversum Paganos written by Orosius in the 5th century AD: They took their name from their stations, for the dwelling places at frequent intervals along the frontier are commonly called burgi� aka fortified locations.

In addition one might use Jordanes' willingness reinforce Scandinavia as a 背omb of nations�would have readily latched onto any notion that the Burgundians came from Bornholm �yet he does not. In fact he never mentions an island of that time. Following from this one can draw the conclusion that the Burgundians did not originate on Bornholm, and we also have no sources that reliably details such an origin. Thus the location defined by Ptolemy will be used, which is in Przeworsk territory of western Poland.

This section is meant for interpreting the ”voids” in the evidence presented above, and explain some of the outliers that have been referred to. None of this is to be taken as fact, as opposed to the above two sections that generally are.

Starting off, who were the people of the Pomeranian culture? The Lusatian culture whom they predate also has an unknown ethnicity and language, and unless DNA sampling gives us a solid answer we may never know. The Pomeranian culture was however influenced by the NBA, and grew to encompass almost all previously Lusatian territories. This does not inform us on their language, but they must clearly haven been Indo-European and their closest geographical neighbours were West Balts and proto-Germanics and later Celts. If they spoke a dialect of these languages it is most likely proto-Germanic, but a now dead IE-language is also possible. As they were supplanted so early in the game's time frame and we know of no tribes or even what they called themselves, the Pomeranian culture will be ignored in the game.

Continuing on the topic of the Pomeranians, the ties to the Bastarnae that have been presented are not comprehensive. The Pomeranian-style fibulae that have been found do not indicate that this is where these populations ended up, if they left Poland at all. The Bastarnae may have been a group which became mixed due to a variety of cultural influences and added population elements, but their origin is very likely in the Elbe valley. However it makes little sense for the Bastarnae to start out on the Elbe – they should reside in south-eastern Poland in 303 BC to allow them to migrate to their historical location. In 230 BC the Bastarnae and Sciri, who are readily connected with Poienesti-Lukashevka culture, attached the Greek colony Olbia on the Black Sea coast. Tacitus marks them as their own grouping separate from the Vandals and Irminonics, and therefore should have their own culture of the Germanic sphere.

Next, up are the Przeworsk culture populations. Who were they? The area identified by contemporary authors as occupied by the Vandals and Lugians is near-identical, and matches with the Przeworsk culture in archaeology. A likely conclusion could be that being a ”Vandal” was a kind-of ethnic distinction in the same way that a multitude of tribes were considered ”Suebi”, and thus its usage survived when the probably more political or religious denomination ”Lugian” did not. Thus, the culture of the eastern Germanics in this area would be Vandalic in-game. Lugian then would be a cultic distinction, as Lugos is a well-known Celtic god and the La Tene influence in the region was strong as demonstrated by the Celtic settlements in southern Poland and Silesia and other scattered finds. As the earliest authors refers to the group of tribes as Lugi, it is likely a confederation of tribes tied together by their cult to Lugos. This is the interpretation chosen in-game, and Vandalic tribes may form the Lugi confederation and adopt a cult in Lugos' name.

The other Lugian tribes mentioned by ancient authors have etymologies that could derive from Celtic or Germanic. Diduni: Could be ”Di Dunos” meaning ”Uplander” in Celtic, Manimi (Omani) could derive from ”Komantos” meaning ”Equals”. The Hari might be from Germanic ”warriors” and Helisii could be derived from Kalisii, which would place them near modern Kalisz which was on the Amber Road. Lastly the Naharvali, whose origin is difficult. Arvalus is a Celtic harvest god, while Vali is a Germanic derivative of ”Chosen”. All in all, the tribes have Celtic and/or Germanic etymologies, which is parallelled by other Germanic and Celtic contact zones further west.

Going on, the Gothones or Gutones are a can of worms due to implications stemming from Jordanes' work in the 6th century AD. However the 6th century is 800 years from the game's start and will be ignored as his work is so embellished with undisputable fiction. Jordanes will be touched upon in a later post. Instead we choose to rely on earlier, more academic authors and the archaeological record.

The culture most strongly linked to the early days of the group we later know as the Goths is the Wielbark culture. As mentioned it seems to have a direct continuity with Oksywie except that it radically transformed its burial rites, introducing inhumation and weapon-less burials. It is speculated, and this is a stance I favour, that the change in burial rite to something quite alien to the people of the area was religious in nature. Gautr is one of Odin's Eddaic names, and by the 1st century AD there was not yet a uniform view of who or what Odin was, or would become. The chief god in Norse mythology has borne many names and Gautr is just one of them (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_names_of_Odin) . Could then the Gothones at the Vistula estuary be a cultic league dedicated to their new patron god in the same way that the Lugians were, adopting the gods name in the process? There are other parallells to this in early Germanic history, as Saxon chroniclers mention the god Saxnot from whom they may have derived their name. This could explain how the name found its usage in what later became Sweden – but that is a topic for another day.

Wielbark culture, which we connect with early Goths, enter the archaeological record by 1 AD but it could be assumed that the people who later formed that tribe, bearing that name or not, existed in the same area earlier. This way one can, for gameplay purposes, place the Gothones on the Vistula estuary in 303 BC as part of the Oksywie culture. This cultural domain they would share with the Lemovi and Rugi who according to Tacitus were further inland, the Rugi near the Oder and the Lemovi in central eastern Pomerania.

Lastly, who were the Celtic or Celtic-influenced peoples who dwelled in southern Poland? Did they bear any names? As mentioned there are three major areas, one near Glubszyce in upper Silesia, one at Tyniec near Krakow, and then the San river valley to the east. These are all adjacent to identified Celtic territories in Bohemia, Moravia and Slovakia where the Boii and Cotini dwelled. The aforementioned tribes that Ptolemy and Tacitus placed in Silesia, the Manimi/Omani and Diduni could as their etymologies point towards have dwelled in these Celtic territories.

The Buri may prove the most difficult to place the origin off. According to Ptolemy they were at the head of the Vistula. Tacitus places them ”behind” the Marcomanni and Quadi in the same sentence as the Cotini and Osi, who we know dwelled east of the first two in Slovakia. The Buri should have held a similar position, in the east, which could place them in southern Poland by Tacitus' time.

It is indicated in text that they are Suebi, part of the Lugi confederation and located at the ”head” of the Vistula. These three pieces of information are together difficult to accept. But for 303 BC one does not have to accept all three. The Marcomanni and Quadi moved into Bohemia after the game's time frame, and the Buri may have followed them and taken control of an area near Krakow – this makes sense if they were truly Suebi. However as the evidence is conflicting one may not know for certain, therefore the Buri will, at this stage, be omitted in the setup.

The in-game setup

The coastal people are identified with the Rugians, Lemovians and Guthonians. The former two are placed along the ocean (the Rugians in the west because they were mentioned first by Tacitus), whereas the Guthonians dwell in the interior parts next to the Vistula based on Tacitus's description. The population not along the rivers Oder and Vistula should be redistributed to those areas based on these areas being near-abandoned in these times, making the area between the rivers very sparsely populated. It was chosen to depict those areas owned by the three aforementioned tribes for gameplay purposes.

The Lugians were divided up in order to allow the player the decision to either form the Vandals, a ”purely” Germanic confederation, or the Lugians who are more Latenized. The Vandals would only require ownership of much of the territory, whereas the Lugians would also require bordering a Druidic nation. The formation of the Lugians would lead to the adoption of the Druidic religion to represent their supposed adherence to Lugius, and higher unrest and a lower religious unity at first but they would receive a huge bump to their centralisation and civilisation level to compensate.

Only the most 'notable tribes' of the Lugian federation were chosen. According to Tacitus: Naharvalia, Helveconia, Haria, Manimia and Helisia. Burgundia was added to this list based on their later fame. Silingia and Buria were left out, as their whereabouts are obfuscated by the archaeology (disappearance of the Gubin group in the 1st century BC, the area that was later occupied by Silingia) or written sources (Buria as part of the Lugians and as a Suebian speaking tribe).

Ptolemaios placed Helveconia to the north between Rugia and Burgundia, and Burgundia between the Oder and Vistula. The setup tries to reflect this by incorporating the relative position of Helveconia between those two tribes and by making Burgundia elongated. Burgundia was also reduced in size as Tacitus only mentioned the fice most notable tribes and the Burgundians were not among them. Naharvalia is placed in Silesia, as their grove might indicate a strong relationship with the Celts and the Zobtenberg (a religous centre of the region) lies in that region – Ptolemy also placed a town called Lugidunum in this area. Helisia was placed around modern day Kalisz as other evidence is absent, and Manimia below Burgundia based on Ptolemaios. Haria was then placed in the last remaining area west of the Vistula. Sciria and Bastarnia are placed to the Vistula's east in order to facilitate their early migration towards the Black Sea.

In general, there should be some Suebian/Herminonic pops in 300 BC in Poland, but they should never make up a citiy's majority (maybe 1 out of 5 pops in the areas where Jastorf settlements were found).

