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Aventaes

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May 3, 2020
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So I'm playing as Sparta and well Phrygia does not like me anymore. So they attacked me. It was really hard at first Phrygia was invading my only ally Egypt and reached the Nile delta. And troops from Phrygia were pushing me out of the province of Macedonia. After a lot of fighting the forced white peace message popped up. But does this mean i as defender can choose to force a white peace or not? Can i keep the war going that now turned massively in my favour?
 
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Herennius

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It is one of the question, I'm constantly asking myself when that notification comes up....as I never experienced it yet the that timer runned out. So I would be interested in the answer as well, if that "forced white peace" is only an option (and if both sides can use it or if it defender-only) or if it just means inevitably the curtain falling for the war?
 

TheWorstPro

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Enforcing a peace is merely an option that you have. I've had to use it a couple times before, when I was still a small nation and getting dogpiled by like 5 different countries because I was low on manpower. When going into a peace deal, it will give you a +10000 acceptance modifier when demanding peace, as long as it's only a white peace. If you demand anything in the peace deal, you will lose the acceptance bonus. Additionally, if the war goal becomes contested (you lose just 1 territory in the province that's being fought over), then you will no longer be able to enforce peace. However, even if the enemy takes a few territories and you push them back, you will be able to enforce peace again (I think there's some timer before it's reset, so you don't want to just ignore it. Take back the province ASAP if they occupy any land there).

It's pretty useful if your enemy is much bigger and could beat you in a war of attrition, or if you have several wars going on at once and just want to get one of them over with. If you're already winning, it's better to just keep going.
 

Aventaes

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Enforcing a peace is merely an option that you have. I've had to use it a couple times before, when I was still a small nation and getting dogpiled by like 5 different countries because I was low on manpower. When going into a peace deal, it will give you a +10000 acceptance modifier when demanding peace, as long as it's only a white peace. If you demand anything in the peace deal, you will lose the acceptance bonus. Additionally, if the war goal becomes contested (you lose just 1 territory in the province that's being fought over), then you will no longer be able to enforce peace. However, even if the enemy takes a few territories and you push them back, you will be able to enforce peace again (I think there's some timer before it's reset, so you don't want to just ignore it. Take back the province ASAP if they occupy any land there).

It's pretty useful if your enemy is much bigger and could beat you in a war of attrition, or if you have several wars going on at once and just want to get one of them over with. If you're already winning, it's better to just keep going.
Yeah your right i wasnt forced to do anything i kept the war going a little but saw egypt was not doing that wel as some armies got behind their lines. I was able to make 100 demand so no point to continue anyway.
 

Hendreforgan

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That's a common message when you're involved in a lengthy campaign where your final victory requires that first you take out your "enemies allies" and, having waited if necessary for the time limit of forcing them to capitulate has expired, you annex their country and then continue with the war against your "enemy" until you have 100% war score. Only then can you make significant gains on a larger, powerful enemy.

The pop-up appears when you are roughly 75% towards your full gains and starts a count-down clock that, supposedly when at zero, automatically gives you what you originally fought for? This will be whatever you choose from the menu in the box where you click to start a war . . however as it's often only a part of what you are aiming for then you really don't want it, do you?

The good news is that this pop-up is another example of part of the User Interface that, if not actually broken, is certainly very confusing/confused. If you are involved in a much more lengthy campaign than the "original chioce" then the "enforced peace" - actually sometimes shown as "enforced white peace" - doesn't happen and the pop-up then vanished, sometimes the pop-up does say something like "the war goal is still being contested".

I know this from several long campaigns I've played under v1.3 and one under v1.4 . . actually it's led me to think that if you can create the war without choosing a "gain" does this highly confusing and utterly redundant pop-up even bother to . . well . . pop-up?
 
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Jehzir

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The popup for enforced peace is at 67% of war score, not war cost and the goal is in one of three states; still contested, under enemy control or under allied (your nation) control. Then the timer starts for 1085 days or 5 years from that point. You can also get the "bleed them dry icon" of your nation is not happy with you carrying on a war already won, after the 5 years and wants you to end it or start eating massive WE penalty.
 

Hendreforgan

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The popup for enforced peace is at 67% of war score, not war cost and the goal is in one of three states; still contested, under enemy control or under allied (your nation) control. Then the timer starts for 1085 days or 5 years from that point. You can also get the "bleed them dry icon" of your nation is not happy with you carrying on a war already won, after the 5 years and wants you to end it or start eating massive WE penalty.
My fault, "War Score" and not "War cost", I meant the same thing but didn't use the "Official Terminology" . . I often forget. All I remembered is that it seemed at about 75% so won't disagree with what you say. However in the last big military campaign I've just finished playing as Carthage and strategically out manoeuvring Rome the "still contested" part certainly wasn't the case?

