Favorite air units mix?

[unmerged(994)]

Looking at the charts so gently provided by StateMachine, it is quite clear that the capabilites of the different air units overlap quite a bit. I find this a brillliant solution, as it gives the possibility to focus on some aircraft classes and to tailor the best suited airforce for every need.
As long as these charts remain the same (e.g. no naval attack for the dive bombers), which will be your airforce mix?
These are mine:

GERMANY:
Interceptor (to protect homeland and the front lines)
Escorts (to protect deep raids - very useful in a possibile battle of Britain)
Tac bombers (more powerful than the Stukas, lacking air to air but protected by escorts - I know that they are also more expensive, but I will take only the best)
Naval bombers (without a decent navy, a land based naval aviation will have to make the day - plus they yeld nice combat bonuses for the U-boats)
Ev. Strategic bombers
Yeah, mine will be a Stukaless Luftwaffe


UK
Interceptor and escort (same as the germans)
Dive bombers (cheap units to pound the Italians, no way to go on the germans with air-to-ground early)
Torpedo bombers (as an add-on for the RN, cheap but effective)
Strategic bombers. A lot of them.

USA
Multi-role and escort (long reach needed also in defense, MR will be the choice to have a complete air cover in the Pacific theater)
Tac - naval - strategic bombers. No reason to go for cheap units.

JAPAN
Interceptor and escort
Dive bombers (just to support the army with something worthy but cheap)
Torpedo AND Naval bombers (everything useful at sea is a must)

ITALY
Interceptors (defense is a priority, not ever think to face the RAF in attack if the Germans don't carry the day)
Dive and torpedo bombers (they are cheap, aren't them?)

FRANCE
Interceptors. No realistic possibility of doing anything else.

 

[Generalisimo]

with germany?
i prefer a lot of escorts/interceptors and stukas to help my armies, no tactical bombers for me
also prepare the stukas to bomb ships, maybe even prepare them to board a ship (carrier) and make operations from there !!!!

EDIT: this is 1000 post!!!

 

[unmerged(994)]

stukas to help my armies, no tactical bombers for me

Well, mr 1000 posts , the stats for tactical attack of the dive bomber (aka Stuka) are: 1-2-4-6, while the tac bomber reads 1-4-6-8. AND it has more range. AND it is capable of nav attack. And of strat attack. AND, most of all, there is also a model 4 (jet tac bomber), with a value of 12. Would you really rely on a dead-end tech?

 

[Generalisimo]

Originally posted by Loewefuchs
Well, mr 1000 posts , the stats for tactical attack of the dive bomber (aka Stuka) are: 1-2-4-6, while the tac bomber reads 1-4-6-8. AND it has more range. AND it is capable of nav attack. And of strat attack. AND, most of all, there is also a model 4 (jet tac bomber), with a value of 12. Would you really rely on a dead-end tech?

yes, i am totally stubborn

well, i do not see how they put those stats but they must have a good point...
because i do not see how you can kill a tank with a strategig bombing.... i think that a tank killer is better a fighter/bomber (like for example a P51 killing Tigers) or a dive bomber (a stuka), not a B17.....

 

[unmerged(2833)]

Originally posted by Loewefuchs
Well, mr 1000 posts , the stats for tactical attack of the dive bomber (aka Stuka) are: 1-2-4-6, while the tac bomber reads 1-4-6-8. AND it has more range. AND it is capable of nav attack. And of strat attack. AND, most of all, there is also a model 4 (jet tac bomber), with a value of 12. Would you really rely on a dead-end tech?

Because, for example, you get 1.45 Dive Bomber for every Tac Bomber? (both second model, 4 to 6 tactical attack)

And the relative cost in manpower is even better for Dive Bombers?

And Dive defend are more durable? And equally proficient in air-to-air?And have better detection rating?


The only advatages of Tac Bombers are strategic, naval attacks, and range.

 

[grumbold]

They managed to kill lots of tanks by strategic bombing (or at least flip them over) by the inefficient tactic of carpeting bombing the whole area where they expected enemy tanks to be. Not very elegant, but when you've got enough bombers that you could crashland them in the Channel and walk from England to France without getting your feet wet, who cares?

