Fleshing out the minors

[Gurkhal]

This is a thread for ideas about additions to minor nations, at start, so that they can get some flavor and make them interesting to play.

I hope to be able to throw in some interesting stuff in regards to Thebes, Athens, Sparta, Messenia, Troizon, Corinth, Megara and Argos, at least. But I don't promise anything and if anyone has ideas, please feel free to post them as well.

Anyway, first out is Thebes.

Thebes

House of Kadmos - An event where a person shows up and its rumored this person is a direct descendent of Kadmos, the founder of Thebes. The player can let the ruler marry this character and so change the ruling family name to "Kadmidae" (or what it should be in proper ancient Greek at this time) and gain the personality trait "Bloodline of Kadmos" with bonuses to Oratory and Finess, and if the ruler is of this bloodline then gain Casus Belli on all Boiotia and a bonus to the family's prestige.

If possible this could only be fired one time during the game and so not milked by every new family that gets to rule Thebes.

Distant friends - An event with visitors from far away and the player's ruler can get friends and positive relations with Levantine or Persian character or state. The fluff itself may be a minor member of such a state's elite, a merchant or something else.

Curse of blindness – An event where interaction between characters are affected by a blindness, in one way or another, of the participants leading to unforeseen results. Not seldom of a tragic nature but some times also to joy and prosperity. The common thread should however be that just like Pentheus, Oedipus and Creon are all blind to what they are doing, and stumbles into disaster when the truth is finally revealed to them so the characters come into situations where unforseen consequences lies behind seemingly obvious solutions to the situations.

Just like with the "House of Kadmos" it would be nice if there are several different situations, and none can be brought up more than once in a single game, and all of them will not show up in a single game either.

Melting pot: Kadmean culture: Mix between Greek and Levantine in a state with both Boiotian and Levantine cultures, and ruled by Thebes or where a ruler of Thebes is married to a spouse of the Levantine culture. Possibly allowing the player to decide if the Kadmean culture should lean towards the Greek or Levantine part of its composition.

 

[Trin Tragula]

This seems like a nice thread to keep an eye on

 

[Gurkhal]

So here comes...

Messenia

A worthy palace - A decision leading to an event chain where the player decides to rebuild the, at least now, famous Palace of Nestor in the capital as a residence of the ruler and a sign of Messenia's power. The more money spent the more prestige it will give in the end to the ruler and state.

No longer in chains - Essentially a bonus to turn Slaves into Freemen.

Blood of Nestor - The character meets a terrifically strong and wise person whom people whisper has the blood of Nestor in their veins. The ruler can marry this character and so form the family of Nestor and the child and spouse will have the Bloodline of Nestor which grants a good chance for the "strong" trait as well as a bonus to charisma. And also gives access to "Nestorian Council" as below.

Nestorian council - The ruler can, if sufficient in charisma, get special options in events where he gives good council to various parties and get them to not act foolishly in events or get disloyal characters to get their act together. Shouldn't be an domestic politics "I win" button but could give both flavor as well as an edge in domestic politics.*

Descendents of Aristomenes - During a travel the character comes across a family giving ancestral sacrifices to King Aristomenes. Upon inquiry it turns out that these people are his descendents and the character can naturally marry into their family to get the "Aristomenes Bloodline" trait. This gives a bonus to martial values to the character and prestige. As well as the "Dedicate Shield" as below.

Dedicate shield - An event after a battle close inside or next to the territory of the enemy, where a group of bold young warriors are sent with a captured shield to put it in a temple of the enemy after inscribing the name of the nation's leader on it, and it gives the enemy extra war exhaustion if successfully carried out.

*Don't know when I'll get to it, but one can offer an opposite bloodline in that of Odysseus' where the character gets the oppertunity to give either good or deceitful advice to help or manipulate the target, along with potentially some other trickster stuff fitting for the blood of Odysseus.

 

[Gurkhal]

Jsut want to say that its very nice to see interest for this. It inspires me to both get this stuff out and also, possibly, in the future make expanded versions with even more flavor stuff for different states that can be expanded on with events, traits and such.