Sources

Barrord, Kobylinski, Krasnodebski (1991) ”Between the Slavs, Balts and Germans: Ethnic problems in the archaeology and history of Podlasie” - Archaeologia Polonia v.29 1991
Kaliff, Anders (2001). ”Gothic Connections. Contacts between eastern Scandinavia and the southern Baltic coast 1000 BC – 500 AD”
Kessler, P L. "Kingdoms of the Germanic Tribes - Goths / Ostrogoths" - www.historyfiles.co.uk
Amber Route Map - https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Amber_Route_Map.jpg
Ryszard Naglik 2005, Archaeological Motorway
Roger Batty, 2008 ”Rome and the Nomads. The Pontic-Danubian Realm in Antiquity” - Oxford University Press
Odry UNESCO world heritage site
Emilia Smółka ”The presence of spurs in the south-eastern Baltic area in the Roman Iron Age and Migration Period – some remarks” - ISSN 1392-6748
Zbigniew Bukowski 1990, ”Critically about the so-called Amber Route in the Odra and Vistula River basins in the Early Iron Age” Archaeologia Polona vol. 28:1990
Piotr Kaczanowski, Janusz Krzysztof Kozłowski, 1998 Najdawniejsze dzieje ziem polskich (do VII w.) (Oldest history of Polish lands (until the 7th century))
Jacek Poleski, Andrzej Chwalba ”Kalendarium dziejów Polski (Chronology of Polish History)”
Arkadiusz Dymowski The Use of Celtic and Roman Coins in the Territory of Poland at the Turn of the Era: in Tandem or Separately? New Finds, New Evidence
The Past Societies. Polish lands from the first evidence of human presence to the early Middle Ages", vol. 4: "500 BC - 500 AD" (ed. A. Rzeszotarska-Nowakiewicz), Warszawa 2016, pp. 71-110.
 
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vanin

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Scandinavia in 303BC

This post details the history of Scandinavia during the time frame depicted in Imperator: Rome. Spoiler tags added for readability.

Definition

Depending on who you ask, Scandinavia can mean different things. In English it is often conflated with the other term ”the Nordic countries” which refers to Sweden, Denmark, Norway, Finland, Iceland and the Faroe Islands – and more recently sometimes also Estonia. In Scandinavia the term is more commonly used for only Sweden, Denmark and Norway, but there is another definition which is the Scandinavian Peninsula. There is also the more vague ”Fennoscandia” which also includes Finland and Russian Karelia and Kola.

For the sake of simplicity ”Scandinavia” will in this text refer to only the peninsula and not also Denmark. Denmark will be referred to separately, as developments of the two regions diverged considerably and it is thus best to keep discussion on the two regions separate.

The Nordic Bronze Age (NBA) lasted from about 1800 BC to 500 BC. It is a period characterized by wealth, a warm climate and population growth. Contacts with the continent were strong, evidenced by the extensive usage of bronze whose constituents, copper and tin, were not easily attainable in Scandinavia at this time. People usually lived in single long-house farmsteads, only rarely clustered into villages, and were skilled metalworkers and seafarers. They built monuments, burial mounds for their dead, carved and painted elaborate petroglyphs on rock surfaces. Bronze findings from this period are often richly ornamented with a distinct style. Gold finds are also common from this period, also having been imported from the continent. The generally accepted view of Scandinavia during the NBA is that it was a comparably rich period in the region's history.

However in the 6th century BC things began to change, and change drastically. The climate turned wetter and colder in the 7th century and by the 6th century tin and copper imports steadily dropped until around 500 BC when the bronze age can be said to have ended. This was not a rapid transition and must have occured over some generations, as bronze findings continue throughout the iron age. Why the trade contacts between Scandinavia and the continent broke down is not certain. Either the population learned to acquire and work iron and thus bronze lost its importance, or the trade network broke down which forced the Scandinavians to turn to iron. Either way the end result was that trade with the continent all but ceased, which affected the culture greatly. The pre-Roman Iron Age (pRIA) would be a much poorer, even destitute, period for Scandinavia which is reflected in the archaeological record.

Before the pRIA has often been dubbed a ”findless age” in Scandinavia, as the archaeological finds were so scant. Burials have traditionally been the most reliable source of archaeological finds used to characterise a culture, but pRIA Scandinavia almost had none of these. This was a big difference from the NBA, and a regression compared to the preceding era is clear. However permanent settlement continued as people still often lived in isolated long-houses and they still cultivated their fields. Here we can compare to Denmark, which throughout the NBA developed at a similar pace as Scandinavia, but in the pRIA began to form larger villages and the isolated farmsteads became less common, and trade with the continent was never discontinued. In fact, southern Jutland and Fyn would be anchored in the growing Jastorf cultural sphere.

In later years the archaeological focus has seen a shift from burials to habitation sites. This has drastically improved the understanding of early iron age Scandinavia, and settlements are also considered to have been somewhat mobile, with villages moving to better arable land from time to time. In general there is a strong continuity between the NBA and pRIA – the people were largely the same just living under worse conditions. This is exemplified by how the population declined during the early iron age, as much farmland in f.e. southern Sweden appears to have been left uncultivated and been reclaimed by the forests.

Around 200 BC the climate would again become drier and hotter, which improved conditions for agriculture. Social stratification was allowed to form as it had during the NBA, but clear evidence of this would not be apparent until the early RIA, when Roman items began to flow into the country, then being items clearly favoured by the recovering elites.

This is further evidenced by the introduction of weapon burials in Scandinavia in the late pRIA, where Gotland has many graves containing single-bladed swords and shield-bosses resembling finds in Oksywie territories. On mainland Sweden instead lances are often found, indicating that warriors on horseback could have been prominent, with most graves being located in Östergötland, Västergötland and Södermanland. Öland stands out due to having a disproportionate amount of graves to its size, with contents similar to Gotland. In Norway the situation is a bit more muddled, but there are finds in areas roughly corresponding to the Oslofjord, Agder and Trondelag.
weapon_deposits_RIA.png
Weapon deposits throughout Scandinavia, Roman Iron Age.

Another feature which began to develop in Scandinavia during the late pRIA is the maintenance of hillforts. The use for these would reach their peak during the migration period but some came into use within the game's time frame, and are a distinct feature of the Scandinavian landscape today. The hillforts in Sweden are concentrated in the areas described above, as the appended map shows, while other areas can be clearly distinguished as more poorly settled.
fornborgar.JPG
"Fornborgar" in Sweden, Roman Iron Age.

These locations of prominence are further reflected in the appended maps of Roman coin finds and weapon deposits, and show a stark contrast between Scandinavia and other nearby territories: Even by the RIA after a strong recovery, Scandinavia was behind the rest of Germanic Europe in population, trade and development.
Roman_coins_RIA_Scandinavia.png
Roman coinage hoards in northern Europe.

Now let us examine Denmark, which depending on where one looks the situation is very different. Sjaelland (Zealand) and Lolland almost parallell Scania in its development, which like the rest of Sweden was slow for most of the pRIA. Very few graves and settlements sites have been dug up here, indicating very small populations, even when compared to other parts of Scandinavia. By contrast the eastern Fyn and Jutland are much more enveloped in the southern Jastorf culture, which in time would influence and dominate non-Roman central Europe. These territories will be left to the specific post on the Jastorf culture, but the northern tip of Jutland has to be expanded upon here.

As mentioned a form of early urbanisation began in Denmark during the early pRIA, with houses becoming clustered into villages which stands in stark contrast to the NBA during which farmsteads were much more isolated. Also large man-made fortifications began to appear, such as at Borremose which measured 140m x 90m and was surrounded by a moat and earth mounds. Similar sites have been found elsewhere such as at Lyngsmose, but so far Borremose is the oldest, having been founded in the 4th century. Borremose's surroundings have also produced the richest archaeological finds, such as the Gundestrup cauldron and the three Borremose bog bodies.

These fortified sites of Jutland seem to have been abandoned in the late 2nd century BC however, which many take as to coincide with the famous migration of the Cimbri and Teutones at around that time. Other abandonments throughout central Europe could also be attributed to the movements of these two tribes, painting a picture of a turbulent end to the 2nd century BC.

Another important site is the one at Kraghede in Vendsyssel, whose distinct finds has coined the term ”Kraghede group”. This group is dated to the late pRIA and bears strong resemblence to the Przeworsk culture of Poland. In fact, in this period much of Jutland shows Przeworsk influences due to pottery finds, but only in northern Jutland is the distinct Przeworsk burial rite noted, if only for a brief time. These influences are believed to have arrived after the Cimbri and Teutones moved south, but might also have begun to seep in before that time.
kraghede_mertens.PNG
Kraghede group and Jastorf influence in Denmark.

One last thing to mention with regards to Denmark is the process of Latenization. There was a semi-sudden shift in ornaments in the middle pRIA from Halstatt types to the later La Tene ones, and pottery saw changes as well to styles more resembling those of La Tene. Some of these changes also reached Scandinavia, and proves just how strong the La Tene culture was as a foreign influence at this time. It is also clear proof of a strong, diverse and far-reaching trade network which one may not consider due to the relative backwardness of northern Europe compared to the Mediterranean basin.

