forming China does......nothing?

[tapewormlondon]

I just westernized as Ming and took the decision to form chinease nation. I didn't get a new flag or colour, and I'm still called Ming.

Is this WAD? If so, how do I mod the files so my name and colour can be changed?

 

[unmerged(465279)]

I think it's WAD, according to the wiki it only does the following:

Effect:

Random owned province:
Gains 1 base tax

Adds the modifier "Increased Centralization" for 1 years:
+10% global tax modifier
+1 revolt risk

Removes Factions:
Temple Faction
Enuch Faction
Bureaucrat Faction

Changes government type to Despotic Monarchy

No mention of a TAG change.

 

[Barbarossa66]

The only nice thing about this decision is that you can use it while westernizing to get rid of the faction system. In my Ming playthrough I used once my stability was in the black as I was hemorrhaging money. It was still by no means an easy decision though as a westernizing Ming with the Temple faction in power probably has the lowest tech cost in the game. The only other nation that might come close is Tuscany with all of the modifiers and the Innovative idea.

 

[Peanutcat]

The only nice thing about this decision is that you can use it while westernizing to get rid of the faction system. In my Ming playthrough I used once my stability was in the black as I was hemorrhaging money. It was still by no means an easy decision though as a westernizing Ming with the Temple faction in power probably has the lowest tech cost in the game. The only other nation that might come close is Tuscany with all of the modifiers and the Innovative idea.

False, you have the inward perfecton modifier so your tech cost is more expensive than everyone without a worse tech group

 

[Novacat]

False, you have the inward perfecton modifier so your tech cost is more expensive than everyone without a worse tech group

Actually, it gets rid of inward perfection too.

 

[unmerged(184583)]

The only nice thing about this decision is that you can use it while westernizing to get rid of the faction system. In my Ming playthrough I used once my stability was in the black as I was hemorrhaging money. It was still by no means an easy decision though as a westernizing Ming with the Temple faction in power probably has the lowest tech cost in the game. The only other nation that might come close is Tuscany with all of the modifiers and the Innovative idea.

Actually any westernized islamic nation probably gets the lowest tech cost in the game, almost all game long.

you can get islamic learning center -5%
and from negative piety -10%
university -5%
innovative - 5%
and if you use your monarch points correctly, usually getting at least a 5% neighbor bonus on adm/diplo techs.

You can essentially get a 30% discount on all techs that way. A plutocratic islamic republic sounds kinda scary actually, I guess you could probably get about 40% discount on everything that way, if that is possible.

 

[Novacat]

Islamic learning center is a leader bonus, and it only applies for leaders with 5 adm or more, so chances are you wont have it for most of the game.

In addition, Christians get a permanent country modifier (The Education Act) that provides a permanent -5% tech cost, it becomes available if you enact the School Establishment Act.

 

[GamingHUD]

Actually any westernized islamic nation probably gets the lowest tech cost in the game, almost all game long.

you can get islamic learning center -5%
and from negative piety -10%
university -5%
innovative - 5%
and if you use your monarch points correctly, usually getting at least a 5% neighbor bonus on adm/diplo techs.

You can essentially get a 30% discount on all techs that way. A plutocratic islamic republic sounds kinda scary actually, I guess you could probably get about 40% discount on everything that way, if that is possible.

If you can pull it off..

French Islamic Republic.

 

[Novacat]

If you can pull it off..

French Islamic Republic.

French NIs are hardly incredible, though.

If you want the ultimate military, Swedish Islamic Monarchy. Rediculously high morale + Rediculously high discipline.

 

[Rubidium]

Actually any westernized islamic nation probably gets the lowest tech cost in the game, almost all game long.

you can get islamic learning center -5%
and from negative piety -10%
university -5%
innovative - 5%
and if you use your monarch points correctly, usually getting at least a 5% neighbor bonus on adm/diplo techs.

You can essentially get a 30% discount on all techs that way. A plutocratic islamic republic sounds kinda scary actually, I guess you could probably get about 40% discount on everything that way, if that is possible.

Surely the best (if you only care about tech costs) would be an Islamic Tuscany. Not only do you get the tech cost modifier from their NIs, but you get the 2 universities they start with, and you can fairly easily get plutocratic as well.

 

[Novacat]

Surely the best (if you only care about tech costs) would be an Islamic Tuscany. Not only do you get the tech cost modifier from their NIs, but you get the 2 universities they start with, and you can fairly easily get plutocratic as well.

Any country can get 2 universities... My Islamic Sweden had two last game, one at the capital and another over in east asia somewhere.

 

[Comes Imperii]

Islamic learning center is a leader bonus, and it only applies for leaders with 5 adm or more, so chances are you wont have it for most of the game.

In addition, Christians get a permanent country modifier (The Education Act) that provides a permanent -5% tech cost, it becomes available if you enact the School Establishment Act.