Troezen

The King Horse (shamelessly stolen from fiction ) - Every seventh year there's an event where when a horse in the prime of its life and without physical imperfections is sacrificed to Poseidon and a new young horse dedicated to the god, to be sacrificed in seven years when it is seven years of age. This helps with public happiness and offers the chance for characters of the ruler's family to gain character traits related to duty or indulgence, faith or becomng a cynic as they think about the significance of the sacrifice. Character may get special events when the character thinks about duty, fate and piety in relation to being chosen for an elevated status in life and every need taken care of, but a life that must end with a young death for the community's benefit.

Impossible Desire - An event chain where a character develops a desire with something they should not have. Be it ruler over the state, another's spouse, the people's acclaim despite having done nothing or what else there might be. The character gets events where he or she is torn between what to do but the obsessive desire simply won't go away and they are offered reckless ways to aquire what they desire with a low chance for success, but great rewards if successful. Through this they may reach their desire and gain what they may otherwise have found impossible to have, but it may also just as likely lead them to an ignoble destruction for their unworthy ambition and failure. Inspired by the myth of Hippolytus, son of Theseus.

Wise in Oracles - If the character has sufficient Finess, may 9 or 10 or so, then that character can interpret oracles and be known for it, leading to people seeking them out in order to learn what oracles means and the character gets event to tell them this. But the character can also to take advantage of knowledge of what different given oracles have meant, leading to potential ways to further their own ambitions. Potentially this can be tied into the "Bloodline of Pittheus". An oppertunity to duplicate Pittheus trickery over Aegeus to make him have Theseus with Aethra, Pittheus' daughter, should be a must but not the only thing that can be done.

Bloodline of Pittheus - The character gets to marry into the surviving heir of Pittheus through following a an oracle's instructions and then increased in Finess and prestige as well as an increased chance to gain both "Pious" and "Just" character traits for people having this bloodline.

 

[Gurkhal]

Only Athens and Sparta left and then we'll see what kind of suggestion I'll bring next.

Corinth

Heirs of Bakhis - Can pick between stryling his family in the image of either the Bacchiadae, with a firm "in the family" approach to power, or the Cypselids where populist support is the bedrock of the game, along with periods of enlightened wisdom. Not a bloodline but a trait that the family is styling themselves after this predecessor.

Isthmian Games - Gets to hold the Isthmian Games with bonus from that.

Gate to the West - Can invest to create additional trade routes for Corinth that must be connected with provinces in Italy, Sicily or the Adriatic Sea.

The Mother and her Daughters - A slow but permanent improvement of relations between Corinth and her colonies to the west (and north)

Medean Wrath - An event chain where a woman betrayed by her husband seeks a terrible revenge. The player's character can try to interfere and that can lead either to a solution to the situation, no improvement or that the character gets caught up in the action and possible suffer as well.

Sisyphian Cunning - An event chain that a character with sufficient Finess, or traits for cunning, can get where he, or she, cunningly evades and dodges bad things that are coming towards them. There's always the risk that the bad thing will grow in size and come back until finally the character stumbles and the bad things catch up with them. But there's also a chance that they can either dodge this bad stuff until it goes away, they die or they find a solution for it.

Megara

Banquet of Plenty - A special event where a character can really, really piss off the elite families by spending their money to greatly enhance the happiness from the Freemen POPs and make the Populist faction eat out of the character's hand for a while.

Harken to me, oh, excellent children of Megara! - An old, traditional and aristocratic minded poet comes along and can, if persuaded, seek to rally the elite families of Megara around the state and so essentially make the elite close ranks and become more loyal in exchange for a loss of happiness from the Freemen

The Megarian School - a character can seek a philosophical education and so gain more Finess and a chance to gain intellectual traits

Argos (not much found on an initial search, or maybe my brain is sleeping today... )

Way of Pheidon - Gain a casus belli over the whole of the Peloponnessos

Beloved of Hera - Characters can deliver punishments to adulterous husbands and styled after Hera's punishments of the lovers of Zeus

That which was buried and forgotten (not specific for Argos but for holding the correct province) - The character can get an event chain where he, or she, goes to Mycene and has the old citadel excavated and there finds an old diadem of gold that the character takes on and creates the Kingdom of Mycene to replace the old state. But with this also brings on the Atreidae curse of family turning on itself.