Scandinavia was at the very periphery of the Roman world – a strange and near-mythological place, scarcely mentioned in literary sources. Strabo, Tacitus, Pliny and Ptolemy all mention and to some extent elaborate on the region and its peoples, but compared to their treatment of other regions it is very bare. Pytheas of Massalia is said to have sailed there in the 4th century BC, but his record does not survive and he is only refered to by later authors, who sometimes believed it to be a fabrication.

Let us begin with Strabo, Geographica 7.2.1: ”As for the Cimbri, some things that are told about them are incorrect and others are extremely improbable. For instance, one could not accept such a reason for their having become a wandering and piratical folk as this that while they were dwelling on a Peninsula they were driven out of their habitations by a great flood-tide; for in fact they still hold the country which they held in earlier times; and they sent as a present to Augustus the most sacred kettle in their country, with a plea for his friendship and for an amnesty of their earlier offences, and when their petition was granted they set sail for home; and it is ridiculous to suppose that they departed from their homes because they were incensed on account of a phenomenon that is natural and eternal, occurring twice every day. And the assertion that an excessive flood-tide once occurred looks like a fabrication, for when the ocean is affected in this way it is subject to increases and diminutions, but these are regulated and periodical. ”

Strabo strongly discounts the flooding hypothesis as a reason for the flight of the Cimbri, and he also notes that they still remained there the a century later. Strabo has a long section discussing the Cimbri but it is not prudent to include it all here.

Pliny references Pytheas of Massalia in his work, and quotes him as having encountered a tribe called the ”-utones” somewhere along the coast on his voyage who could be the later Teutones. Pliny also mentions a tribe in Scandinavia which he calls the ”Hileviones”, but there is no direct relation to tribes known later, except maybe in the name of the Swedish province Halland. This is however purely speculation.

Going on to Tacitus, he writes in Germania 37: In the same remote corner of Germania, bordering on the ocean dwell the Cimbri, a now insignificant tribe, but of great renown. Of their ancient glory widespread traces yet remain; on both sides of the Rhine are encampments of vast extent, and by their circuit you may even now measure the warlike strength of the tribe, and find evidence of that mighty emigration.

Tacitus mentions that the Cimbri border the ocean in a remote corner of Germania, which would line up with northern Jutland which has been pin-pointed by other authors later, such as Ptolemy.

Continuing in Germania 44: ”And now begin the states of the Suiones, situated on the ocean itself, and these, besides men and arms, are powerful in ships. The form of their vessels is peculiar in this respect, that a prow at either extremity acts as a forepart, always ready for running into shore. They are not worked by sails, nor have they a row of oars attached to their sides; but, as on some rivers, the apparatus of rowing is unfixed, and shifted from side to side as circumstances require. And they likewise honour wealth, and so a single ruler holds sway with no restrictions, and with no uncertain claim to obedience. Arms are not with them, as with the other Germans, at the general disposal, but are in the charge of a keeper, who is actually a slave; for the ocean forbids the sudden inroad of enemies, and, besides, an idle multitude of armed men is easily demoralized. And indeed it is by no means the policy of a monarch to place either a nobleman, a freeborn citizen, or even a freedman, at the head of an armed force.”

Some scholars believe part of this to be exaggerated or fabricated by Tacitus, as he makes a point of the peoples furthest away from Rome being those most enslaved by their rulers. However, we can still learn a lot from his account, such as the Suiones (almost certainly the later Svear – Swedes) being skilled sailors. The ships are also interesting, and a common interpretation is that they are early longships, if without sails. The Suiones must have aspired to some form of government, as several states and at least one king is referred to.

He continues in Germania 45: Closely bordering on the Suiones are the tribes of the Sitones, which, resembling them in all else, differ only in being ruled by a woman. So low have they fallen, not merely from freedom, but even from slavery itself. Here Suevia ends.

Again some likely embellishment by Tacitus, but there may have been a second people in Scandinavia called the Sitones who to Tacitus were similar to them. Who the Sitones were we have no good guesses for, but some believe they may have been proto-Sami, who would be to the north of the Suiones, but then they should not have been very alike.

Lastly, Germanica 46: The Fenni are strangely beast-like and squalidly poor; neither arms nor homes have they; their food is herbs, their clothing skins, their bed the earth. They trust wholly to their arrows, which, for want of iron, are pointed with bone. The men and the women are alike supplied by the chase; for the latter are always present, and demand a share of the prey.

The word Fenni, as well as the modern rendition Fin (e.g. Finland) are a Germanic invention used to describe a different, neighbouring population which to them lived by finding their sustenance. The root of Fenni is then ”the finders” and this shows how clearly from themselves the early Germanic peoples distinguished the Finno-Ugric populations near them. Tacitus seems to take some literary liberties when he describes them, but their defining trait is that they are hunters and gatherers, not agriculturalists, which lines up with the etymology of the term.

Claudius Ptolemy's Geography contains a decent description of Jutland: The Frissii occupy a position that lays near to the Boiusacteri, between them and the Amasion river. Next to these the lesser Cauchi near the Visurgios river. Then, the greater Cauchi near the Albios river and next to the throat of the Cimbrian peninsula, the Saxonii. In the western part of this peninsula and above the Saxonii, the Sigoulones, then the Sabaligii, then the Cobandi, while the Foundousi still further to the west of these, are more to the east of the Charoudi, while at the very north, the Cimbri.

Many of the tribes listed by Ptolemy have odd names not given in any other written source, but he does list the Cimbri as living in the northern extremity of his Cimbrian Peninsula, which he in the earlier section gives coordinates for. He mentions five more tribes in Jutland or its vicinity, being the Sigoulones, Sabaligii, Cobandi, Foundousi and the Charoudi, of which the last fought Caesar under Ariovistus (the Charudes).

Ptolemy also gives us the first mention of Scandinavia by name: ”To the east of the peninsula four called Scandia, three smaller being in the middle hold the position 41'30'', 58'0''. The greatest one and more to the east near the mouth of the Vistula river, while its western extremity holds the position 43'0'',58'0''. Its eastern extremity is 46'0'',58'0''. Its northern extremity is 44'30'',58'30''. Its southern extremity is 45'0'',57'40''. And this is called Scandia locally, and is occupied in the west by the Chaideini, in the east by the Fauona, and the Firaisi, and in the south by the Goutii and the Dauciones, and in the centre by the Leuoni.”

The peninsula refereed to is Jutland, and the three smaller of the four islands must be the Danish isands Fyn, Lolland and Sjaelland. The largest is dubbed ”Scandia” and Ptolemy describes its size and shape using coordinates – more on those later. He specifies a number of tribes, most of which do not have any clear equivalent to tribes of the region we know from later times.

The clearest tribe is that of the Goutii, which must be the Scandinavian ”Goths” that have given their name to parts of modern Sweden. These Goutii are otherwise first mentioned after having raided Frisia in the 6th entury AD, then dubbed ”Regnum Gutorum” in the Frankish source. The others are much more troublesome, but the Fauona and Firaisi could be renditions Fenni who dwelled in Scandinavia, aka Sami or even Finns considered they are located in the east. The Dauciones could if their name has been corrupted be an early mention of the Danes – some interpret their name as Danciones by Ptolemy. The Leuoni would be in the centre, but have no easy equivalent ready for usage, and the same goes for the Chaideni.

It is worth noting that Ptolemy's estimated size of Scandinavia is comically small, and the location is also quite wrong, having placed it straight north from the Vistula. It has been speculated that the island Ptolemy describes geographically is Gotland, due to its limited size and location, but its denizens are most likely too numerous to fit there. More to the point, knowing of Gotland but not of Scandinavia seems incredibly unlikely. It could be an error by Ptolemy, or he believed ”Scandza” to be much smaller than it actually is.

Many place an undeserved amount of weight on the account by Jordanes, which in turn is based on Cassiodorus. It is worth noting that Cassiodorus was a Roman statesman and scholar at the Ostrogothic court, while Jordanes himself was at least part Goth and wrote out of nationalistic vigor. Cassiodorus' account does not survive to our day, only Jordanes' does, which means that we don't know the quality of Cassiodorus' volumes. Let us examine the most commonly cited segments of Jordanes' Getica and see how it fits with what we know from archaeology and the other written sources.

Jordanes states that Scandza was the ancient, ancestral homeland of the Gothic peoples and that they arrived from there to the continent in three ships. The Goths then had the demi-god Zalmoxis as their king (who was worshipped as a god by the Thracians), warred with Agamemnon of Mycenae and sacked Troy. History seems to catch up with Jordanes when the Goths find themselves in Roman lands in the 4th and 5th centuries AD.

