For the love of god give denmark german culture

[Hive]

Originally posted by Stonewall
To solve the problem, would it be possible to split up the cultures in the Germanic provinces to North Germany, Central Germany and South Germany. Give Denmark North Germany consisting of (Pommerania, Mecklenberg, Bremen, and Holstein...plus other wthat would fit). All the German minors would have the three cultures as statre cultures to help them assimilate to a unified Germany. This solves the Danish/German problem by giving same culture to only a limited amount of provinces in historically reasonable areas.

No offense, but I think this is a terrible idea! I can see no historical justification what so ever for splitting the German culture in 3. If anything, more provinces should be German. Your suggestion may be good for balance, but bad for historical accuracy.

 

[Tim O]

I agree with Hive, splitting German culture in three just doesn't make sense.

 

[unmerged(2833)]

Originally posted by Hive
No offense, but I think this is a terrible idea! I can see no historical justification what so ever for splitting the German culture in 3. If anything, more provinces should be German. Your suggestion may be good for balance, but bad for historical accuracy.

What provinces you think should be German? (apart from the western Swiss one, obviously)

 

[unmerged(10416)]

the netherlands could start out as german. in 1419 the dialects spoken in holland, geldern and zeeland were very much like the dialects spoken throughout the lower rhine region (especially cologne, also düsseldorf), and the frisian dialects sounded very similar in western and eastern friesland. there was no cultural dividing line that separated germany from the netherlands. counts of jülich (several wilhelms) fought on the side of the flandrian revolts in the 15th century, people from cologne with names like jan and pieter traveled along the rhine and had no problems conversing with dutch people... it was all very fluid, and much less complicated than today.

of course i have no idea when the dutch identity became separate from the lower German one... and since it's no big thing, it can just as well be left out for simplicity's sake.

 

[Stonewall]

Originally posted by Hive
No offense, but I think this is a terrible idea! I can see no historical justification what so ever for splitting the German culture in 3. If anything, more provinces should be German. Your suggestion may be good for balance, but bad for historical accuracy.

No offense taken. My post had nothing to do with historical accuracy. It was purely a game balancing proposal. The problem was that people thought that Denmark was being beaten too much and that Sweden was expanding too far.

In terms of accuracy, the proposed change would have absolutely no effect on anything aside from the new Danish same culture with some Northern Germanic provinces. All contries who would originally have Germanic cluture would recieve all 3 as state cultures, thus there is no impediment. I understand the arguments of those who want as historically accurate a game as possible (I am one myself), however, if doing some unhistorical things makes the end result more historical, I'm for it. Its an ends justifies the means thing for me.

 

[unmerged(8060)]

Originally posted by Arilou
Indrek, yes it does.
Finland had (by Eu2 time) been an integrated part of Sweden for hundreds of years, finns could be found at all levels of administration,

Yes, I corrected it in the later posting. No problem with Finland. The problem is that the ugric culture speads into the areas where Sweden was not involved. It's not crucial though.

 

[Hive]

Originally posted by DarthMaur
What provinces you think should be German? (apart from the western Swiss one, obviously)

Actually, I think that both swiss ones should start off as German (and then later switch to swiss).

Another one is Loarraine, although I'm not really sure about this one... does anyone know alot about the cultural situation in Lorraine by 1419?

Maybe also the dutch provinces should be switched to german, except the Belgian ones who should be french (and then they should all later switch to dutch) - but I fear that this particular change would cause too much of a mess.

But all in all, I'm happy with the way german is currently 'distributed' in EU2. But I'm seriously against the suggestion to split german into 3. I can see that it balances the game, but I think that the historical prize to pay for this balancing is too high.

 

[Varyar]

Hmm, I've always felt that Denmark shouldn't have german culture... However, it might be appropriate for the first 100-200 years of the game.

*off to do some hands-off testing*

 

[unmerged(15678)]

I think a pretty historical way to solve it would be for the danish to have german culture from the beginning of the game until the beginning of the 30YW. Until then the were quite involved in the german community, they even had a part in the HRE council (I dont think they could vote though). The danes then got involved in the 30YW (the first years of it) and lost badly and had to sign a peace treaty where they promised to stay out of germany, roughly speaking.

First of all there should be an event for the danes where they may choose to enter the 30YW. Then there should be an event that triggers say at 1625 which check what provinces they control. They should hold say 3-5 german provs to succeed (going ahistorical) keeping german as state culture or lose it if they dont.

If they fail then Sweden should be able to enter the war, this is the point where Sweden takes over Denmarks role as leader in the north. If they succeed to do better than the stalemate that happened IRL (maybe hold 10 ger provs) then they should be able to (going ahistorical) gain german as state culture and found a Protestant Empire which was the plan of Gustav II Adolf.

These are no more strange events than England keeping french as state culture if they hold certain french provs at the end of the 100YW or that some countries may gain dutch they can suppress the dutch revolts from 1568 to 1648.

 

[Lucius Sulla]

No new events for official patches, sorry

But could be an interesting idea for one of the two big mods (AGC or EEP).