 

[Gurkhal]

Information: Gonna take a little break and look things over, before I either come back to this project or start a new one.I wasn't really happy with how limited the suggestions for Argos turned out so I'll take a short break and then come back with suggestions for Imperator.

 

[Gurkhal]

So here comes a few suggestions from me for the Greeks in Imperator. I hope the new patch has not rendered them obsolete.

These are suggestions to make playing Greek minors more fun with more options. What I primarily want to "fight" with these ideas is that Greek minors are often essentially trapped diplomatically. Everyone around them can be in some kind of greater alliance or protected by a power to large to fight while you yourself can't ally with anyone powerful enough to help you.

I do think there's some merit in the diplomatic system we've got now but I also think that it can be limiting to what actions that you can take when playing a minor. For as I see it player agency and activity is good but its no fun simply to wait for a chance when one AI great power or another falls apart, only to be replaced by another in quick succession.

And while these suggestions are mostly intended for playing Greek minors and with an eye on conditions in Greece some of them may be of a greater interest in the game.

Suggestions

Freedom for the Greeks - All Greek City-States and Local Powers get a special Casus Belli against powers that holds them in some form of client status. Namely to go to war and take back their freedom to dictate their own fate and that this overrules any diplomatic arrangement between the minor and the greater power.

The reason for this is to allow Greek cities and such to be as relentlessly rebellious as they were in real life in regards to always rebelling and never accepting that their dreams of freedom were futile in an age of empires. When looking at ancient Greece one can see that from, at least, the Ionian Revolt and over to the Romans putting the final nails in the coffin of Greek freedom, there was friction between the Greek poleis and their various overlords, be they Greeks or non-Greeks. And during the the time period of the game it was also many rebellions against the Macedonians and then against the Romans. You would have thought the Greeks would have gotten the message. But they just didn't get it.

Some restictions on this to prevent a total spamfeast would also be reasonable.

Secret Pacts - This is an idea inspired by the Mithradatic War when there was one, or several, massacres of Italic people all across Greece. Not to mention Gallic tribes plotting to oust Caesar in Gaul despite formal submission to the Romans. The idea here is that for a very costly sum of points, or whatever, you can form a secret pact with someone else which is not visible for anyone who has not signed on it. And that it can override any previous diplomatic arrangements. This is to allow minors that were once subjugated to suddenly rise together against their overlord. But to avoid making it to damn good I would say the cost to sign it should be high and that it may only last for perhaps a year at most before it must be re-arranged with a new cost to create it.

War Proclamations - This was inspired by an episode I read in the book "In the name of Lykourgos" which mentioned that Cleomenes III, I think it was, made land reforms in Sparta and this caused both hostility from the elite outside of Sparta as well as support from the landless outside of Sparta, who feared/hoped that Cleomenes III would do the same when his army came march to their city. But he never did anything like that outside of Sparta and so lost the support but retained the hostility.

And this inspired me to an idea. That is that during a war a side can make a proclaimation about what they'll do after their victory. For example put a pretender on the enemy's throne, grant independence to a enemy provionce, putting a certain senatorial faction into power in the enemy's lands and more, which can lead to everything from creating a fifth column to hampering the enemy's war effort as people on the other side wonders which side the actually want to win this. BUT the effects are also after what the war score is. So promising everyting when you're at a -99 score won't convince anyone, but promising something when you're at a +70 score may well get an army to pop up and fight for you in a low loyalty province that you've just promised independence after your war.

But naturally the more stuff that you break your word about the more penalties you'll face as you'll be publically confirmed as a liar, not to mention that if you've renegaded on your word once before, much more will be required to take actions on behalf of your word again.

Men of Bronze - In my experience the famously warlike poleis of the Greeks are, at least in the Greece proper region, far to weak to be fun. They can only build ligh infantry and archers but in my opinion most of all should start with at least one cohort of heavy infantry while the larger poleis should have more and potentially start with some light cavalry cohorts as well. All to simulate just what incredible work it is to subjugate Greece and why it wasn't really done until the Roman empire can marching with its legions.

