France: to Maginot or not to Maginot?

[seattle]

France has a defensive and offensive focus.
Since I usually play Germany and thusly aggressive by definition, I tend to prefer defensive, laid back games with the Allies. France has an interesting national focus tree.

It seems much better to go defensive cause it will give you access to 7 focuses instead of 4.
I doubt that you will be able to defeat Germany offensively in 1940 due to penalties like -75% land doctrine research and PP penalties.
IMHO the best choice for France is a determined defence. Extend the Maginot ASAP and only build defensive units. If you can hold the line, Germany will lose eventually.

What's your take?

 

[achmed242242]

Maybe it will work. Playing as France in HOI3, I always won by extending the maginot to the sea. Then it was just a matter of taking africa and building up for a landing in italy or northern germany.

 

[Sleight of Hand]

Extend the Maginot Line to both the Channel and Mediterranean coasts; increase garrisons and anti-air batteries; expand the Navy to counter the German and Italian fleets; prepare for a war with Italy - in conjunction with Great Britain - and capture Sardinia, Sicily and all of Italy's African possessions.

Whilst that's all going on, continue to move B.E.F. and R.A.F. divisions to France, wipe out the Kriegsmarine and wait for the Soviets to invade Germany. As soon as that happens, Germany will invariably begin moving divisions to the East... ATTACK!

 

[Admiral Fisker]

What I'm planning on doing, mainly because I think it'll be more fun, is taking the offensive route, letting France fall like it did in reality, and then liberating France as the Free French.

VIVE DE GAULLE!

 

[aruon]

i'd love to play as france but be just as aggressive in offense against germany. that'll make the war go weird!

 

[Denkt]

It seems much better to go defensive cause it will give you access to 7 focuses instead of 4.

It is not the quantity that matters but the quality. Offensive is the more forcing choice and forcing your enemy is one of the most effective startegies.

 

[ComradeCommissar]

Offense could be quite effective too. Draw the Germans into a trap and encircle their tanks and motorized infantry when they come to exploit it.

Not to mention you could probably blaze through Italy, at least taking Torino. Germany is then forced to help their ally, indirectly weakening the Maginot front.

 

[adam_grif]

I'm sure it will be possible to win with either as it is in HoI3 possible to win offensively and defensively. Damned if I could ever make the offensive strategy viable though lol. German units had those stupid modifiers that made them god tier for months.

I wonder if the "leave a big hole in your channel defences, lure them in and cut them off" cheese will work again

 

[rafan]

If you go defensive and hold of Germany its posible that Italy will decide not to enter war if AI is any good and not suicidal.

The ofensive way is beter for me not only there is less focuses so i will be able to get other ones before war (littel entene any one?) and buid up more industry (forts take civilian factories to build) but i will be able to atack Germany when they go for Poland if they wont turn to fight me they industry will fall in my hands, if they turn against me Poland will be able te get breathing space and eighter Germany will be slowed down or stoped on that front.

 

[sgt.stickybomb]

Go offensive, this will allow you to have some flexibility and maneuverability in your defenses instead of relying on one static line that once broken it is game over.

 

[Axe99]

I'm definitely looking forward to giving all the different national focus options a run, and France's look very interesting in terms of variety. It's a good point about 7 vs 4 national focus options for defence vs offence, but we're apparently not going to have time to 'collect them all' in a single game anyway, so going offensive may not mean forgoing options if other parts of the tree are preferred. Personally, I'll probably go historical the first time I play with France, and then all bets are off the second.

 

[Le_Carabinier]

Not Maginot. In January 1936, most of the forts are already built.
Since the number of National Focuses you can take is limited by time, taking the other forts of the military tree should be better.

My theory on what they are :

Defensive Tree :
- Levée en Masse (Mass Conscription) : Bonus to manpower ?
- Grande Batterie : Bonus to artillery
- Char de Bataille ("Battle Tank", term used to describe the B1 Tank) : Bonus to Heavy Armor.

Offensive Tree :
- The first two are self-explanatory.
- Automitrailleuses (A term used to describe both armored cars and light tanks) : Bonus to Light Armor.

Offensive seems to be fit for a Blitzkrieg à la française, but I'm unsure if it would be very effective against Germany, and its own highly motorized and armored forces. I'm really tempted with the defensive tree, notably because of its bonus to heavy tanks. In HoI3, mass-producing B1s was a great way of stalling the German offensive. A slow, grinding offensive with massed infantry assaults supported by heavy artillery and swarms of B1s would be a wonderful sight to behold.

 

[BBBD316]

Well doesn't the Army Reform NF remove a lot of the penalties from the French army? So by going mobile you get thier quicker.

Plus once I join the French to the Germans we will need extra panzers.

 

[TheCrimsonMajor]

I haven't played as France since HoI2: DD/A, but as I recall it was an expensive balancing act to prioritize between building more INF-ART and building more fortifications. France's IC was just so low. I don't know if they'll balance the game in HoI4 by nerfing France's IC again or just through the national spirits they've already shown, but I did find that balancing act challenging, and I hope it is captured in HoI4 somehow.

 

[The Nothing]

Trying the offensive route with France could be harder than the defensiv one, anyway it could also be far more valuable. In HoI3, helping Belgium, the Netherlands and sitting behind your defensiv line, will only result in allied troops attacking Germany from the low countries, and so you, as France, will have no real gain after tha war. A real shame since your fellow troops defended the low countries !

Instead, building a good motorized army, with plenty of armor can be very interesting, allowing to attack early on in the Rhineland. Attacking quickly while Germany is busy with Poland (or perhaps Czechoslovakia if you manage to create the little entente) could result in a quick occupation of Saarbücken, Stuttgart, perhaps Frankfurt am Main, Düsseldorf and other very interesting towns. After that, the french army have perfect positions to launch a massiv assault in Germany, while the Reich lost a lot of industrial capacity and ressources (mostly coal / iron ).

With some help from UK, the french army could hold its conquest, and even push further, until Hitler surrender. At least in Hearts of Iron 3 it was not that hard to do, conquering Berlin by june 1940 in normal mode was not very hard to achieve.

 

[AlfredMV]

Or you can join Germany and take Spain and Africa, maybe even Britain.

 

[TheCrimsonMajor]

Or you can join Germany and take Spain and Africa, maybe even Britain.

That may be one of the more implausible alternate outcomes I've heard of, but it would be fun to play.

 

[henzington]

Go offensive and ally myself with Germany then no need for the Maginot line.

 

[Lither]

Going offensive as France is neglecting its only major strength (Maginot line) and trying to beat the Germans at their own game.
Admittedly, it'd be hard to do worse than historical, but I seriously doubt France can out-bewegung the bewegungskrieg

 

[ArmChairAttila]

A lot of guys are saying go offensive. The Soviets beat the Nazis using defensive battle plans, especially at Stalingrad and Kursk which decided the Eastern Front. Depending on game difficulty I would stick to the defensive plan on anything above normal play. You can probably roll the AI on normal using any tactic.