These are clearly fabrications, and as usual when part of or most of an account is so clearly falsified the rest should be scrutinized more closely as well. We know that Zalmoxis, if he ever lived, predate the Goths' presence anywhere near Thrace by almost a millennium, as he is first mentioned by Herodotus in the 5th century BC. The events of the Iliad, if they ever took place, are dated even earlier, most likely in the 13th century BC right before the bronze age collapse. This leaves us with the story of them leaving Scandza and landing on the continent, and Ptolemy seems to corraborate there being Goth-like people in Scandinavia by his mention of the Gouti, as do all later accounts regarding Scandinavia due to names of peoples and place names that are known to us today.

If the Gothic people did originate in Scandinavia, we need good proof of a transfer of material culture and population from Scandinavia to the continent. We know now that this does not exist, even if there are tendencies that could be used as an indication for it.

For example there were likely Scandinavians among the Goths of the Wielbark culture, due to the appearance of stone circles and stelae, a distinct Scandinavian feature in those times, near the Vistula estuary from around 70 AD. Mind that these appear in then newly settled territories east of the Vistula, not then core-Wielbark areas. People must have moved around the Baltic in those times as the trade networks between Scandinavia and continent had recovered after being severed at the end of the NBA, and items from both sides have been found on the other. Oksywie style weaponry found their way into Scandinavia and we know for sure where those items originate. Lastly Tacitus mentions how the Suiones were strong in ships, indicating naval prowess from which trade naturally follows. People most definately have moved around, and it is in that light Jordanes' account should be taken. Not that entire tribes moved and conquered foreign lands.

One could also read the Wielbark culture's lack of weapons in burials as related to the late introduction of weapon burials in Scandinavia. However note that Scandinavians likely did not avoid putting weapons in tombs out of want, as they did this in abundance later, but because they did not have the weapons in the first place or valued them too highly to be willing to lose them. By contrast the Wielbark culture occupied a territory where weapons were previously common in burials, surrounded by cultures that had practiced the same custom for centuries. Also by the time Wielbark came into being it had become common in Scandinavia to place weapons in tombs. Anyone propagating for a migration of people not preferring to bury weapons with their dead from Scandinavia to the Vistula has to explain where those people were for the century in-between.

In addition, one has to consider that Scandinavia was comparably destitute and elite burials from the pRIA are rare. The leadership required to forge a strong tribe ready to migrate to and conquer other lands is not evidenced in archaeology until later. This does not mean that it could not have happened or that tribal groups in Scandinavia did not exist (Tacitus' 1st century AD Suiones are cited as being under a strong king), just that it is unlikely. Instead we should look at the existing evidence, that people moving from Scandinavia to the continent in a natural search for greener pastures joined up with the Goths, and this could have informed the myth propagated by Jordanes.

What about movement in the other direction – what could have caused a second people on the Baltic to call themselves the same name as a people on the other side?

One could put forth emulation, but this argument does not hold much water. Ptolemy mentioned the Gouti long before the continental Gutones arose to any particular fame. Moreover there are no other good examples of Germanic tribes paying homage to another by assuming their name. The Suebi are often cited as an example by how suddenly a number of tribes in the migration period began calling themselves Suebi. But Suebi was an ethnic name, not a tribal one, and the Suebi confederation was just that; a confederation of tribes who used the umbrella term Suebi to define themselves. The Suebi of the migration period were collections of tribes of Suebi descent who reverted to use the term as tribal names lost their meaning. Roman authors also apply this distinction, never mentioning a Suebi tribe but instead referring to it as a name practically interchangable with Germani, which was a Roman term.

The other possibility derives from the speculation in the post about Poland in 303BC, and is religion. Gautr is known as an alternative name of Odin, and the proto-Germanic root for both the later Geats and Goths is *Gautaz. Perhaps, as argued previously, the name change to a derivation of Gaut was religious in nature and that the Scandinavian Geats, due to strong ties to the area around the Vistula through trade and migrants, adhered to this new warrior cult in the first century AD. In the end we can not know for sure, but one might place a Gouti tribe in south-central Scandinavia and a Gutones tribe on the Vistula estuary in the game.

One last note on Jordanes, he mentions the Heruli as having descended from Scandinavia and after being driven off by the Danes found themselves on the continent. However Jordanes also mentions that the Heruli name was invented when they dwelt on the Pontic steppes, Getica 117: Now the aforesaid race, as the historian Ablabius tells us, dwelt near Lake Maeotis in swampy places which the Greeks call hele; hence they were named Heluri". The battle between Heruli and Danes that he refers to may as such have occured later, in the migration period, not before or in the time-frame of Imperator: Rome. With this in mind the Heruli should not be in the game at all, as the tribe must have formed later when Germanics came to dominate the Pontic Steppe in the 3rd century AD.

Leaving Jordanes and the mess his account has caused, let us go on to another controversial, if less so, tribe: The Cimbri. Archaeology pinpoints a change in material culture in northern Jutland around the same time that the Cimbri migration is supposed to have taken place, but large-scale abandonments can be ruled out as habitation continued, and thus a full migration can not have occured. Instead a smaller group must have left, for whatever reason, and as they accrued military renown and wealth from raiding must have attracted warrior bands from other tribes they encountered. This is evidenced by leaders such as Boiorix and Lugius among the ranks of the Cimbri, who may have led Boian and Lugian additions respectively.

It is also unlikely that Gaius Marius destroyed the entire tribes of Teutones and Cimbri, as the Cimbri are still mentioned centuries later and many items of south-European origin have been found in bogs in northern Jutland. Evidently some must at some point have returned, before or after final defeat, carrying their plunder with them. This could also explain the comprehensive, if brief, arrival of Przeworsk material and customs at Kraghede. Lugian groups that attached themselves to the Cimbri, who at the end may have constitued a minority of the force bearing their name, could have ended up in northern Jutland after being defeated in northern Italy. Then they would have been assimilated by the surrounding populations a couple generations afterwards.

The Danish Isles is as mentioned an area just as difficult, archaeologically, as Scandinavia. But not only are finds there scant, the written sources do not mention any tribes there specifically. We may however make some parallels to later times and guess a tribe or two which could dwell on these islands. Tacitus does have a mention of the Eudoses who according to him also dwelt in Jutland, but our Jutland is a bit busy with the Teutones, Cimbri and Ambrones. Instead, one could interpolate the Eudoses as later arrivals in Jutland, and thus place them nearby, on the isles of Fyn, Sjaelland and Lolland.

The in-game setup

It was attempted to follow archaeological sub-groups as defined by Jes Martens for determining the border of tribes in Jutland. An assumption was made that Ptolemaios didn't know about the Suiones and Sithones because they were the furthest in the east and seperated from the Ptolemaic tribes, i.e. that Ptolemaios had only sources about the west coast. The Firaisi and Fauona were left out as they are assumed to be the hunter-gatherers of northern or eastern Fennoscandia, perhaps later Sapmi or Fins. Gotland was given to the Goutii, as it was a comparatiely densely populated area in the pRIA which the archaeological evidence suggests. Ptolemaios's Levoni might have been Plinius's Hilleviones, therefore the two tribes are seen as one and the same, and placed on the west coast of Sweden. This is based on the possibility that a sailor from north-western Germany (the place where Plinius spent much of his time and might have gained his information from) may first have reached Scandinavia by crossing the border between Skagerrak and Kattegat, which would place the Levoni on the coast to reflect Ptolemaios's centre. The Charidanei were placed around modern Oslo and the Danciones to their south. The name Danciones was chosen as there might have been a link between the tribe Ptolemaios mentioned and the later Danes, while the the ypsilon in the recorded Dauciones could have originally been a nu (they both look similar in Greek; ypsilon is transcribed as a U).

Sources

”The introduction of the weapon burial rite in Southern Scandinavia during the Late Pre-Roman Iron Age” - Jes Martens 2002
”Pre-Roman Iron Age Settlements in Southern Scandinavia” - Jes Martens 2010
”Refuge - fortified settlement - central place? Three years of archaeological investigations at the Borremose stronghold ” - Jes Martens 1994
”Fortified places in low-land Northern Europe and Scandinavia during the Pre-Roman Iron Age ” - Jes Martens 2007
”On the so-called Kraghede group. The Pre-Roman Iron Age in North Jutland and its connections with the Przeworsk Culture ” - Jes Martens 1994
"Weapons, Armament and Society. The Pre-Roman Iron Age on Zealand and in Scania" - Jes Martens 2011
Encyclopedia.com article and sources on the subject: https://www.encyclopedia.com/humani...ripts-and-maps/pre-roman-iron-age-scandinavia
 
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otaman1

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Very interesting. I like this. I learned a lot from reading this
 

Zerodv

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Nice thread!

These groups would then need a decision to change their cultural affiliation, as the Contact Zone might have joined La Tène if it hadn’t been for Caesar’s Bello Gallico and some Celtic rebels went to Germania after their revolt against the Romans failed.
I'm not so sure, the Belgae are said to be relatively recent migrants from beyond the Rhine and up to the Roman takeover we have a trend of migrations westwards towards Gaul or the Rhine at least.
In any case I think joining La Tene shouldn't mean becoming Celtic in game if we say Celtic and Germanic is a linguistic distinction.