Please note that I don't think these Greek states should be able to produce heavy infantry or light cavalry without proper imports but I think that they should start with some cohorts like that.

Sea-bound City Sieges - To a large degree this is inspired by the Peloponessian War and that fact that Athens could hold out as long as they ruled, or at least contested, the Aegean Sea. My idea here is that a city in a province importing foodstuff through harbors can't be captured except by storm unless the harbor is also blockaded by friendly ships. Right now I feel they fall to easily and navies are not as vital for conducting campaigns as I've understood they were in the coasts of the Mediterranean.

 

[Gurkhal]

Information: Just want to inform that I don't know if I'll finish this as ambitiously as I intended from the start. The reason is that I am a bit alone with an interest of the Greeks among my friends and so to talk history with them and my brothers, Rome is more preferable. Hence I may change my focus to Rome which naturally means I'll be dropping my money and time into that subject instead.

BUT

Unless the sky falls down, I go broke or something like that, I intend to finish a write-up for Thebes and Boiotia, and perhaps some stuff about other parts as well. But I don't promise anything 100%. Because you never know. Yet even without a promise, those are my intentions.

I thought anyone reading this deserved to know rather than me abandoning this project or something in silence. "Better an end in horror, than a horror without end", as they say.

 

[hunter02]

Good thread. I'm fond of playing athens so i'll keep an eye on this.

I like the idea of some kind of meta-defensive-league amongst the greeks. So if the greeks fight amongst themselves that's fine, but when a foreign aggressor comes along they have a chance to band together to fight him, like they sometimes did historically, and perhaps this would override, temporarily, past diplomatic agreements. The current defensive leagues are okay, but a little too random usually.

 

[Gurkhal]

Good thread. I'm fond of playing athens so i'll keep an eye on this.

I like the idea of some kind of meta-defensive-league amongst the greeks. So if the greeks fight amongst themselves that's fine, but when a foreign aggressor comes along they have a chance to band together to fight him, like they sometimes did historically, and perhaps this would override, temporarily, past diplomatic agreements. The current defensive leagues are okay, but a little too random usually.

Thank you. And you as well, @Trin Tragula , for your kind words.

I thought this would be a fading thread but Greece is just to damn interesting and magnificent to not want to, and do, read about. So more on this thread will come!

 

[Crunbum]

Thank you. And you as well, @Trin Tragula , for your kind words.

I thought this would be a fading thread but Greece is just to damn interesting and magnificent to not want to, and do, read about. So more on this thread will come!

Keep em' coming!
It might not be the most active thread, since there's not really much to discuss, but that doesn't mean its not interesting to read

 

[fredrikslicer]

Form Caria - A regional power in western Anatolia that ruled cities like Helicarnassus
Form Sfard/Sparda - The native name for Lydia

 

[Gurkhal]

I'm slowly moving the Thebes+Boiotia project along. But in the meantime I thought that I should throw out an idea of general use with some specific Greek examples.

That is the idea of military reforms as part of the Military Traditions thing. The idea here is that Military Traditions would represent orthodox military thinking and development but that reforms would be essentially influences and ideas from other military traditions that's being brought in my encounters with such ways of fighthing. This is to represent that military developments does not happen in a vaccum but is in constant interaction with other military ideas and ways of conducting warfare. And that the more diverse opponents you face, the more diversity of new ideas you are likely to take on in arms-racing against these diverse opponents while someone facing only the same kind of enemy could just keep going.

Examples of this would be the Roman adaption of the manipular system after encountering the Samnites, the Persian adaption of increasing use of Greek mercenaries to fight as heavy infantry and the reforms of the Hellenistic armies when these came face-to-face with the Roman legions, and so on.

The idea is that when fighting with certain other military cultures you can get hybrid systems that grows from these, violent, interactions. So that a Greek state in Bactria that fights entirely different opponents from one clashing with the Roman empire would grow somewhat different branches from the tree of Greek Military Traditions. And that when you get a reform it will replace a step on the Military Tradition ladder so you have to pick between either going orthodox or getting this alternative step.

