FTL Discussion Thread

[LambTaco]

People don't like having choices taken away from them. It's as simple as that.

 

[OverthinkingThis]

At the end of the day taking away options for a player is always a sour note for a game. No matter how well it turns out or how many new things you bring in something will feel absent to at least some of the players. Anytime they notice it after said change it will simply make them hate the change more ("Man I wish I could warp over there OH WAIT"). We (humans) are wired to notice and remember bad things significantly more than good, and unfortunately this change will end up killing the game for some because of that. Which is unfortunate but I can't say I don't understand the feeling (League of Legends....).

 

[Ketilsen]

This is a great suggestion, and I hope the devs consider doing something like this. I've no idea how hard it is technically, though.

 

[Philthy]

Absolutely

 

[jazzglands]

I was listening to the design stream today, and they were talking about the FTL changes as they relate to exploration and space geography and 'choke points' and so on, and got to thinking if we're going down that route (*mutter mutter*), should the entire hyperlane network by visible from the start, or should you have to discover it as you explore new systems?

I think if they did that it that way it would give a new impetus to exploration, because you'd need to map out your local region of space to plan your expansion properly and it would also give a sense of uncovering the layout of the galaxy, rather than just magically knowing it as soon as you, as a species, figure out how hyperlanes work.

On the other hand, hiding information from the player working on the theory that they'll go and uncover can in practice just lead to frustration and guesswork. I imagine it would be a bit annoying to expand in one way, only to discover some quirk of the hyperlane layout that would have made you do it entirely differently had you known about it from the start.

Opinions?

I'm leaning more toward the "frustrating guesswork" element of this. Seeking out colonies/resources/anomalies is impetus enough to explore, and deciding where to explore (to find hyperlanes) before you decide where to explore (to find resources and checkout colonizable worlds) would be kinda gilding the lily. Deciding where and how to expand is pretty central to the game, and the *extra* exploration on top of the exploration we already do might just feel like busywork before you can get to this other geography-based strategic planning.

I like the "feel" of a quest to find the Space-Northwest Hyper-Passage, but making it a part of everyday play feels like it would be overkill. Maybe you could make something that feels like this as a quest chain to activate a gateway or something.

 

[Garfazz Steamfang]

For my the FTL rework was a necessity since the release. It's a part of the problem that make warfare uninteresting and boring. I'm glad to see they are finally doing the right changes... but we will need to see how it work in game.

 

[Riftwalker]

Gone are guerilla campaigns to destroy all of your enemies' mining stations and counting on your different FTL type to keep you ahead of the enemy doomstack. If your fleet is smaller, you've already lost, haven't you?

yes instead you now capture them to steal their resources, wooo. can't wait to sneak-jump over a small fleet to run rampant behind their lines and then hit their starport with my main fleet.

 

[Tim_Ward]

Another down side is it would drastically increase the amount of micromanagement your science ships required, as you can't really queue up orders effectively without knowing the route they're going to take.

Then again, that autoexplore button should never have been hidden behind a tech anyway

 

[Sheriff Godwin Law]

It should all be viewable. I use that to plot out multiple hyperlane jumps in the early game.

I know it sounds good to have to learn what the lane network looks like, but it seems like it will be too frustrating early on.

 

[Qoff]

If you read the dev diary the other warps aren't going away, they're just changing and not even in a bad way. I've seen two people say they purchased Stellaris because of the fact it had 3 types of FTL instead of one, or that they want a refund because of these changes and plenty others saying how disappointing or saddened they are..

A bit dramatic, a bit idiotic to say the least. These changes do not harm roleplay, if anything it adds more. Being able to find random wormholes that could take you across the galaxy?! Hell YES. If that doesn't enhance the roleplay I don't know what will, not only does that present roleplay opportunities but it also adds a strategic opportunity. The idea of sending a fleet through a wormhole, entering some distant unexplored system full of squishy aliens while having aggressive first contact policies just makes me moist. On top of that, we are essentially getting the ability to create our own Mass relays/star gates.. Who can honestly tell me that isn't cool as heck.