For the Germanics, the condition could be tied to having a comparable civilisation and centralisation value like a Celtic neighbour, whereas the Celts could ‘degrade’ to Germanics by doing the reverse and reducing their civilisation value and centralisation. This should certainly hamper stability and take some time, i.e. a first larger bump and then a slow assimilation of the rest to the new culture and religion. A Celt becoming a German being less attractive is something that is also historical.
I like the idea from vanin of the Lugi being more Celtized people through the religious influence but if we divide Germanic from Celtic based on language then civilization value shouldn't play a role in of itself, especially if we have all those originally Celtic names for groups that later became Germanic, meaning that a fair amount of Celts did became Germanic and didn't even take that long for that process to happen after Caesar took Gaul.
Plus I don't think there would be a huge difference in civilization values between directly neighbouring people to warrant this mechanic.
 
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Palando

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Nice thread!
Thanks!
I'm not so sure, the Belgae are said to be relatively recent migrants from beyond the Rhine and up to the Roman takeover we have a trend of migrations westwards towards Gaul or the Rhine at least.
Archaeologists have tried finding signs of the migration described by Caesar for a long time, yet they haven't been able to find any and instead it seems that the majority of the populace can be traced back to the Bronze Age Urnfield system. There have been some speculations that a Celtic elite migrated into that area and subjugated this populace based on the appearance of Hunsrück-Eifel objects and elite graves. This is, as always, only speculative, but strontium analyses might shed some light on it, although the problem there is that the Hunsrück-Eifel culture was in the vicinity. The Hunsrück-Eifel culture is a sub-culture of late Halstatt and early La Tène, from which the 'Treverian culture' developed. The Treverians also boasted that they had some Germanic ancestry.

The problem is also that there is no clear break and no clear influence from outside of La Tène, south-eastern England and the closer Contact zone. Jastorf influence is not really existant in the Belgae territory. Now, this doesn't tell us much about language changes but it seems unlikely that Germanic would've been on the rise, while the Celtic south was the role model for most of these people.

In any case I think joining La Tene shouldn't mean becoming Celtic in game if we say Celtic and Germanic is a linguistic distinction.
The culture group system is binary in nature, so that we have to decide how we draw a line. The area seems to have been a linguistical transition zone or at least the varied name evidence (hydronomy, place names, personal names, tribal names, ...) points towards this. This is why I pointed towards the following:
"Otherwise in transitional regions, there might have been proper bi-lingual areas where two languages (or even more) were used on a daily basis. What were they? Probably calling them Celto-Germanic, Germano-Celtic or there like might be an appropriate way."
The difference between a complex and a simple social system coincides with the boundary of La Tène and is one possible way to get a clear split. Tribal names, however, aren't a well-defined criterion, as you also have Germanised Celtic names like the Chatti.

I like the idea from vanin of the Lugi being more Celtized people through the religious influence but if we divide Germanic from Celtic based on language then civilization value shouldn't play a role in of itself, especially if we have all those originally Celtic names for groups that later became Germanic, meaning that a fair amount of Celts did became Germanic and didn't even take that long for that process to happen after Caesar took Gaul.
Plus I don't think there would be a huge difference in civilization values between directly neighbouring people to warrant this mechanic.
Here we, again, have the question whether or not they were Celtic or Germanic but extrapolating from the first Roman sources where they were Germanic makes Germanic for the period before quite likely, too. If Celtic was the dominant and primary language, it would've certainly stayed that way for at least a few generations. Fast language changes aren't realistic (there are several examples from the Middle Ages until today).

In the case of the Lugian federation, the La Tène-isation went so far that Celtic eschatological views and ritual practices were adopted. A warrior elite and the high organisation necessary for mining sites are two things that distinguish it from the much simpler Jastorf culture. The transition to a Celtic religion didn't lead to a higher centralisation but they were contemporary effects. So the causation isn't: "Adopt Druidic -> Higher centralisation" but it is "Adopt Celtic way of life -> Higher centralisation and adopt Druidic".
 

imperial.

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Who was Germanic?

Inventing a culture is a deed not many can claim, but Caesar did exactly this in his Commentarii de Bello Gallico. There he simply called everyone from east of the Rhine Germanic opposed to the Gauls west of the Rhine.

What were they? Probably calling them Celto-Germanic, Germano-Celtic or there like might be an appropriate way. As they need to be part of one culture group for in-game purposes, we can look to archaeology and determine whether or not they were closer to one group or to another one.
The issue with this is It may go deeper then what caeser would like to have thought.. You see Germany and Italy are sort of the border between east and west. Long before the iron Age, there was a culture called the Corded ware culture from the North and mixed in the Middle of Germany with the Bell Beakers from the West, Creating what would eventually become the Hallstatt Celts as well as other derivatives. These then went into Belgae who swore they were Celts (which they are but their ancestors have some relation to Germanics) and also up into England, influencing the Western Bell Beakers, there changes to Stonehenge were made (This is still long before the Iron Age). You can see this with the differentiations in the cultures such as Round Houses on the west side as opposed to say Square Houses for Hallstatt etc.

Those who developed more from Corded ware Culture eventually became Germanics ( Square Houses )

Those who developed more from Bell Beakers Culture eventually became Celtic ( Round Houses )

Those from the Middle of Germany became Hallstatt Celts, others were La Tene Celts. ( Square Houses )

Yellow = Hallstatt, Green = La Tene, Brown = The inconvenience to closed minds.


I would like to add I'm only referring to culture not genetics and also it takes long time for culture to change so intermingling does occur, to what extent is a different story.



bell beaker yamnaya[1].jpg
The Bell Beaker Culture and Corded Ware Culture


The Corded ware, also known as the Battle - Axe Culture
 
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Palando

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The issue with this is It may go deeper then what caeser would like to have thought.. You see Germany and Italy are sort of the border between east and west. Long before the iron Age, there was a culture called the Corded ware culture from the North and mixed in the Middle of Germany with the Bell Beakers from the West, Creating what would eventually become the Hallstatt Celts as well as other derivatives. These then went into Belgae who swore they were Celts (which they are but their ancestors have some relation to Germanics) and also up into England, influencing the Western Bell Beakers, there changes to Stonehenge were made (This is still long before the Iron Age). You can see this with the differentiations in the cultures such as Round Houses on the west side as opposed to say Square Houses for Hallstatt etc.

Those who developed more from Corded ware Culture eventually became Germanics ( Square Houses )

Those who developed more from Bell Beakers Culture eventually became Celtic ( Round Houses )

Those from the Middle of Germany became Hallstatt Celts, others were La Tene Celts. ( Square Houses )

Yellow = Hallstatt, Green = La Tene Brown = The inconvenience to closed minds.


I would like to add I'm only referring to culture not genetics and also it takes long time for culture to change so intermingling does occur, to what extent is a different story.



View attachment 463872
Difussion of the Bell Beaker Culture


The Corded ware, also known as the Battle - Axe Culture
I'm not really sure what you want to imply and what your main message is.
It's also not possible to equate Early Bronze Age cultures with Iron Age cultures or continously trace back the latter to the former.
 

imperial.

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I'm not really sure what you want to imply and what your main message is.
1. The past shapes the present determines your future. It is information and understanding.

It's also not possible to equate Early Bronze Age cultures with Iron Age cultures or continously trace back the latter to the former.
2. So I wouldn't say 'equate' I would say 'Correlation', cultures either adapt and develop or are destroyed. Just as the Middle Age Kingdoms have correlation with Modern Age European States or there is Correlation between Anglo Saxons, England and Canada. I would say there is correlation within the Bronze Age and the Iron Age. Yes certainly.
 

Zerodv

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Archaeologists have tried finding signs of the migration described by Caesar for a long time, yet they haven't been able to find any and instead it seems that the majority of the populace can be traced back to the Bronze Age Urnfield system. There have been some speculations that a Celtic elite migrated into that area and subjugated this populace based on the appearance of Hunsrück-Eifel objects and elite graves. This is, as always, only speculative, but strontium analyses might shed some light on it, although the problem there is that the Hunsrück-Eifel culture was in the vicinity. The Hunsrück-Eifel culture is a sub-culture of late Halstatt and early La Tène, from which the 'Treverian culture' developed. The Treverians also boasted that they had some Germanic ancestry.
Well I wasn't thinking of some long distance migration, still the fact that it appears that a movement towards Gaul was the trend, I'd say a good amount of the contact zone would have ended up Germanic speaking, especially considering it probably already was in large part.

The problem is also that there is no clear break and no clear influence from outside of La Tène, south-eastern England and the closer Contact zone. Jastorf influence is not really existant in the Belgae territory. Now, this doesn't tell us much about language changes but it seems unlikely that Germanic would've been on the rise, while the Celtic south was the role model for most of these people.
I'm not sure about this, we have plenty of attested linguistic change happening even when the arriving language was part of a group whose culture was being influenced by the native population.


