For those that have mended the Great Schism
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In mine France, HRE, England, and most of Spain stayed Catholic. This resulted in England expanding very aggressively into Scotland and Ireland, and Poland being attacked by the HRE constantly. All the Scandinavian countries converted however, and are doing well. But with the biggest powers in Western Europe still Catholic, not much has changed
I started a new game as the Byzantines today, and about 60 years into the game, the Pope suddenly declared a crusade for Greece against me. Needless to say, I didn't understad wtf was going on, until I realised that the catholic religion was an Orthodox heresy for some reason. I still have the option to mend the schism though.
I think there is a bug after Mending the Schism. When I first did it (1.07 vanilla), all my subsequent games called Catholicism an Orthodox heresy. I couldn't even buy indulgences, as you can't do that when a heretic. Maybe the game alters a file that didn't get changed back.
It fixed itself when I upgraded to 1.08, and I have yet to mend the schism again, though I am on the doorstep...
Which leads me to whine: I am currently playing as Orthodox Naples, played through 1260 as a faithful ally, if not vassal, of the ERE. Then the King of Bulgaria usurped the Imperial title, causing a huge meltdown of the empire. Considering these Bulgarian Usurpers to be barbarians, I launched a campaign to retake Imperial lands, and had some initial successes, until the civil wars died down, then they began reforming. After peace broke out, I was able to set up a dynastic union, which should bring the my Kingdom and the Empire together, if I can kill the Emperor's last son before the old geezer dies...
Long story short: I currently hold 4/5 Pentarch seats, the ERE holds the 5th. As a faithful Orthodox ruler, why can I not mend the Schism? For some reason it requires me to hold the Empire...
Amazingly, in my latest game the Orthodox conversion followed the border of the old Roman Empire, with the "Roman" areas becoming Orthodox and "non-Roman" areas remaining Catholic. England converted but Scotland did not, France converted but HRE did not. Norway kinda broke the chain by converting but otherwise it was spectacularly accurate compared to 117AD borders.
At the time of my mending, France and England were currently ... Aztec. :laugh:
The HRE was pretty much exploding at that point.
Hungary and the Ilkhanate were the only major "powers" to remain Catholic (yes Ilkhanate had converted). I goggled up Hungary immediately in holy wars.
Northwest Africa was split between Castile and The Knights (who had a pretty impressive number of holdings for being a holy order). The Knights succumbed to Orthodox Castile.
The HRE was pretty much exploding at that point.
Hungary and the Ilkhanate were the only major "powers" to remain Catholic (yes Ilkhanate had converted). I goggled up Hungary immediately in holy wars.
Northwest Africa was split between Castile and The Knights (who had a pretty impressive number of holdings for being a holy order). The Knights succumbed to Orthodox Castile.
Erufailon42 said:
Indeed, there is a bug. It happened to me in my first game as Byz in 1.08. Basically, you have to restart the game and it should solve all problems.
As for the pentarchy question, you need to be the Byzantine Empire. I tried fulfilling the conditions as a random orthodox nation other than byz and it would never recognize any of my holdings. I guess it makes sense since the random nation doesn't really have any authority (but what if you're the Russian Empire?). So it's a Byzantine exclusive decision.
In my latest game almost everyone went Orthodox, though occasionally a monarch would go Waldensian or Catholic and give me an opportunity to holy war. For me that was France, Scotland and Denmark. Everyone else I've had to grind down with the imperial reconquest CB.
I was hoping for a grand war of the faiths, but it wasn't to be.
I was hoping for a grand war of the faiths, but it wasn't to be.
In my game Norway, Wales, England and a few Iberian minors converted. Only Norway now stands. Scotland and France conquered England and Wales and the Iberian Kingdoms that converted fell to France or the Muslim states. A fair chunk of the HRE converted but they've mostly been converted back to Catholicism.
Got me thinking, they could make that decision way more spectacular, it could be like a declaration of war, catholicism vs orthodox. The decision is'nt that much fun as it is now imo.
THE ENTIRE CATHOLIC WORLD WENT FRATICELLI. Granted at that point all that was left was Britannia, France and Poland, but still. And that was only my first time mending the Schism, anyway. Things were more normal the second and third times.
Just curious - where do the catholic holy orders go after the great shism is mended??