Example

Say that I am Macedon and I fight alot with Rome. Then maybe I'll get an alternative step to change the "Siege Craft" step with a bonus to my Light Infantry to represent that these are adapting certain Roman tactics in order to compete better. Thus I can either take the normal step and get a better siege ability or get my light infantry boosted. If I should take Siege Craft then naturally and I'll have to wait until another is presented to me, which may be the same or another.

Or get a reform for better horse archers if you often fight nations with the Persian Traditions, and so on.

 

[Gurkhal]

I've been holding out on these suggestions but finally decided to post them as I don't want to end up with ideas that never sees the light before I forget about them.

The first two are ways of government, appliable to both republics and monarchies, then there's an religious/cultural idea for Crete and finally there's a suggestion for dealing with the big states in the game.

Corsair and Populist government

The first idea is of "Corsair" government, which can be republics or monarchies, which is effectively that pirates and brigands have officially taken over the state apparatus, inspired by the pirates of Illyria, the heroes and "sacker of cities" who populated Homer's works and not to mention the pirates of Cilica and so on. The idea here is that you get a bonus to raiding and presumably more options with raiding but that in return your trade dwindles down so most likely you'll be heading out on the waves to collect the money, slaves and resources yourself. This is of course designed for a very aggressive naval-focused playstyle which of course won't work for everyone but I thought it could be an interesting concept to suggest.

On a personal note I really love the raiding scheme in CK2 and I would love to see raiding expanded in Imperator.

And connection with this, I also suggest that instead of just money or manpower, a state should be able to force trade relations with their tributaries. So that if you need iron you can force a nation that produces iron to become your tributary/whatever and force them to trade that iron with you. Should be useful for getting resources when you really isn't interested at the moment in annexing the lands with the desired resources on.

The second idea is "Populist Republic" which is based on some Popularii in ancient Rome, many of the tyrants of Archaic Greece and the Demagoges in Classical Athens. I suppose this its mostly done for republics but could presumably also work for a monarchy. But the idea is that a republic descends into "mob rule", okhlokratia as I believe that Aristotle put it, that is that the Populist faction is in power and will do pretty much anything to get the people to keep supporting them. Thus having all kinds of crazy events that simulate how the Populist does extreme things in order to deal with whatever is the topic of the day, before any long time consideration of policies.

Now this naturally sounds pretty bad and its should be ruinous in the long term. But this is also a way to get the Populist faction so powerful that it activates a bonus which allows the player or AI to do almost anything it wants with enough support in the street. Want to kill a bunch of guys by having a mob tear them apart? Institute a number of laws in rapid succession for little cost as a mob besieges the senate house and the senators begs for protection? Convert to monarchy while the new king is raised up by the hands of the poor? If you can whip the mob into a frenzy and direct it, then you can do almost anything you want.

The basic idea here is that it will destroy a state in the long term but be a way to force through policies, also drastic ones, in exchange for some short time loss if you can play the populist game with sufficient skill. Thus first get the population really crazy mad, keep them distracted and occupied, push through a potential radical set of policies, try to survive the harvest from the dragonseed that you've been sowing and then try to calm everything down into the new order you've founded during the storm. Should be risky and demanding some skill and luck, but I think that an adventerous player might find it an interesting way to speed up business.

The Bull Dance

As most here probably knows there's a legend that the Minotaur, or rather his father, demanded people he could eat and in my opinion Mary Renault's "The King Must Die" made an excellent story of this myth. So the idea here is connected with that Crete is getting some love and that a Cretan state, or a state with a capital on Crete, can decide to bring back the Bull Dancing of old.

With a flavour text about an old priestess from the backhills of Crete informs the ruler that such a game, with a hint that the blood of the dead Bull Dancers will be a sacrifice to the gods of Crete, is pleasing to the gods of the island and will grant their protection to the state with a capital there. Thus leading to instead of the normal athletics games you start having Bull Dancing with people leaping between the horns of a bull to the applause of the spectators...or get impaled or trampled to death by the bull while trying to jump between the horns. These Bull Dancers can come from volunteers who would die for a moment in the spotlight, slaves drilled to the practice or from the finest young men and women that can be forced from tributaries or captured in raids. The finer and more noble their background of the Dancers, the more prestige to the ruler who arranges the Bull Dance.

