For the love of God, when are we ever gonna get an in game tech tree library?

[BOFH]

Why are people disagreeing with OP?

There is absolutely no reason it shouldn't be in-game, other than "muh skill at using google."

That’s not a lot of people. Compared to the player base at large, a handful of people on Reddit (yes, a handful. I didn’t see higher than twelve upvotes) wanting a tech tree isn’t exactly the great yearning you make it out to be. Besides, the lack of a clear tech tree makes the game more fluid as you don’t know exactly what you have to do to get a tech you want. I like the variation it brings to the game, and think being able to see it would make Stellaris a lot more generic.

I almost never play this game because I can't figure out what the hell is going on. I barely figure out how to expand to a different system because I can't figure out the path to doing so until 10+ hours/100+ years into a playthrough, and stumbing through menu after sub-menu trying to figure out what I need to do. What makes it worse is the process seems different every time I come back, because of balance patches and whatever other updates that happened in the meantime. This would help relieve some of the issue with this, on top of probably hundreds of other things that I don't even know exist, because I've never been able to make meaningful progress.

But Reddit doesn’t. If it was a really popular request, there would be more than three threads on the matter.

The reason people don't request it is because all the people who needed this feature stopped playing the game, uninstalled, and never touched it again.

 

[stumason]

Why are people disagreeing with OP?

Because it is pointless - it assumes techs are linear when most of them are not. You can't make a tree for it.

There is absolutely no reason it shouldn't be in-game, other than "muh skill at using google."

There is - there is no need for it. Techs don't form a tree and even if some have pre-requisites, its still not a given that having them both grants access to the next tech.

I almost never play this game because I can't figure out what the hell is going on. I barely figure out how to expand to a different system because I can't figure out the path to doing so until 10+ hours/100+ years into a playthrough, and stumbing through menu after sub-menu trying to figure out what I need to do.

Wow... Really? Then it's probably best you don't play. I mean, right clicking a system on the galaxy map is hard to do, right? Or clicking the big button on a planet that says "colonise" is tricky.

What makes it worse is the process seems different every time I come back, because of balance patches and whatever other updates that happened in the meantime. This would help relieve some of the issue with this, on top of probably hundreds of other things that I don't even know exist, because I've never been able to make meaningful progress.

I really don't know what to say to this. The game was extraordinarily simply before 2.2 - now it's slightly trickier but within a couple of hours I've got the hang of it. It's not rocket science - read your tooltips and if in doubt, check the wiki. I doubt this game is for you though...

The reason people don't request it is because all the people who needed this feature stopped playing the game, uninstalled, and never touched it again.

Yay! That means those of us who have an IQ greater than that of a Womble with educational difficulties can crack on with it, without the game being "dumbed down" to cater for those who can't work out how to colonise a planet....

Sorry, no sympathy. If you were saying this about Kerbal Space Programme, I'd be understanding. Stellaris is not hard to work out.

 

[Wolfgang I]

Because it is pointless - it assumes techs are linear when most of them are not. You can't make a tree for it.

https://turanar.github.io/stellaris-tech-tree/vanilla/

 

[stumason]

https://turanar.github.io/stellaris-tech-tree/vanilla/

Even in your own link, there's a whole host of techs that aren't attached to the "tree". The "tree" also implies that you get tech A and then tech B pops up - this is also not the case, it entirely ignores weighting or even government type/ethics which can have an effect.

A tree is misleading.

 

[grandad1982]

Some in game indication of which traits mage certain techs more likely to pop would be nice.

 

[Wolfgang I]

Even in your own link, there's a whole host of techs that aren't attached to the "tree". A tree also implies that you get tech A and then tech B pops up - this is also not the case.

If you look at the weight modifiers in that tech tree you know what prerequisites you need. There is still a random element but even a game like alpha centauri allowed randomness. Most of the techs that are not connected to any other tech are event/perk techs or require the scanning of debris.

 

[Jorrhast]

Even in your own link, there's a whole host of techs that aren't attached to the "tree". The "tree" also implies that you get tech A and then tech B pops up - this is also not the case, it entirely ignores weighting or even government type/ethics which can have an effect.

"those of us who have an IQ greater than that of a Womble"(whatever that is) can clearly see weight modifiers provided in the page in that link.

 

[Rios_]

It's not that misleading, most of the techs which are orphaned are either creature salvage or odd, unique techs that don't really fit in elsewhere. Then you have weird things like gateway activation requiring t3 hyperdrives, but jump drives requiring zero point power (and not any hyperdrive tech), synthetics requiring galactic administration, paradise domes locked behind city district housing, and upgraded armies for machine empires locked behind a + admin cap tech (that one is just weird). Then there is the more niche things, like knowing that researching ship hulls and early weapons (coil guns, blue lasers) unlock large quantities of subsequent techs, so if your trying to beeline for something specific then you might want to hold of resarching them to keep the range of possible techs narrow.

Really though, providing a tech tree is a low-ish effort bit of work that will make a set of people really happy without having a negative impact on anyone who does not care for it, so unless dev time is at an absolute premium it's worth putting some time into making.

 

[stumason]

"those of us who have an IQ greater than that of a Womble"(whatever that is) can clearly see weight modifiers provided in the page in that link.

And ethics or scientist traits which can have an effect?