Stepping back from the roleplay thing, war is an integral part of the game. The unfortunate thing is that as it stands war is boring, tedious and .. did I mention boring? Bigger number always wins in the meta right now, and the current 'one fight to end all fights' way the game plays right now is super unsatisfying, wars don't feel rewarding they just feel like mindless clicking with the most interesting part being when the enemy fleets runs away and you briefly have to pay attention to where its going so you can send your ships there. With this change at least we have the opportunity to bait an enemy into a system where their shields are useless, while your ships are decked to the breasts with armour and your enemy is defenseless in that fight? Come on - that sounds awesome on it's own. Imagine fighting the Unbidden, or Fallen empires? Now there is something ELSE you can do besides spamming ships. There are advantages you could set yourself up for.

Having terrain advantages is amazing, on top of that we can expect planetary invasion changes and the current war goal system is going bye bye. Basically everything we related to wars that we have wanted changed since launch is being changed and people are complaining because to do it they had to change FTL. Note- the key word is CHANGE, not remove. It's still there, just different.

It is all so good, I am hyped. I can't wait to see the planet invasion changes and what they do to fix or change doomstacks.

Because people like to complain. The patch will add so may layers of dept in this game I can't even start to imagine how much complex it will become if we compare with the game right now and this is a freaking awesome thing.

 

[Twimak]

Whenever you remove something you are going to get a backlash. And when you remove entire playstyles you get a big backlash.

Dev says its needed on a fundamental level, but i haven't seen anything announced so far that fundamentally required the border change or removal of wormhole/warp. The goals aimed at with these changes are good, but the solution so far seems to be more the devs personal favorite/easiest, rather then the only possible one.

 

[kreissig]

people are complaining because to do it they had to change FTL. Note- the key word is CHANGE, not remove. It's still there, just different.

Warp is gone...removed....

 

[Miesha]

I'm not a fan of the changes because I preferred how Wormholes played out, personally. I made a post suggesting changes/alterations/upgrades to the various FTL methods but it got buried somewhere in the suggestion forum with just a single person going "lol devs already changing so this is pointless". After that I've not bothered trying to consider any way to improve or upgrade or change the game. If the changes are bad, I'll just stop playing. Simple as that.

 

[Princess Stabbity]

Seriously. Offering star chart trades is currently just shy of an act of war. Especially if I just click "accept" thinking it's an NAP.

I just treat it as an insult. Slightly less of a casus belli than someone plopping a frontier outpost in a small gap between 2 of my colonies but still enough to justify... scheduling fleet manoeuvres that just happen to be very close to the good neighbour's borders and may accidentally result in unfortunate damage to property.

 

[I_am_Nemo]

I'd prefer to keep the openess of approach and introduce some limitations via a need to replenish some kind of supply or organization. That would give you fronts and focus points to attack/protect, but without needing to force things into chokepoints. Fortifications would be for vital core worlds, or massive supply hubs; if the enemy was rampaging your outer colonies, well, you'd have to decide whether it was worth diverting ships from offensive duty to stop them. It would still mirror earth warfare, but of the naval kind.

As for what we're getting? Wait and see, I guess. I don't hate the current warfare, but it's not terribly fun, either. If this offers something better than "keep all your ships in one big fleet because if you lose half your fleet you'll lose the other half and it's game over," then I'm all for it.

 

[Tavior]

Because people like to complain, specially the snowflakes of this generation. The patch will add so may layers of dept in this game I can't even start to imagine how much complex it will become if we compare with the game right now and this is a freaking awesome thing.

I don't want to wait years before Paradox Interactive finally find a way to make multiple FTL type fun in the same way it took a 6 month before they finally downtune Ming after Mandate of Heaven.

Which is basically a valid criticism. If you can't see that. Then good luck I sincerely hope you enjoy your hyperlane limbo. Because this is pretty much a split the community apart thing for me. If you still want to call me a snowflakes feel free just don't come back and beg for me to come back when they revert FTL changes.

 

[Sheriff Godwin Law]

Actually, they're experimenting with removing corvette exploration. If they're going to force me to move a science ship to each and every world... then sure, why not hide the hyperspace lane.

 

[Riftwalker]

Because people like to complain

FTFY

 

[Draconaes]

Wars are pretty boring in the current version. I'm very much looking forward to them actually being interesting. Maybe I'll actually complete a game on the next patch.

 

[jazzglands]

Another down side is it would drastically increase the amount of micromanagement your science ships required, as you can't really queue up orders effectively without knowing the route they're going to take.

Then again, that autoexplore button should never have been hidden behind a tech anyway

If you're just going to automate all that trailblazing, it wouldn't be that different from having all the hyperlanes automatically show up at the beginning of the game.