The culture group system is binary in nature, so that we have to decide how we draw a line. The area seems to have been a linguistical transition zone or at least the varied name evidence (hydronomy, place names, personal names, tribal names, ...) points towards this. This is why I pointed towards the following:
"Otherwise in transitional regions, there might have been proper bi-lingual areas where two languages (or even more) were used on a daily basis. What were they? Probably calling them Celto-Germanic, Germano-Celtic or there like might be an appropriate way."
The difference between a complex and a simple social system coincides with the boundary of La Tène and is one possible way to get a clear split. Tribal names, however, aren't a well-defined criterion, as you also have Germanised Celtic names like the Chatti.
But I don't see why we should distinguish the cultures on the basis of societal system, otherwise we would start speaking of Arverni and other groups in southern Gallia Celtica as semi-Roman even before the Roman conquest, considering the changes in Gallic society the Roman influence helped creating, which isn't too bad from a gameplay perspective(the ties between Gauls and Romans pre-conquest helped with the further integration) but I'm not sure it makes sense to directly connect the 2.

The line in this case doesn't have to be drawn, insofar as the mechanic of culture change is necessary I would leave the choice to the player and make it so that it has no direct effect on your centralization or civilization value.

Here we, again, have the question whether or not they were Celtic or Germanic but extrapolating from the first Roman sources where they were Germanic makes Germanic for the period before quite likely, too. If Celtic was the dominant and primary language, it would've certainly stayed that way for at least a few generations. Fast language changes aren't realistic (there are several examples from the Middle Ages until today).
But even then the Celtic names of the various groups would either imply that some Celts were being Germanized during this period(300-50 BCE), I find that more likely than solely Germanic communities forming groups that bear Celtic names.

In the case of the Lugian federation, the La Tène-isation went so far that Celtic eschatological views and ritual practices were adopted. A warrior elite and the high organisation necessary for mining sites are two things that distinguish it from the much simpler Jastorf culture. The transition to a Celtic religion didn't lead to a higher centralisation but they were contemporary effects. So the causation isn't: "Adopt Druidic -> Higher centralisation" but it is "Adopt Celtic way of life -> Higher centralisation and adopt Druidic".
I mean this is fine, but the implication that adopting the celtic way of life means becoming linguistically Celtic isn't clear cut considering IOTL many things were adopted by the Germanic population and it still ended up with Germanic, in a linguistic sense, prevailing.

Even religion-wise, I don't think the position of Celts as big influencer in Germany and Poland means that their religion would necessarily spread with the other factors that make centralization and civilization value increase, I mean the Romans IOTL influenced Germany a lot and helped in altering their societal structure, but I wouldn't say the Germans of the 2nd or 3rd CE to be part of the Roman religion, even if some elements of their religion changed or possibly were created from that influence.
 
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Palando

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1. The past shapes the present determines your future. It is information and understanding.



2. So I wouldn't say 'equate' I would say 'Correlation', cultures either adapt and develop or are destroyed. Just as the Middle Age Kingdoms have correlation with Modern Age European States or there is Correlation between Anglo Saxons, England and Canada. I would say there is correlation within the Bronze Age and the Iron Age. Yes certainly.
There's certainly some correlation, but the further back you go, the less clear it becomes. There was an incredible amount of changes when and after the Yamnaya migrated into Europe. Your relation with the housing types implied that you think it had a longer-lasting effect in which house someone lived.

Well I wasn't thinking of some long distance migration, still the fact that it appears that a movement towards Gaul was the trend, I'd say a good amount of the contact zone would have ended up Germanic speaking, especially considering it probably already was in large part.

I'm not sure about this, we have plenty of attested linguistic change happening even when the arriving language was part of a group whose culture was being influenced by the native population.
The migrations of Celts from central Germany to Gaul you describe and Ariovistus's military expedition took part in the last century BC. You'd need to postulate that the Chatti, Batavia and so on would've reconsidered speaking Celtic within a few years and started speaking Germanic only. Before the aforementioned events, you only have the possibility of singular migrants that assimilated fast. There are actually discussions whether the reverse was true, i.e. few Celts migrating to the north but it's not a necessity as long as there are no DNA/strontium analyses.

But I don't see why we should distinguish the cultures on the basis of societal system, otherwise we would start speaking of Arverni and other groups in southern Gallia Celtica as semi-Roman even before the Roman conquest, considering the changes in Gallic society the Roman influence helped creating, which isn't too bad from a gameplay perspective(the ties between Gauls and Romans pre-conquest helped with the further integration) but I'm not sure it makes sense to directly connect the 2.

The line in this case doesn't have to be drawn, insofar as the mechanic of culture change is necessary I would leave the choice to the player and make it so that it has no direct effect on your centralization or civilization value.
You have to assign every pop a culture and a culture group. That's how the game works. Making it a choice for a player doesn't work if you don't have a player in the region. There's also the thing that you have to shoehorn the AI in choosing a particular group, as otherwise you'd get a messy situation.

Choosing the tribal names is a poisonous way, as you'd need to start making Jutland Celtic, too. The Teutons' name can only be explained with a Celtic root. We also don't know if a name came into being as an endonym or as an exonym, etc pp.
But even then the Celtic names of the various groups would either imply that some Celts were being Germanized during this period(300-50 BCE), I find that more likely than solely Germanic communities forming groups that bear Celtic names.
There's also the possibility of exchange. Celtic could've been a prestige language for these people, they could've just spoken a Germanic heavilly influenced by Celtic (or the other way round) or could've been bilingual (which also includes the former possibility to a part). Ariovistus is probably one of the most famous examples of a person being able to speak both languages.
I mean this is fine, but the implication that adopting the celtic way of life means becoming linguistically Celtic isn't clear cut considering IOTL many things were adopted by the Germanic population and it still ended up with Germanic, in a linguistic sense, prevailing.

Even religion-wise, I don't think the position of Celts as big influencer in Germany and Poland means that their religion would necessarily spread with the other factors that make centralization and civilization value increase, I mean the Romans IOTL influenced Germany a lot and helped in altering their societal structure, but I wouldn't say the Germans of the 2nd or 3rd CE to be part of the Roman religion, even if some elements of their religion changed or possibly were created from that influence.
The concept was to only change the religion, while the culture stays Vandalic. Now, there aren't only burials and rituals that one can bring forth for the Lugians. Their very name is based on the Celtic god Lugos. Those Celtic influences were also visible way after most of the Celts were conquered by Caesar and Augustus, by the way.

Jastorf and the Suebi are quite remarkable for being resilient to new technologies and influences from outside. Their La Tène-isation was solely based on adopting new forms into their pottery and buying new goods, while they choose not to adapt the technologies. I have linked a quite nice article (sadly in German but you told me that you can read it) about the whole concept of Jastorf and the Suebians (one can interpret it in the same way like the Polynesian mana concept): https://www.academia.edu/34242865/Die_Latènisierung_der_Jastorfkultur._Kulturkontakt_als_Folge_germanischer_Raum-Zeit-Konzeptionen
 

Zerodv

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The migrations of Celts from central Germany to Gaul you describe and Ariovistus's military expedition took part in the last century BC. You'd need to postulate that the Chatti, Batavia and so on would've reconsidered speaking Celtic within a few years and started speaking Germanic only. Before the aforementioned events, you only have the possibility of singular migrants that assimilated fast. There are actually discussions whether the reverse was true, i.e. few Celts migrating to the north but it's not a necessity as long as there are no DNA/strontium analyses.
I'm not sure what you mean exactly, but IMO even small groups of migrants would have had enough demographic weight in iron age Germania to affect things.

If Celts migrated North wouldn't we see more clear cut La Tene presence where they went? I'd say Germans(Jastorf too) migrating south-west would probably be more likely to be archaeologically untraceable than La Tene Celts.
You have to assign every pop a culture and a culture group. That's how the game works. Making it a choice for a player doesn't work if you don't have a player in the region. There's also the thing that you have to shoehorn the AI in choosing a particular group, as otherwise you'd get a messy situation.
Well the pop culture composition at the start can follow societal complexity and so on, but the AI doesn't need to be shoehorn even if culture change is not tied to civilization value and centralization, it can simply choose by factoring their demographics and neighbours.

Choosing the tribal names is a poisonous way, as you'd need to start making Jutland Celtic, too. The Teutons' name can only be explained with a Celtic root. We also don't know if a name came into being as an endonym or as an exonym, etc pp.
Why? The Teuto- suffix AFAIK should have cognates around many PIE languages, Germanic too. It's clear that it has to be either pre-Grimm's Law or has been transmitted through Celtic and then Roman/Greek pronunciation and hears.

On the point of endonyms/exonyms, I think Greeks attested the Teutones outside their involvement with the Cimbrian war, so I think it shouldn't have been an exonym, or at least it would seem weird that it would consistently have been the same for the different groups it came into contact if it was.

