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Fix AI debt spiral / alliance issues. It's been broken for weeks, and it's gamebreaking.

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I've sunk most of my free time into this game. I love it but the design choices stupefy me. The AI debt makes the game unplayable. They consistently make choices that most of the player base doesn't agree with. I just don't get why instead of making more tags and provinces, which the game was not built for and the territory and state mechanics were not built around, they fix the problems like this debt spiral.
 
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jolsz said:
I just don't get why instead of making more tags and provinces, which the game was not built for and the territory and state mechanics were not built around, they fix the problems like this debt spiral.
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neondt's job is adding content.

it is not adding features, or fixing bugs, in the game engine or the AI.
 
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grommile said:
neondt's job is adding content.

it is not adding features, or fixing bugs, in the game engine or the AI.
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I understand man, its not like i don't want to support the new content for the game. I'm adding my two cents because I never have before. I'm fed up that since 1.26 I've been unable to play the game for decent time every patch because it's so broken. I've paid a ridiculous amount of money for this game because i do love it. But i want it to work. That's what i'm saying
 
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Kuantum said:
Two months now..

Doesn't this fall under The Consumer Rights Act?

Goods must be:

  • Satisfactory quality.
  • Fit for purpose.
  • As described.
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A game has to be Fallout 76 levels of bad before you can even think about doing that really. The game is still playable, it's just that allies are somewhat useless now. I've gotten some good hours of fun, just would've been more fun if the game was in a better state. Still refusing to buy Emperor until it's fixed.
 
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jolsz said:
I've sunk most of my free time into this game. I love it but the design choices stupefy me. The AI debt makes the game unplayable. They consistently make choices that most of the player base doesn't agree with. I just don't get why instead of making more tags and provinces, which the game was not built for and the territory and state mechanics were not built around, they fix the problems like this debt spiral.
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I've been saying this exact same thing for a while. Not only there is a lot of flip flop design but the new content always introduce new balance issues, questionable new mechanics or simply more fat to an a game that already has a lot of fat. Take for example the constant inclusion of more provinces and tags. What exactly do they add to the game? How exactly is adding more tags better than flashing the already preexisting ones?

Dev time is limited and there are many places where what is needed is a rebalance and a clear vision of how such and so region should work instead of just more stuff. SA is an example of a place that can benefit from a few more tags and stuff to do. The HRE was a place that really didn't need new tags and provinces.

And let's not forget the old time tradition of the AI being a headless chicken that can't handle the new mechanics, which is, unfortunately, true to this day.
 
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Zaddy said:
A game has to be Fallout 76 levels of bad before you can even think about doing that really. The game is still playable, it's just that allies are somewhat useless now. I've gotten some good hours of fun, just would've been more fun if the game was in a better state. Still refusing to buy Emperor until it's fixed.
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I give you that "Satisfactory quality" is open for interpretation, sure.

Speaking for myself, I am not getting any "satisfaction" from my 30€. It is now the second time I am misled by this company. Imperator and Emperor DLC.
 
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Kuantum said:
I give you that "Satisfactory quality" is open for interpretation, sure.

Speaking for myself, I am not getting any "satisfaction" from my 30€. It is now the second time I am misled by this company. Imperator and Emperor DLC.
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I agree. Paradox DLCs used to be day one buys for me, but after they release stuff like Golden Century (simply not worth $10) and Emperor (new content might be good, actual patch 1.30 is a disaster), I now know that I need to wait at least a few days or weeks before considering buying. It's a shame.
 
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Kuantum said:
Doesn't this fall under The Consumer Rights Act?
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While some users here may be lawyers, they may not be lawyers living in an applicable jurisdiction, and you are almost certainly not paying them for legal advice, so they are not your lawyer and will not offer you legal advice.

If you really want to get an answer, rather than just escalate the temperature of a forum thread, talk to a lawyer (who will probably want to be paid if you want actual legal advice rather than a non-professional opinion) or non-profit consumer rights organization in your jurisdiction of residence.
 
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grommile said:
While some users here may be lawyers, they may not be lawyers living in an applicable jurisdiction, and you are almost certainly not paying them for legal advice, so they are not your lawyer and will not offer you legal advice.

If you really want to get an answer, rather than just escalate the temperature of a forum thread, talk to a lawyer (who will probably want to be paid if you want actual legal advice rather than a non-professional opinion) or non-profit consumer rights organization in your jurisdiction of residence.
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Thank you for your advice regarding the legal implications of a post on the internet.

Is it required to be a lawyer to express an opinion about consumer rights in a public forum? I don't think an opinion expressed in this space is legally binding.

I'm not "trying to escalate" the thread. Everyone gets offended by everything. Steam as a return policy, if you don't like it and if you only used it for two hours you can ask for a refund. Obviously, in a game like EU 4 or Imperator it is impossible to know if I like it in a two hours frame, this is very pertinent, hence the question about consumer rights.
 
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I didn't mean to imply that you intended to raise the temperature; I apologize for my poor choice of words.

Getting a useful opinion on the subject from a web forum may be tricky. Many people have such opinions; some are overly cynical and some are overly prone to is-ought confusion, and parties at both ends of the scale are liable to be very noisy in disputing each other's opinions.

For my part I suspect the cynics are right, but my opinion's worth no more than the next guy's.

The product is fit for purpose up to a point, in the sense that it is installable, you can play the game, and many people can find entertainment thereby.

The product is not easily demonstrable to be "not as described".

The question of quality is harder to assess, since some people will tolerate flaws that would drive others to flaming rage.

Given the sum involved, if you pressed the point in court you'd likely be going through the small claims process, which tends to be handled on a basis of "the parties shall carry their own costs" even in jurisdictions with a strong tradition of "loser pays".
 
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There are certainly strategy games with worse AI than the current state of EU4. If all of them would be vulnerable to a lawsuit...
 
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I'll just chime in to add to the list of players who refuse to buy Emperor and play the Austria patch until the debt spiral is fixed. Other quirks and bugs with the current state of the game I can accept, but not this. PDX, please prioritize this, and release a hotfix for it as soon as possible.
 
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Lawyers :D
I remember HOI3 being an utter shiteshow over 10 years ago too. People threatening legal action.
So funny.
The best way of dealing with PDX is to moan like hell until they get sick of hearing it. Its always been like that.

Which is why this thread should be kept right at the top.

Either that or don't buy their products on a mass scale, but that's not going to happen.
 
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Zaddy said:
FWIW the absolute earliest I would expect a patch is mid-September. I don't think they're going to try and hotfox this.
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Whilst it's plausible the next patch comes out in mid-September, I don't see why a patch this month isn't also plausible:
Is there any particular reason to believe it'll take at least another month-and-a-half, or is this just a hunch?
 
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AlphaMikeOmega said:
Whilst it's plausible the next patch comes out in mid-September, I don't see why a patch this month isn't also plausible:
Is there any particular reason to believe it'll take at least another month-and-a-half, or is this just a hunch?
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It was just a hunch. Sure, it was acknowledged a while ago, but the team is just now getting back into the office, right? The AI is far and away the most complex part of the game. Generally I try to not place very high expectations on PDX nowadays. I would love to be wrong though!
 
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