Ultimately it is, at best, a reference guide - tech draws are not a linear thing. You also ignore the ones for which are not on the tree at all, or which require you encounter the right entity in space (curators, mining drones). There are over 50 (I stopped counting - there's more) techs not on the tree.

And it seems, if you really want a little picture of what to do, you already have it. No need to have it in game, no one has ever really pushed for it and most of us get on just fine without it. In fact, many of us prefer it, as it adds a little mystery to the game.

 

[grommile]

And it seems, if you really want a little picture of what to do, you already have it. No need to have it in game, no one has ever really pushed for it and most of us get on just fine without it. In fact, many of us prefer it, as it adds a little mystery to the game.

The event system is perfectly capable of providing all the mystery and/or schmuck bait any player could reasonably demand, and then some

 

[Ryn]

Looking at this https://turanar.github.io/stellaris-tech-tree/vanilla/ @stumason seems quite right.

At best, it's a tech hedge, with some tech pot plants and possibly a small tech bush. Maybe a tech bird.. And perhaps a tech hedgehog..

As for those who'd still find more information useful but don't require very specifically a tech tree (which is inefficient in this game anyway), this mod has been of use to me in the past: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1435832483

Just wait for it to be updated for Le Guin.

 

[serpentskirt]

Since you seem to suffer a lot, I'm sharing WIP physics and engineering trees for beeline guide update. Use first link in my signature to get idea what different color outlines are used for. The trees are for regular empires.

There is duplicate thruster icon in propulsion - should be orbital debris technology, which I have not extracted icon for yet.

 

[Sheriff Godwin Law]

Why are people disagreeing with OP?

Two reasons to disagree with the OP.

1. You misread what the OP wants and believe she'd like the current system of limited tech tree amid a more generalist tier system to be replaced with a hard tech tree.

2. You believe the wiki, plus in game browser that takes you to the wiki, are sufficient and so would prefer PDX invest their time and efforts elsewhere.

 

[Arthrodira]

The absence of a tech tree has always been one of the best FEATURES of this game. It’s a better simulation of how technology is actually developed.

Even something as simple as x unlocks y breaks this illusion. The icon indicating that a given tech unlocks others (without specifying them) is sufficient.

 

[Sheriff Godwin Law]

The absence of a tech tree has always been one of the best FEATURES of this game.

I think you have misunderstood what the original poster is asking for.

The game has had various tech trees as a feature since launch, to unlock Synthetics alone is a 10 prerequisite tree that spans all three of the science categories. The original poster is asking for in game transparency regarding these tech trees that isn't reliant on the volunteers who put together the wiki finding the time to update the wiki so that she will know of any changes made when she starts playing.

 

[Arizal]

That's still information and you can "build" a tech tree yourself, so I don't see why we shouldn't have one in game. We have hitpoints information as well as stability, which are hardly something we have in the real world as information about how well we perform.

It would also be great if we had a proper ledger, like in other PDX titles (be it tied to an espionage mechanic or not). It is troublesome to have very partial information about our neighbors and be unable to improve those findings.

 

[Kinkness]

If there are hard dependencies - which there are - then they should be browsable in-game.

External wikis and a text-based format for the game's data files do not remove this requirement.

I am against having a tech tree in game.

However, I am for having little tid bits of immersive text that can hint towards things.

Such as

Cruisers: "Our scientists will research into larger ship hulls, potentially increasing our knowledge to build even bigger ships in the future" hinting towards the battleships, but not out right saying it.

Or: Farms: "Researching into farms is necessary if we want a fast growing population" This hints at 2 things. 1: More food = faster growth rate + it also weights into the tech that increases both population growth modifiers and life span of leaders.

this way its a little hint thats immersive, but not an outright A to B to C.

I think that would be a perfect middle ground for people who want at least some type of direction, and people who don't want a tech tree.

 

[Napean]

Complete transparency here: I'd forgotten about 'tech weights' until I came to this post.
I agree w/ the OP in general; in-game, would be nice to have the tech-weights. Probably part of the more general need for in-game clarity (be it clearer UI, in-game help, better tooltips, etc).

I for one do not get a kick out of googling and wiking while playing games, in general. Breaks the immersion for me. I'm not saying I never google or wiki, but for most games I don't have to do that to suss out the game's mechanics.....just saying.

On a complete tangent, this thread may be a good example of the collision Stellaris has between completely new players to PDX titles (which was a large part of Setllaris' initial success; you don't have to be a history enthusiast to have a good time - or some such), and the established PDX player.

Just my two cents.

 

[Arthrodira]

I think you have misunderstood what the original poster is asking for.

The game has had various tech trees as a feature since launch, to unlock Synthetics alone is a 10 prerequisite tree that spans all three of the science categories. The original poster is asking for in game transparency regarding these tech trees that isn't reliant on the volunteers who put together the wiki finding the time to update the wiki so that she will know of any changes made when she starts playing.

No I understand. I know that a tree structure underlies the tech system. I just honestly think that this information should be obfuscated. This is not an oversight, it is an intentional design choice.

 

[Sheriff Godwin Law]

No I understand. I know that a tree structure underlies the tech system. I just honestly think that this information should be obfuscated. This is not an oversight, it is an intentional design choice.

I don't think obfuscation was their goal, as the game facilitates access to a player maintained and designer endorsed wiki that will reveal all this in time and the game is designed to be replayed with no mechanic to maintain the mystery.