There's also the possibility of exchange. Celtic could've been a prestige language for these people, they could've just spoken a Germanic heavilly influenced by Celtic (or the other way round) or could've been bilingual (which also includes the former possibility to a part). Ariovistus is probably one of the most famous examples of a person being able to speak both languages.
Maybe it's a wrong assumption, but I think the fact that proto-Germanic doesn't seem to generally have had that many Celtic loanwords maybe indicates that while bilingualism and mixed areas exists, they don't necessarily were that widespread. Same argument goes with Celtic as a prestige language, it's clear it influenced the region geopolitically and technologically(well at least pre-la tene), but the regions doesn't strike me as heterogenous enough to warrant the usage of Celtic as a lingua franca nor does the region in this era strike me as one that would give rise to a prestige language by contact

The concept was to only change the religion, while the culture stays Vandalic. Now, there aren't only burials and rituals that one can bring forth for the Lugians. Their very name is based on the Celtic god Lugos. Those Celtic influences were also visible way after most of the Celts were conquered by Caesar and Augustus, by the way.
No no, I agree that it makes sense for the Lugians, I just don't think that models needs to apply to all people.

Jastorf and the Suebi are quite remarkable for being resilient to new technologies and influences from outside. Their La Tène-isation was solely based on adopting new forms into their pottery and buying new goods, while they choose not to adapt the technologies. I have linked a quite nice article (sadly in German but you told me that you can read it) about the whole concept of Jastorf and the Suebians (one can interpret it in the same way like the Polynesian mana concept): https://www.academia.edu/34242865/Die_Latènisierung_der_Jastorfkultur._Kulturkontakt_als_Folge_germanischer_Raum-Zeit-Konzeptionen
I will read it, but I wonder what's meant by technology in this case.
 
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Palando

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I'm not sure what you mean exactly, but IMO even small groups of migrants would have had enough demographic weight in iron age Germania to affect things.
First of all, the population estimate is around one million for Germanic Germany and the Netherlands. Archaeologically, you can only find singular migrants. This obviously doesn't rule out people migrating and assimilating during their life, but it hardly was a mass phenomenon.

If Celts migrated North wouldn't we see more clear cut La Tene presence where they went? I'd say Germans(Jastorf too) migrating south-west would probably be more likely to be archaeologically untraceable than La Tene Celts.
There are some singular finds of Jastorf, La Tène or Przeworsk graves in NW Germany, yet they are nowhere near of being significant. What you are suggesting is that there was some 'invisible influence' by migrants who abandoned everything but their language, and somehow managed superimposing that language on the local people.

Well the pop culture composition at the start can follow societal complexity and so on, but the AI doesn't need to be shoehorn even if culture change is not tied to civilization value and centralization, it can simply choose by factoring their demographics and neighbours.
But they have to start with a culture. You cannot just put them on the map and choose ??? as their culture. And the culture has to be part of one culture group. This is how the game works and I doubt anybody would want to change it all just because no one can really place them anywhere without a doubt.
Why? The Teuto- suffix AFAIK should have cognates around many PIE languages, Germanic too. It's clear that it has to be either pre-Grimm's Law or has been transmitted through Celtic and then Roman/Greek pronunciation and hears.

On the point of endonyms/exonyms, I think Greeks attested the Teutones outside their involvement with the Cimbrian war, so I think it shouldn't have been an exonym, or at least it would seem weird that it would consistently have been the same for the different groups it came into contact if it was.
The Teutons' name is another one of those fringe cases.

Both the Cimbrians and Teutons were attested by Roman and Greek writers in the 1st and 2nd century AD at a time when we know that Grimm's law had applied, e.g. Ptolemaios mentions the Charudes right next to the Cimbri, although their name should've been Chimbri by that time. Either all ancient authors deliberately chose to do so or neither the Teutons nor the Cimbri adopted Grimm's Law.


Maybe it's a wrong assumption, but I think the fact that proto-Germanic doesn't seem to generally have had that many Celtic loanwords maybe indicates that while bilingualism and mixed areas exists, they don't necessarily were that widespread. Same argument goes with Celtic as a prestige language, it's clear it influenced the region geopolitically and technologically(well at least pre-la tene), but the regions doesn't strike me as heterogenous enough to warrant the usage of Celtic as a lingua franca nor does the region in this era strike me as one that would give rise to a prestige language by contact


No no, I agree that it makes sense for the Lugians, I just don't think that models needs to apply to all people.


I will read it, but I wonder what's meant by technology in this case.
I've never claimed that Celtic had influenced proto-Germanic as a whole. The area was probably far more widespread than you think, as e.g. ancient (more recent ones from the Middle Ages are excluded) Celtic place names can be found even up to Germany's North Sea coast. Note that areas with quite sharp breakpoints like the Netherlands and Bohemia can lose any Celtic influence quite easily.

Placenames.png
 

Zerodv

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There are some singular finds of Jastorf, La Tène or Przeworsk graves in NW Germany, yet they are nowhere near of being significant. What you are suggesting is that there was some 'invisible influence' by migrants who abandoned everything but their language, and somehow managed superimposing that language on the local people.
I never said that, I just said that not all movements would be as detectable archaeologically.

But they have to start with a culture. You cannot just put them on the map and choose ??? as their culture. And the culture has to be part of one culture group. This is how the game works and I doubt anybody would want to change it all just because no one can really place them anywhere without a doubt.
Well I said that at the start date it makes sense to base oneself on archaeology to make a distinction, but I don't think that we should have culture change from Germanic to Celtic or Celtic to Germanic have any effect on the civilization value or centralization.

The Teutons' name is another one of those fringe cases.

Both the Cimbrians and Teutons were attested by Roman and Greek writers in the 1st and 2nd century AD at a time when we know that Grimm's law had applied, e.g. Ptolemaios mentions the Charudes right next to the Cimbri, although their name should've been Chimbri by that time. Either all ancient authors deliberately chose to do so or neither the Teutons nor the Cimbri adopted Grimm's Law.
That's strange, in any case I'm not sure why Teutons can only be explained through Celtic.


I've never claimed that Celtic had influenced proto-Germanic as a whole. The area was probably far more widespread than you think, as e.g. ancient (more recent ones from the Middle Ages are excluded) Celtic place names can be found even up to Germany's North Sea coast. Note that areas with quite sharp breakpoints like the Netherlands and Bohemia can lose any Celtic influence quite easily.
Those toponyms are weird, from one side they don't seem to exist for some reason in Northern Italy or even much of Southern Germany, on the other they appear in pockets in Northern Germany.
 

Palando

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I never said that, I just said that not all movements would be as detectable archaeologically.
I rather prefer Occam's razor.
Well I said that at the start date it makes sense to base oneself on archaeology to make a distinction, but I don't think that we should have culture change from Germanic to Celtic or Celtic to Germanic have any effect on the civilization value or centralization.
In fact, I suggested the opposite, namely that the civilisation value would be the requirement.
That's strange, in any case I'm not sure why Teutons can only be explained through Celtic.
Fringe case means that you can interpret it as both just like the Chauci's name. It's still remarkable that no author ever had the form Chimbri or Tuitones.

Those toponyms are weird, from one side they don't seem to exist for some reason in Northern Italy or even much of Southern Germany, on the other they appear in pockets in Northern Germany.
As I've mentioned there, they are specifically "ancient Celtic place names", i.e. names like Paris wouldn't be counted (medieval name but Celtic). Italy has a quite low density in general for such ancient names but there are some more which date to a later period. In Germany, a lower standard was applied as there are no written records from antiquity.
 

Zerodv

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I rather prefer Occam's razor.
Well one has to explain what happened somehow, a large mixed area, prestige language and so on aren't exactly that much simpler or self-evident things, AFAIK from what I gather a lot of important migrations(like the sack of Delphi) wouldn't have been that noticeable without written accounts.

In fact, I suggested the opposite, namely that the civilisation value would be the requirement.
What about this:

whereas the Celts could ‘degrade’ to Germanics by doing the reverse and reducing their civilisation value and centralisation. This should certainly hamper stability and take some time, i.e. a first larger bump and then a slow assimilation of the rest to the new culture and religion. A Celt becoming a German being less attractive is something that is also historical.
It's functionally the same, you basically tie culture change to civilization value, but I'm not sure how much sense it makes from a player's perspective.

Fringe case means that you can interpret it as both just like the Chauci's name. It's still remarkable that no author ever had the form Chimbri or Tuitones.
One could interpret many names if one wanted too, but honestly I don't think it makes sense to assume that Jutland of all places would have harbored that kind of Celtic influence that would have lead to an entire group with a Celtic name.

One can show that there is more than on etymology but I think it should be done only when it makes sense too, like in border areas or where historical accounts indicate a potential ethnic affiliation of a group.

As I've mentioned there, they are specifically "ancient Celtic place names", i.e. names like Paris wouldn't be counted (medieval name but Celtic). Italy has a quite low density in general for such ancient names but there are some more which date to a later period. In Germany, a lower standard was applied as there are no written records from antiquity.
It's especially weird considering the Easternmost pocket, this place was a frontier zone between Slavs and Germans in the middle ages and thus experienced many changes up to today, so that's pretty unexpected. The Danish-Frisian coast is also weird, I'd have thought that the changing coast would have not allowed the existence of very old toponyms, like it seem to have done for most of the North-sea coast.
 