This is probably more flavour than anything else but I thought that I would suggest it if the Paradox would think to draw inspiration from the old Minoan civilization in order to offer alternative paths in the game.

Modifier to loyalty based on relative strength

This is a suggestion based on the idea that the big powers in the game are very, very hard to tackle. The basic gist of it is that there should be a modifier to character's loyalty based on the relative strength between a state and its neighbors. The point being that it would create internal problems for the big guys to a larger extent than for the small powers and so allow more oppertunities for the small powers to exploit against the big ones, and that the big powers wouldn't be able to use their strength as fully as smaller powers, hence allow more chance to fight the titans of the age.

 

[DukeLeto42]

The first idea is of "Corsair" government, which can be republics or monarchies, which is effectively that pirates and brigands have officially taken over the state apparatus, inspired by the pirates of Illyria, the heroes and "sacker of cities" who populated Homer's works and not to mention the pirates of Cilica and so on. The idea here is that you get a bonus to raiding and presumably more options with raiding but that in return your trade dwindles down so most likely you'll be heading out on the waves to collect the money, slaves and resources yourself. This is of course designed for a very aggressive naval-focused playstyle which of course won't work for everyone but I thought it could be an interesting concept to suggest.

Yes to corsairs.

The second idea is "Populist Republic" which is based on some Popularii in ancient Rome, many of the tyrants of Archaic Greece and the Demagoges in Classical Athens. I suppose this its mostly done for republics but could presumably also work for a monarchy. But the idea is that a republic descends into "mob rule", okhlokratia as I believe that Aristotle put it, that is that the Populist faction is in power and will do pretty much anything to get the people to keep supporting them. Thus having all kinds of crazy events that simulate how the Populist does extreme things in order to deal with whatever is the topic of the day, before any long time consideration of policies.

This is called "declare yourself dictator," and is already part of existing democracy mechanics. Such realms aren't really stable, and so transitioning back to republics or to another government form is already the goal.

The Bull Dance

As most here probably knows there's a legend that the Minotaur, or rather his father, demanded people he could eat and in my opinion Mary Renault's "The King Must Die" made an excellent story of this myth. So the idea here is connected with that Crete is getting some love and that a Cretan state, or a state with a capital on Crete, can decide to bring back the Bull Dancing of old.

With a flavour text about an old priestess from the backhills of Crete informs the ruler that such a game, with a hint that the blood of the dead Bull Dancers will be a sacrifice to the gods of Crete, is pleasing to the gods of the island and will grant their protection to the state with a capital there. Thus leading to instead of the normal athletics games you start having Bull Dancing with people leaping between the horns of a bull to the applause of the spectators...or get impaled or trampled to death by the bull while trying to jump between the horns. These Bull Dancers can come from volunteers who would die for a moment in the spotlight, slaves drilled to the practice or from the finest young men and women that can be forced from tributaries or captured in raids. The finer and more noble their background of the Dancers, the more prestige to the ruler who arranges the Bull Dance.

Here's the problem: Renault's work is extremely speculative, as we still don't know really that much about the bull dancing motiffs. The practices of Minoan civilization have been extinct for some 900 years, first taken over by the Mycenaean, Linear B alphabet-using, civilization, and then following Greece into its so-called "Dark Age" and into the realm of Classical Greece. Heck, we haven't even translated the Minoan language.

 

[Gurkhal]

This is called "declare yourself dictator," and is already part of existing democracy mechanics. Such realms aren't really stable, and so transitioning back to republics or to another government form is already the goal.

I'll admit that I am not a pro player when it comes to republics in Imperator and while I am somewhat sceptical about what you write I will take your word for it.

Here's the problem: Renault's work is extremely speculative, as we still don't know really that much about the bull dancing motiffs. The practices of Minoan civilization have been extinct for some 900 years, first taken over by the Mycenaean, Linear B alphabet-using, civilization, and then following Greece into its so-called "Dark Age" and into the realm of Classical Greece. Heck, we haven't even translated the Minoan language.