Rome, having gained a small foothold on the Northern shores of the Adriatic - my Carthage had stopped their "default expansion" by capturing Southern Gaul and Sicily plus the Toe and Foot of Italy so they couldn't go either North or South - went to war with the Celtic "country - Eraviscia - on the northern borders of their "foothold" and not long after the Celtic "country" to the West - Carnia - joined in and, between them, they carved up Eraviscia. However, I knew it would only be a matter of time and Rome's aggression would then take Carnia and thus turn my North Eastern flank . . so, though muttering beneath my breath, I went to war with Carnia who's two allies - Raetia and Ambisontia - bordered my Southern Gaul. I'm not 100% sure but I believe the chioce to click on when making war with Carnia was "take Alpes Carnia" or "take Histria" possibly because this area covered the south western part of my quest?

Raetia and Ambisontia I captured quickly but had to wait the allocated time to sue for peace individually with them . . . this being the ONLY way you get past the "maximum 100 score" when taking groups of allies . . . and then I got bogged down in a protracted campaign capturing Carnia, thanks to their capture of most of Eraviscia Carnia amounted to 78 territories . . . and, true to my reasoning, Rome declared war on Carnia when I had taken most of it!

When I got the laurel branch avatar and the "enforced white peace" pop-up Alpes Carnia was mine as neither Raetia or Ambisontia now existed and, with more than 50% of Carnia captured, this also included Histria . . . so I had completed my "war goal" if I chose to sue for peace. So why then the message and the count down clock?

Like I said this part of the "interface" if not "broken" seems to get confused . . . and, yes, DO NOT ignore the "bleed them dry" avatar, do so at your peril! In this aspect at least the games AI will reward a players greed with loads of woe.
 

Hendreforgan

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So I'm playing as Sparta and well Phrygia does not like me anymore. So they attacked me. It was really hard at first Phrygia was invading my only ally Egypt and reached the Nile delta.
BTW even in my game playing as Carthage Phrygia became big very quickly and is now a Middle Eastern "power house" even by year 550, see my screen-grab . . . I really wouldn't want to be playing ANY of the Aegean States with them breathing aggresively down my neck . . . however I would fear that - eventually - they get picked on by the Persian Empire and swallowed up . . . leaving a massive issue to playing ANYBODY at the eastern end of the Mediterranean. Seems to me the same advice is good here as for playing Carthage and the need to deal with Rome . . . take them out as early as possible.
Imperator 23_05_2020 22_09_38.jpg
 

Linusz

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BTW even in my game playing as Carthage Phrygia became big very quickly and is now a Middle Eastern "power house" even by year 550, see my screen-grab . . . I really wouldn't want to be playing ANY of the Aegean States with them breathing aggresively down my neck . . . however I would fear that - eventually - they get picked on by the Persian Empire and swallowed up . . . leaving a massive issue to playing ANYBODY at the eastern end of the Mediterranean. Seems to me the same advice is good here as for playing Carthage and the need to deal with Rome . . . take them out as early as possible.
View attachment 581048
since the new update phyrgia does not seem to implode anymore. To the contrary, they seems to become the most powerful nation, swallowing Egypt, a lot of Greece and even parts of the Seleucids.
 

Hendreforgan

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since the new update phyrgia does not seem to implode anymore. To the contrary, they seems to become the most powerful nation, swallowing Egypt, a lot of Greece and even parts of the Seleucids.
I noticed that when Cyrenaica - whom I will "bump into" one day - had a Civil War recently that brought Egypt into the conflict it wasn't any Egyptian army that sorted out the mess but their allies Phrygia that captured ALL the rebellious territories only to hand them to Egypt! The process happened so quickly that they must have landed armies directly onto the North African shore and not walked there?

Oh dear . . . and there was me with the romantic vision of freeing Phoenicia by incorporating them into Carthage? Not looking that good for me either!
 

Jehzir

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This is the warning you get for the peace imminent. The War Score is 99%. As I said earlier once you hit 67% of War Score the timer for one of the peace demands will pop up, depending on the war condition.
peaceimmenent.jpg

This is a challenge run: 0 techs and 1000 territories by 650. Try it sometime! The rule is you do everything possible NOT TO TECH UP and try to beat it at its game.

It is very easy to be a middle eastern power house by 550, the amount of provinces/regions in the eastern satraps of the Persian Empire were massive. My usual goal is to be 500 by 500 as a non-diadochi player. So you can grow more monstrous than them. You cannot be afraid of them. I have beaten Phrygia so badly they cave to threaten war demands. That is when you know you have your target in your control.
badpuppyphrygia.jpg
In this run I have beaten the Persians once, taken Bablyon and their capital, gave it back because I still wanted a buffer with Phrygia at that time. Made the full circle around beat on Thrace so badly that they have 1 cohort and -211200 manpower, they were once 240 territories, they made a big mistake by going into my area and take out tyras and olbia.

Full empire by 623 with the peace putting me over 1000. Every "big" nation avoids me :cool:
fullempire.jpg
 
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