Zerodv

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Also, from what I gather, I thought that at least the Bastarnae should have come from an area a bit closer to the Jastorf area:

https://www.academia.edu/17437138/E...lska._Import_of_ideas_or_migration_of_peoples

The material presented in this paper allows us to assume that there were newcomers from the Jastorf area who indeed appeared in Wielkopolska and settled down there, as it was suggested by Kostrzewski, rather than imported ideas from that area. It seems reasonable to interpret this north-western element in Wielkopolska as a result of migration of Bastarnae and Scirii as mentioned in written sources, which supposedly led to the emergence of the PoieneştiLukaševka culture. It concurred with the mass migration of Jastorf communities from the main area to Wielkopolska and the presence of Przeworsk material in assemblages of this group as well.
This might mean that either the Przeworsk communities took part in the migration, or that some Przeworsk elements had been earlier adopted by the arriving Jastorf peoples. Wielkopolska, with the Noteć and Warta Rivers running westwards would have been a natural passage for settlers moving eastwards. It would explain the appearance of communities of the Jastorf culture there, contrary to central Pomerania with its southward running rivers, where the Jastorf tribes did not settle, despite neighbourhood to settlements of the Nadodrzańska group of the Jastorf culture. The route along the Warta and Noteć Rivers might have been attractive too because of less dense settlement as can be observed towards the end of the early pre-Roman Iron Age along the Oder river, where Celtic settlements could have been a sort of barrier for the migrating communities. The late Pomeranian communities might have had an if not benevolent then at least neutral relation towards them. That probably might have been due to former contacts and sort of a kinship, reflected in similar assemblages, but surely mainly as a result of former arrangements. It was an important issue during the migration of groups of settlers, consisting not exclusively of warriors, as they were during wars or raids. An interesting issue in interpreting the settlements of the Jastorf culture in Wielkopolska is the problem of the Bastarnae mentioned in written sources.
Such a Bastarnaen element could help to explain the differences within the assemblages of the Jastorf culture as can be observed in Wielkopolska referring to its various local groups occupying areas from Jutland to Hannover and Brandenburg. If we assume that indeed Bastarnae constituted a sort of conglomeration of outcasts – bastards, emerging from various tribes of the Jastorf culture, it is not surprising to find elements bearing characteristic features of several delimited groups on the sites in Wielkopolska.
It might be even worth trying to trace the process of emerging of this initial group, which dared to seek happiness outside its homeland.
Edit: I wouldn't put them on the Elbe, but maybe somewhere in Western Poland still rather than immediately near the region they were to migrated towards.
 

Palando

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Well one has to explain what happened somehow, a large mixed area, prestige language and so on aren't exactly that much simpler or self-evident things, AFAIK from what I gather a lot of important migrations(like the sack of Delphi) wouldn't have been that noticeable without written accounts.
You have to assume that somehow invisible migrants changed the language but not the archaeological record. The material from that region is as varied as confusing, making it impossible to properly assess it.

Regarding to migration: In economically successful regions around Central Europe, there were up to 10% foreigners in such regions. Some stayed, some migrated somewhere else; just like some residents migrated somewhere else and some migrants became residents. A large population replacement didn't take place anywhere in NW Germany during that period, though. You can thus not take it as an explanation for a major language shift. Some linguists have argued that North-Sea Germanic developed from 'Brythonic speakers mispronouncing Germanic' in the RIA, but the lack of written sources from that area makes it hard to assess.

It's functionally the same, you basically tie culture change to civilization value, but I'm not sure how much sense it makes from a player's perspective.
From a gameplay perspective, there has to be some form of requirement, as otherwise every player would go for continental Celtic. It's a far larger culture group with far more pops than Germanic.

One could interpret many names if one wanted too, but honestly I don't think it makes sense to assume that Jutland of all places would have harbored that kind of Celtic influence that would have lead to an entire group with a Celtic name.

One can show that there is more than on etymology but I think it should be done only when it makes sense too, like in border areas or where historical accounts indicate a potential ethnic affiliation of a group.
The thing is that southern Jutland at least had some Celtic influence based on Celtic nameplaces. That doesn't necessarily mean those names came into use in the late pRIA. So one cannot simply disregard it altogether, especially as there's some more Celtic influence visible to the south-east of Jutland. All of the North-Sea coast was part of a trade zone with the Brythonic south-east of England, i.e. some forms of contacts existed between these people.
It's especially weird considering the Easternmost pocket, this place was a frontier zone between Slavs and Germans in the middle ages and thus experienced many changes up to today, so that's pretty unexpected. The Danish-Frisian coast is also weird, I'd have thought that the changing coast would have not allowed the existence of very old toponyms, like it seem to have done for most of the North-sea coast.
Those names are there and one can speculate how they came there (and how many former Celtic names were replaced). There are also some speculations regarding the Schnippenburg, as some claim it was a centre from which Celts ruled the surrounding land.
Also, from what I gather, I thought that at least the Bastarnae should have come from an area a bit closer to the Jastorf area:

https://www.academia.edu/17437138/E...lska._Import_of_ideas_or_migration_of_peoples



Edit: I wouldn't put them on the Elbe, but maybe somewhere in Western Poland still rather than immediately near the region they were to migrated towards.
I would like to put this into perspective with the following (from https://www.academia.edu/37471979/W...pe._The_historical_background_3rd_-_1st_c._BC ). The thing with the Bastarnae and Scirri is that they probably only formed in modern Ukraine. The findings are varied and there's no clear location where you could put them.
The distribution range of several categories of finds shows that the route taken towards the coast of the Black Sea by a population established earlier in northern and central Europe led through the lands of present-day Poland. Most likely these migrations did not come down to an individual act – i.e., to the single migration of a specific group of people. There is every indication that in the 3rd and the 2nd c. BC a vast region stretching between the North Sea and the Baltic Sea at one end and the Black Sea at the other became an arena of migrations made by many Germanic groups moving east and south-east. Some of these groups – particularly those originating from the northern zone of the Jastorf culture (esp. Jutland) – took up residence in the territory of Poland. Others – mostly those from the Elbe – continued on their way, reaching eastern Romania, Moldova, and western Ukraine (cf. Grygiel 2013: 46).
[...]
The Bastarnae and the Scirii, moving as they did south-eastward, must have passed through the territory of present-day Poland. Their itinerary presumably led through the valleys of large rivers which cross the country from the west to the east (Warta, middle Vistula, Bug), for it is in this region that we find the largest number of finds identified with Jastorf culture (Fig. 1). However, the finds from Poland are characteristic first and foremost for Jutland, whereas the ‘Bastarnian’ Poieneşti-Lukaševka culture represents a model which is known primarily from the area in the lower and the middle drainage of the Elbe (Babeş 1993; cf. Grygiel 2013: 45–46). On the other hand, crown-shaped neckrings and some vessel forms known from eastern Romania, Moldova, and western Ukraine resemble finds recorded in Poland. Thus, it is quite likely that the tribe of the Bastarnae residing to the east of the arc of the Carpathians also included some groups of settlers – presumably earlier arrivals from Denmark and northern Germany to the region in the Odra and the Vistula drainage. The diversified background of the representatives of this people may also have found reflection in the name under which it was recorded by ancient authors (‘bastards’?). On the other hand a possible echo of the presence of the Scirii on the territory of Poland is a piece of information recorded in the 1st c. AD by Pliny the Elder in his monumental work
Naturalis Historia who mentioned their presence near the Vistula (Kolendo, Płóciennik 2015: 131, 152–154).
 

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You have to assume that somehow invisible migrants changed the language but not the archaeological record. The material from that region is as varied as confusing, making it impossible to properly assess it.
Well it's not a crazy assumption all things considered, I mean the Przewrosk and Jastorf culture surely did not host as many Germanic linguistic groups at their start as they did later and yet there is continuity. Plus like I said, it's no or at least it doesn't have to be at the level of population replacement or be some kind of invisible Cimbri-like migration.

Some linguists have argued that North-Sea Germanic developed from 'Brythonic speakers mispronouncing Germanic' in the RIA, but the lack of written sources from that area makes it hard to assess.
I question this theory on the basis that the substratum or adstratum of Celtic in proto-Germanic and its immediate offspring should be far more present than it appears to be.

Those names are there and one can speculate how they came there (and how many former Celtic names were replaced). There are also some speculations regarding the Schnippenburg, as some claim it was a centre from which Celts ruled the surrounding land.
Given you mentioned lower standards for Germany, maybe those easternmost toponyms around the Elbe came from the Ostsiedlung through settlers from Wallonia, Eastern France and the Rhineland, the results are so over the place that it's impossible to extract any kind of assumptions from the ancient era from it, at least in this form. I find it neat that is shows possibly the influence of the Galatians, Pontic Celts and possibly the location of Tys but it's still hard to interpret as it is.