I thought I had labeled the idea as essentially "taken from historical fiction and not archeology" rather clearly. Hence why I mentioned that Mary Renault made an excellent story about the legend of Theseus. So just to make it clear, this is intended to be a flavourful alternative to the city games that Hellenistic states can normally have and its based on historical fiction and not archeology.

 

[Greece stronk]

This is a thread for ideas about additions to minor nations, at start, so that they can get some flavor and make them interesting to play.

I hope to be able to throw in some interesting stuff in regards to Thebes, Athens, Sparta, Messenia, Troizon, Corinth, Megara and Argos, at least. But I don't promise anything and if anyone has ideas, please feel free to post them as well.

Anyway, first out is Thebes.

Thebes

House of Kadmos - An event where a person shows up and its rumored this person is a direct descendent of Kadmos, the founder of Thebes. The player can let the ruler marry this character and so change the ruling family name to "Kadmidae" (or what it should be in proper ancient Greek at this time) and gain the personality trait "Bloodline of Kadmos" with bonuses to Oratory and Finess, and if the ruler is of this bloodline then gain Casus Belli on all Boiotia and a bonus to the family's prestige.

If possible this could only be fired one time during the game and so not milked by every new family that gets to rule Thebes.

Distant friends - An event with visitors from far away and the player's ruler can get friends and positive relations with Levantine or Persian character or state. The fluff itself may be a minor member of such a state's elite, a merchant or something else.

Curse of blindness – An event where interaction between characters are affected by a blindness, in one way or another, of the participants leading to unforeseen results. Not seldom of a tragic nature but some times also to joy and prosperity. The common thread should however be that just like Pentheus, Oedipus and Creon are all blind to what they are doing, and stumbles into disaster when the truth is finally revealed to them so the characters come into situations where unforseen consequences lies behind seemingly obvious solutions to the situations.

Just like with the "House of Kadmos" it would be nice if there are several different situations, and none can be brought up more than once in a single game, and all of them will not show up in a single game either.

Melting pot: Kadmean culture: Mix between Greek and Levantine in a state with both Boiotian and Levantine cultures, and ruled by Thebes or where a ruler of Thebes is married to a spouse of the Levantine culture. Possibly allowing the player to decide if the Kadmean culture should lean towards the Greek or Levantine part of its composition.

So, Kadmos was a mythological hero. Nothing wrong with having "Kadmidai" in the game, the name "Heraklidai" was used after all. However bringing in Levantine culture because of a millenium old story would be kind of weird.

 

[Selzro]

I'd like to see high-corruption Olympic athletes get caught cheating, in which case their home state is fined by whoever runs the Olympic Games. If they choose not to pay the fine, they lose the privilege of competing again and get a relations malus with other Greek states, as well as potentially other bad events (this happened to Athens once - first they sent one of their finest orators to try to haggle out of it, then when that didn't work they pulled out of the Olympics; but then the oracle at Delphi refused to give prophesies to Athenians in solidarity with Elis, and so Athens eventually caved and paid Elis what it was asking. If you visit Olympia today you'll see a neat set of pedestals leading up to the track - that's where they placed all the statues of Zeus they made out of the fines they collected from cheating athletes).

Btw, I'm still a bit confused about how the Olympic games work and what happens to the athletes sent there. I can think of no historical reason for them to not return to their home city after competing, nor for the city hosting them to be unable to compete there.

 

[Gurkhal]

So, Kadmos was a mythological hero. Nothing wrong with having "Kadmidai" in the game, the name "Heraklidai" was used after all. However bringing in Levantine culture because of a millenium old story would be kind of weird.

Its not historically 100% correct but I think that it gives flavour, gives an alternative path for this state and also allows for Kadmos to be added to the game in some form or another. I understand this is not to everyone's taste but personally I like this kind of stuff. And its in the end up to the devs to decide what to add or not, so I feel no shame in suggesting what seems like a good idea to me.

 

[EmpireOfCyprus]

I don't know how much it fits historically, but I would like for the greek colonies (Massilia, Emporion, Hemeroskopeion, Menesthei, etc.) to have some event or general flavor about there interactions with native population of Gaul/Iberia.

Then again, I might be too much of a Massalia fanboy, but I like their unique starting position.