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James The 1st

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The idea of factions are great, but lets face it, Paradox's implementation of them is pretty bad. They basically just serve to give you massive rebellions every few years and there is nothing one can do to stop it short of killing all faction members.
Now Wiz, the designer of the CKII+ mod has been cooking up some really good stuff for factions. I'll let the pictures speak for themselves.
Here's a look at how civil wars work with the new faction system. For our example, we have the Princely Faction, the faction that looks after the interests of the feudal lords, in the HRE. They're shall we say, less than happy with their current liege.
mTAP4.png


When a faction's mood drops to unhappy or below, they can start making demands of their ruler. The exact nature of the demands depends on the faction, for example the Princely Faction is likely to want things such as tax privileges, and low CA, feudal taxes and levies. In most cases they will simply ask and get increasingly angry if you refuse, but each faction also has a few things they are willing to go to war over. For the Princely Faction, CA is one such thing they can threaten war over.
I76GC.png


If the ruler refuses the ultimatum and war breaks out, the other factions in the realm get the option to weigh in, and can either declare for the rebels, throw their support behind their liege, or remain neutral. Whether a faction is willing to join a civil war on either side depends on its mood, though each faction has a limit on which faction wars it is interested in (the Court faction will never join CA wars for example, because they have no interest in reducing the power of the monarch). If a player's faction decides one way or another, the player is obliged to follow, but if their faction declares neutrality the player gets the option to decide for themselves which side to support. A player who is not a member of a faction is presumed to be uninterested in politics and doesn't get asked, period.
4x8VW.png


As in the old civil war system, a pretender or sitting liege who wins the war will be expected to reward their supports and punish the enemy side. A civil war will also reset negative faction moods, no matter which side wins.
Nmj8L.png


Finally, a little tidbit to show you that factions aren't all threats and uprisings: keeping your factions happy can result in all sorts of benefits with varying strength depending on their power. For example, here is the effects of a weak but happy Princely Faction deciding to grant their liege extra troops.
nXmgg.png


(Yes, I know the modifier in the last screenshot is wrong. It should be feudal levies, obviously)

A look at independence wars under the new faction system.

Under the new faction system, besides the permanent factions there are also 'Movements', which work much like the factions in the base game. One much movement is the Separatist Movement, which seeks independence from their liege.
Elo6x.png


Unlike the base game however, characters will not join an independence movement willy-nilly. Characters who join must have separatist sentiment, which comes from events that can happen if they or their faction are unhappy with their liege. Separatist sentiment ranges from 0-5, and whether a character will join an independence movement is a essentially a binary decision based on their de jure status, culture, religion and so on. A character with no sentiment will never join an independence movement, while non-de jure wrong-culture wrong-religion vassal may only require 1 or 2 points, but a same-culture same-religion vassal will require a very high sentiment to join.
35S07.png


Once the movement is formed and grows strong enough, the rest works straightforward enough in much the same manner as vanilla. War is declared either by event, or (if the faction leader is a player) by decision, and the ensuing war determines whether the separatists gain their independence or are thrown into prison with a revoke reason. Unlike regular faction civil wars, there is no picking of sides in an independence war - everyone who didn't join the revolt are presumed to be more or less loyal.
bWBEv.png

alnDh.png

Last preview, just a look at the wants of the different factions:
cogpF.png

LIaFc.png

YHefY.png

rjOBW.png


Of course, faction moods are not limited to only the things listed above, but can also change as a result of your choice during events...
ZqBay.png


... or by completing ambitions.
q7DqI.png


I've got some final work to do on it, but hopefully I'll be able to release a beta in a few hours. Otherwise tomorrow.
 

MasterOfGrey

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This is really really interesting. I like it. :p

Edit: It may be the first CK2 mod I ever play with.
 

User29

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where do i download this?:eek:hmy:
 

MasterOfGrey

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This faction system should really be standalone.
 

Dreamshifter

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No, it should not be a standalone. The maker of ck+ made it so it's pretty normal that it's included in the mod. You guys should give ck+ a try, you will love it.

I have tried it, not my thing.

So I guess, I'll have to hope the Devs take inspiration from it, or just live with Factions as they are. Ah, well. Vanilla will do.
 

grommile

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there is nothing one can do to stop it short of killing all faction members.
Nothing except: Hire a better spymaster, so that their Scheme action fires faster. Cultivate relation-improving traits in your children. Dispense gifts. Shuffle titles. If you discover that they're plotting, imprison them.
 

grumphie

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personally, i dont like it. but then again, i dont like CK2+ AT ALL, so im glad this isnt vanilla. while the current system is far from perfect, this looks completly awfull. why in hell's name does a have a mood?mood's are irelevant. weak rulers mean you can grab power, and strong rulers mean you should lsoe them, regardless of the fact wether he is liked or not.
 

agustinalarcon

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Nothing except: Hire a better spymaster, so that their Scheme action fires faster. Cultivate relation-improving traits in your children. Dispense gifts. Shuffle titles. If you discover that they're plotting, imprison them.
I have played only two full games of CK2, so, my opinion may not be worth it, but I do fully agree with that. I keep reading here in the forums people who just kill everyone to get all problems solved, or think it's the only way. I never had to go that far, never.
And cultivating relation-improving traits in my children, well, that's really the best thing. Or elective monarchy, so you can choose the best guy around from your dinasty.

Concerning the factions.. wow ! It seems really impressive ! As soon as I really finish my second game (the end is less than 50 years away), I'll definitively give CK2+ a try. It was already planned, but now with this even more. Really impressive job !
 

monsterfurby

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personally, i dont like it. but then again, i dont like CK2+ AT ALL, so im glad this isnt vanilla. while the current system is far from perfect, this looks completly awfull. why in hell's name does a have a mood?mood's are irelevant. weak rulers mean you can grab power, and strong rulers mean you should lsoe them, regardless of the fact wether he is liked or not.

Not denying your right to not like it - but that's not really how things worked in reality. More often than not the decision of whether to take up arms or consider violence in any way shape or form depended on quite personal considerations. Not to mention that "mood" doesn't necessarily mean "happy or not" but is an abstraction for how hawkish/doveish the general atmosphere within the faction is. If you've ever been to a meeting of any organisation regardless of size and form, you'll probably know what I mean.
 

Ciaphas Cain

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personally, i dont like it. but then again, i dont like CK2+ AT ALL,

Is there a specific reason why? I haven't tried it yet but know a mod from Wiz for EU Rome which left me with mixed feelings.

I keep reading here in the forums people who just kill everyone to get all problems solved, or think it's the only way.

It's not the only way, but the most, well, satisfying... :cool:
 

OrdepNM

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Another reason why ck2 is far superior than vanilla.

I think you're missing a + there :p Sorry for pointing it out but I found it funny.

Anyway to those wondering where this is, bear in mind its not released yet. Should be released sometime today tough.
 

Comradebot

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Another reason why ck2 is far superior than vanilla.

People who dislike ck2+ have really poor taste. Atleast they could give a reason.

So the only reason someone dislikes CK2+ is because they don't know any better?

I've played it, and while it does a few things fantastically, it also makes some questionable changes that completely turn me off. Maybe its changed since, but I was incredibly not fond of the way battles and sieges had been altered... enough that I couldn't keep a long term game going. Its always, to me, been a mod that tries to fix everything, regardless if it was broke or not.