Franco-Soviet treaty and the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact.

[Sunforged General]

If France goes with the Franco-Soviet treaty national focus, and the USSR accepts, why is the USSR still allowed to accept the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact? The two seem mutually exclusive, you can either promise no war with Germany with the non aggression pact, or promise you will defend France if Germany attacks it, but you cant promise both of those things at the same time!

Although this poses no problem in the game because if Germany attacks France while the treaty is active, USSR will go to war with Germany, even if the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact is in place. However, just for realism, I propose that accepting the Franco-Soviet treaty make it so the Molotov-Ribbentrop cannot be accepted by the Soviets.

 

[Cpt.Cross]

I agree, I found that the Soviets don't accept the French Pact if they have accepted the German one, maybe its an oversight?

 

[MattZed]

I've always felt it should block out the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact. Up until M-R was signed, the Soviet Union was actively negotiating with Britain and France on how to possibly contain German aggression. M-R was only signed with these talks failing. (largely due to Britain's pro-appeasement attitude)

It makes a lot of sense that Germany/France can be competing for who gets to make a pact with the Soviets. As it's in the game right now, M-R blocks France from taking the Franco-Soviet treaty focus, but not the other way around. (I suppose historical mode would become too broken?)

 

[Vlad123]

In a simulation. France made this treaty to attack me (germany) I made MR and was able to invade France without problems.

 

[Fulmen]

M-R was only signed with these talks failing. (largely due to Britain's pro-appeasement attitude)

Stalin negotiated with both sides simultaneously and laid the groundwork for the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact already in the spring and summer of 1939 with a very favourable trade deal to the Germans and by replacing the pro-Entente foreign minister Litvinov, who happened to be a Jew (a no-no for Germany), with Molotov. Furthermore, it was the Russians who initiated the Molotov-Ribbentrop negotiations. If Stalin was just interested in containing Germany, he would have kept negotiating with Britain and France, who had already promised him a slew of nations to be "guaranteed" (read: inside the sphere of influence of) by the Soviet Union in their own secret protocols signed in June-July 1939.

What Stalin really wanted was a protracted war between Germany and the West, a re-run of WWI, while grabbing as much land as possible before swooping in for the kill and spreading communism across a war-weary Europe, as part of a newly much enlarged USSR, of course, or the "great happy family of soviet socialist nations", as the Bolsheviks often referred to it.

 

[Sunforged General]

In a simulation. France made this treaty to attack me (germany) I made MR and was able to invade France without problems.

The Franco-Soviet treaty is a defensive pact. Also if it is created before the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact, then the USSR will go to war to defend France.

 

[CantGetNoSleep]

If you think that's broken, try being France, at war with Germany, and then getting the "London conference" on Slovenia, where you lose 200pp and 10 stability if you don't let the Germans (who you're at war with...) have Slovenia. And even if you don't agree, Germany still gets Slovenia. The alt history paths are terribly broken at times.