 

[Generalisimo]

Originally posted by DarthMaur
Because, for example, you get 1.45 Dive Bomber for every Tac Bomber? (both second model, 4 to 6 tactical attack)

And the relative cost in manpower is even better for Dive Bombers?

And Dive defend are more durable? And equally proficient in air-to-air?And have better detection rating?


The only advatages of Tac Bombers are strategic, naval attacks, and range.

well, something for my dive bombers!!!
thanks DarthMaur!!

 

[unmerged(994)]

Hey, we're speaking about Germany, not Italy or France: a BIG industrial powerhouse, one that can afford to buy only the shiniest jewels. Dive bombers seem just to be the cheaper and less flexible alternative to tactical.
Sure, they have better detection ability, but what will you do when you will finally have the jets? Remain stuck on the propellors?
Plus, tac bombers benefit from IFF, air-to-surface missiles, basic improved and advanced radio and radar navigation, napalm bombs and gyrostabilized bombing sights, while dives can only afford the advantage of dive-drop bombs.
Dive bombers are the past, tac the future.

 

[unmerged(2833)]

Originally posted by Loewefuchs

Plus, tac bombers benefit from IFF, air-to-surface missiles, basic improved and advanced radio and radar navigation, napalm bombs and gyrostabilized bombing sights, while dives can only afford the advantage of dive-drop bombs.
Dive bombers are the past, tac the future.

Well, barring Rockets, research tend to give the same improvements to both Tac and Dive... which, give you will have greater numbers of Dive, will benefit them more

 

[unmerged(994)]

Well, barring Rockets, research tend to give the same improvements to both Tac and Dive

Well, if you don'take into account the navigation issues, that give 6 bonuses for tac's during night, rain & snow... Round-the-clock and round-the-year bombing seems not too bad as an advantage, even if you don't take into account the rest of the stuff.

 

[unmerged(2833)]

Originally posted by Loewefuchs
Well, if you don'take into account the navigation issues, that give 6 bonuses for tac's during night, rain & snow... Round-the-clock and round-the-year bombing seems not too bad as an advantage, even if you don't take into account the rest of the stuff.

Well, depends if you are not fighting in north Africa, for example. 3:2 advantage would be more important there.

 

[unmerged(11173)]

Originally posted by Generalisimo
yes, i am totally stubborn

well, i do not see how they put those stats but they must have a good point...
because i do not see how you can kill a tank with a strategig bombing.... i think that a tank killer is better a fighter/bomber (like for example a P51 killing Tigers) or a dive bomber (a stuka), not a B17.....

But a B-17 is not a tac bomber, it's a strategic bomber. In my book four engines equals strategic bomber. I'd call a B-25 or A-20 a tac bomber. Or Ju-88.

 

[unmerged(994)]

Well, depends if you are not fighting in north Africa, for example

Well, it seems to me that the Russian theatre will be more critical for Germany

 

[unmerged(2833)]

Originally posted by Loewefuchs
Well, it seems to me that the Russian theatre will be more critical for Germany

Germany?I though we're talking about Italy

 

[unmerged(994)]

For Italy I definitely agree with you: dive bombers, torpedo planes and interceptors. Nothing more, nothing less.
See my first post in this thread.

 

[Hakkapeliitta]

The choice between dive and tac bombers depends also on when you expect to enter a war. Just look at the air doctrines: Germany starts the game already with 12002 = "Blitz" Bombing Doctrine which gives +25 max organization to dive bombers (and "only" +10 to tac bombers). Looking closely at the doctrines it seems that eventually the air doctrines allow tac bombers to almost catch up the organizational edge of early war dive bombers.

So if I plan on waging war sooner than later I'll definitely need to have both dive bombers and tactical bombers to help the Wehrmacht. Dive bombers will be my mobile "artillery" operating close to the frontline (so I don't have to slow down my motorized and mechanical divisions with extra artillery brigades. Instead they will have engineer/AA bdes for extra manoeuvrebility/protection) Tactical bombers will be mainly tasked with enemy rear area operational targets (airfields etc) occasionally helping out the Stukas where additional ordnance delivery is needed.

Also the lesser fuel consumption is a bonus for dive bombers, as most countries I'll want to play will probably be very short of the black liquid.

It's amazing how much time one can kill with HoI even without having the game