Factors affecting the success of convoy raiding

[sekelsenmat]

Hello,

Does anyone know if convoy raiding requires a good detection value? Because I tried with a BB fleet to do some Bismarck-style raids and this fleet just wastes fuel as I had an impression that it rarely found convoys. The subs on the other hand had no problem finding any convoys. So I wonder what's the reason, if the BB-fleet needs seaplane tenders with high detection to actually find convoys to raid?

I also wonder if cruiser subs with 1-seaplane would find more convoys or always go for all torpedoes when convoy raiding? Thanks

I couldn't find any info on the wiki or in older threads.

 

[Bergermeister]

Surface detection I believe plays a role. Check surface detection vs. surface visibility. The bigger the the difference in favor of detection, the better it will be as a surface raider. I am basing this off just my experience, though, and am not an expert on naval affairs.

 

[bitmode]

Does anyone know if convoy raiding requires a good detection value?

It does for surface ships.

Similar to patrols, there is first a random process to decide whether a spotting process will start and secondly this process needs to run to 100% to complete the spotting. When the spotting process starts, you can hover it to see what is going on:

The same factors that speed up the spotting process also increase the chance for it to start. That is: high surface detection, low surface visibility, and good speed. BBs are not really great in any of these departments.
Although it does not make a difference between subs and surface fleets, the chance will also be reduced by low mission mission efficiency (when assigning too many regions).

So I wonder what's the reason, if the BB-fleet needs seaplane tenders with high detection to actually find convoys to raid?

Yes, but even then the results will probably not be very great. Keep in mind the stats of a task force are averaged across all ships, so just having a minority of ships with good detection won't improve things by much.

I also wonder if cruiser subs with 1-seaplane would find more convoys or always go for all torpedoes when convoy raiding? Thanks

Spotting compares the visibility of one side with the detection of the other and vice versa. As subs have virtually no surface visibility they are pretty good at spotting by default and don't need nearly as much detection as surface vessels do. If you you compare how long it takes subs to spot the convoys versus actually sinking them, the latter usually takes longer, so I'd optimize for that.

 

[bitmode]

For reference, these are the relevant stats of convoys:

• surface detection: 10
• surface visibility: 14
• speed: 12

 

[Mousetick]

I once tried to express in relatively plain English how the spotting process works, based on formulas provided by bitmode, presumably retrieved from deep inside the bowels of the game: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...d-possible-suggestions.1389834/#post-26572225

Although it was in the context of a discussion about patrols, it's relevant to spotting for convoy raiding.

As bitmode pointed out above, even with enhanced (average) detection, a BB-based task force is not great vs. convoys due to its comparatively higher (average) visibility and similar (average) speed. Not to mention the wasteful fuel usage, compared to the much more efficient submarines.

 

[sekelsenmat]

I once tried to express in relatively plain English how the spotting process works, based on formulas provided by bitmode, presumably retrieved from deep inside the bowels of the game: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...d-possible-suggestions.1389834/#post-26572225

Although it was in the context of a discussion about patrols, it's relevant to spotting for convoy raiding.

I think that the main part that I was missing is that convoy raiding uses spotting too. I thought it could be simply a flat % chance. For the BB force the spotting didn't start, so I was confused as to why. For subs it starts and progresses to 100% very fast, fast enough that often you don't even notice it.

I must say it is almost realistic, upon decoding the air spotting messages from UK planes, the italians often returned all their convoys to port. So surface forces often sortied to find the sea empty... Convoy detection itself was actually made by radio decripting (Ultra) or air recon in reality. People didn't really use such patrols in the mediterranean. The UK had no need for that since they had better solutions and Italy couldn't take the fuel usage, so they used air recon.

As bitmode pointed out above, even with enhanced (average) detection, a BB-based task force is not great vs. convoys due to its comparatively higher (average) visibility and similar (average) speed. Not to mention the wasteful fuel usage, compared to the much more efficient submarines.

Besides the roleplay value of a surface sorties wrecking havoc in the Atlantic, I was trying to trash the escort actually ... so I guess I'll need a much more specialized force to do that. I'll try with Panzerschiff + Light Cruisers next with plenty of Seaplanes. It might use less fuel and find more convoys.

 

[Mousetick]

Edit: removed incorrect interpretation based on wrong assumptions.

Besides the roleplay value of a surface sorties wrecking havoc in the Atlantic, I was trying to trash the escort actually ... so I guess I'll need a much more specialized force to do that. I'll try with Panzerschiff + Light Cruisers next with plenty of Seaplanes. It might use less fuel and find more convoys.

Sounds good. Let us know how it goes.