I haven´t got LoR yet (busy with other games at the moment). But the decision seems to be able to trigger some fun situations! Gotta try it eventually.
I think it would be particularly interesting to mend the schism with the ERE, then switch to one of the remaining Catholic kingdoms and try to restore Catholic faith in all of Europe!
I think it would be particularly interesting to mend the schism with the ERE, then switch to one of the remaining Catholic kingdoms and try to restore Catholic faith in all of Europe!
Proving Julian the Apostate's strategy correct, one Heresy at a time! :happy:
"No wild beasts are so dangerous to men as Christians are to one another."
Its really only an action that makes sense for the head of the orthodox church to take at this time (as its the culmination of doctrinal disputes between Rome & Constantinople).
*exactly what the relationship between the emperor, patriarch and the church is at this time is not something I remember, but the basic point still stands.
In my last game, most of the major Christian rulers converted, including the Holy Roman Emperor. Catholicism survived with a few of the major dukes in France and the HRE, as well as the pope of course with his holdings in the Duchy of Cordoba. At the time of the end of the schism, the HRE was experiencing a major civil war between rival claimants for the imperial throne. The HRE recognized Patriarch Bardas, while the Duke of Aragon, the son of a deposed Kaiser, and his allies, the King of Lotharingia, the duchess of Brunswick, the duke of Swabia, and the King of Bohemia, supported Pope Donus II. Kaiser Theobald would've been deposed and Duke Mathias put on the throne, if it weren't for me, the new Roman emperor, joining Theobald in his war (a war, I should point out, I helped to instigate, so that I could more easily take territories from the Duke of Aragon that he had in Italy).
Catholicism lingered for a few more decades, thanks to its continued support in Lotharingia and in Spain, where the French and German dukes there remained Catholic. There was even a Catholic Holy Roman Emperor for a few years, but after two wars involving the Roman Empire (I joined factions that were fighting the Catholic German emperor), he was deposed.
By 1300 (where I stopped), 90 years after the end of the Great Schism, Catholicism is basically dead. The Byzantine/Roman Empire has conquered most of the areas that stayed Catholic in Spain and Italy. My zealous son, the Duke of Seville, has been revoking the titles of the Catholics there (a recently conquered territory taken directly from the King of France). The Pope is just some guy who lives in Rome.
Catholicism lingered for a few more decades, thanks to its continued support in Lotharingia and in Spain, where the French and German dukes there remained Catholic. There was even a Catholic Holy Roman Emperor for a few years, but after two wars involving the Roman Empire (I joined factions that were fighting the Catholic German emperor), he was deposed.
By 1300 (where I stopped), 90 years after the end of the Great Schism, Catholicism is basically dead. The Byzantine/Roman Empire has conquered most of the areas that stayed Catholic in Spain and Italy. My zealous son, the Duke of Seville, has been revoking the titles of the Catholics there (a recently conquered territory taken directly from the King of France). The Pope is just some guy who lives in Rome.
Mending the Schism? That depends on your position. 
It's true if you're Orthodox; OTOH if you're Catholic your beliefs are declared heretical. IMHO without a Catholic counterpart, that decision feels unbalanced; like a one-sided coin, IMHO one half is missing. Then again I usually start with a Roman Catholic ruler....
It's true if you're Orthodox; OTOH if you're Catholic your beliefs are declared heretical. IMHO without a Catholic counterpart, that decision feels unbalanced; like a one-sided coin, IMHO one half is missing. Then again I usually start with a Roman Catholic ruler....
I rebuilt the entire Roman Empire and converted most of it before mending the Schism. Scattered bits of Ireland are Catholic. All of the remaining Catholic Kings converted, but roughly half of their land is still Catholic (so, presumably, those Counts are). It's been a pretty smooth couple of years since the mending. I hope to have a nice uniform gold color over the whole religious map soon.
France, Brittany, Norway and Southern Ireland remained Catholic initially.. HRE and England gobbled up France. The king of france eventually ended up Orthodox.. but all he has left is the duchy of Gallicia and a single province in France. Castille gobbled up Britanny and Southern Ireland. and then HRE reverted back to Catholic and is now gobbling everyone up and is only being kept in check by the fact that I'm taking their southern territories via holy wars.