Which is quite difficult to obtain cause you need a level 3 statesman and a good monarch I think. Also it is available for the second half of the game, while lack of piety and islamic center (to a lesser extent) are available always.

 

[UnluckyKat]

French NIs are hardly incredible, though.

If you want the ultimate military, Swedish Islamic Monarchy. Rediculously high morale + Rediculously high discipline.

How about a swedish prussian islamic monarchy?(start as sweden, get the reform events, become prussia/get their ideas and go islam )

 

[GamingHUD]

How about a swedish prussian islamic monarchy?(start as sweden, get the reform events, become prussia/get their ideas and go islam )

I believe that's checkmate. :happy:

 

[Comradebot]

How about a swedish prussian islamic monarchy?(start as sweden, get the reform events, become prussia/get their ideas and go islam )

At some point you'd want to try and turn Republic, at least briefly, to get Plutocracy.

 

[Novacat]

How about a swedish prussian islamic monarchy?(start as sweden, get the reform events, become prussia/get their ideas and go islam )

Only bad thing is that Prussia does not have the flexibility to change culture... I culture switched my Sweden to Tartar in order to get culturegroup bonuses on all the altaic cultures.

At some point you'd want to try and turn Republic, at least briefly, to get Plutocracy.

The Bureaucratic Depotism event is good for this. Switch to Republic, grab idea group, then switch to a republic with 4-year election cycle and reelect yourself to a monarchy. As an added benefit you also get a 6/6/6 ruler out of it for a number of years.

 

[unmerged(184583)]

Which is quite difficult to obtain cause you need a level 3 statesman and a good monarch I think. Also it is available for the second half of the game, while lack of piety and islamic center (to a lesser extent) are available always.

oh no, its incredibly easy. Firstly you don't need a statesmen iirc. All sunni (maybe even all islamic?) nations can enact 3 different decisions if a monarch has any stat 5 or above, its learning center for adm. I forget the others, i think adopt title of kalifa is the mil one. You can usually kill off bad heirs via events or marching them repeatedly into losing battles. If I get a bad heir (low adm skill) I actively try to kill them constantly. It seems like once you get a good breed of rulers, they continue for awhile, maybe not all of them 5, but still, that is only 5%, you could still get massive discounts with islam.

In my aztec game I have done similar, monctezuma is a pretty good ruler, killed off my first heir, got a new (low legitimacy) heir but he had 5/4/3, took awhile but next heir was 4/4/2, but before he even took the throne, I got a regency 3/4/2, then the next heir was 5/0/6. There is some luck involved obviously, but it seems like the game rewards you somehow once you get it going in the right direction. I have earned stability via raise our prestige mission, and on a few random events plus I never enacted divination, but I did enact religious sacrifices and rite of passage, giving me a total 35% discount on stability. I think I might have a chance lol.

 

[JStrayer]

Actually any westernized islamic nation probably gets the lowest tech cost in the game, almost all game long.

you can get islamic learning center -5%
and from negative piety -10%
university -5%
innovative - 5%
and if you use your monarch points correctly, usually getting at least a 5% neighbor bonus on adm/diplo techs.

You can essentially get a 30% discount on all techs that way. A plutocratic islamic republic sounds kinda scary actually, I guess you could probably get about 40% discount on everything that way, if that is possible.

Really don't see this as the best solution to lowest tech costs, at best you can Westernize maybe 1/4 into the game which is 1/4 of the game with the +30%(?) tech costs, so 30/4 let's say you have a net + 7.5 % tech costs all game to factor into that above tally. I think the lowest tech all game would be something like Hansa with Plutocratic -10% Innovative -5% Imperial Integrity -10% (although this lasts about 1/4 of the game as well so -2.5% net using above logic) University -5% (The innovative -5% event is pretty common I think you can get it most of the game but well say 1/2 the game so -2.5%) Can go Protestant for -10% Ideas, or remain catholic for -1%/Active Cardinal. And you can get the 20-30(?) year event for renaissance -25%(?) I'm not sure what the triggers for that event are but if its any westernized nation after 1600 its a moot point. So in the end Hansa would benefit from - 25% Tech all game, vs Muslim +20% (factoring in +7.5% for 1/4 non western and -2.5% from innovative event)

Also worth mentioning that Westernization itself can take as much MP as 1 level in all techs, though +100% heir chance can also net you a bit more through no lowered MP regencies. Also on heir death Piety resets so that isn't a constant bonus though it is relatively easy to keep at -10% for most of the time.

 

[Novacat]

You realize theres nothing stopping western tech countries from converting to Islam.

 

[JStrayer]

Yes I do but have never tried it, I imagine you need to annex an Islamic province and let religious rebels enforce demands? I imagine that would take some nations longer than others. But if that's what he meant then I just misunderstood his post as, "westernized islamic" made me think he meant the opposite process vs "western islamicized" Nation. Semantics, I'm wrong -sorry.