@Johan what about allow it from the start, but fabricating will take some time (like before Mare Nostrum)? Like before Tech 7 it will take 2 years. Between Tech 7 and 12 it will take 1 year and after Tech 16 it will be instantaneous?
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Fabricate Claim unlocked by technology in 1.17
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@Johan what about allow it from the start, but fabricating will take some time (like before Mare Nostrum)? Like before Tech 7 it will take 2 years. Between Tech 7 and 12 it will take 1 year and after Tech 16 it will be instantaneous?
Is this some indirect, backdoor way of Pdox pushing Stellaris and HOI4?
If so, that's some clever shit...
If so, that's some clever shit...
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Other popular patch 1.17 changes:
You are only able to declare war on a country with fewer provinces than you.
Merchants are now unlocked through Maritime ideas.
Buildings now require a monarch with at least 3 Administrative skill to build.
Missionaries are now a spy action that can only be used on other countries.
You are only able to declare war on a country with fewer provinces than you.
Merchants are now unlocked through Maritime ideas.
Buildings now require a monarch with at least 3 Administrative skill to build.
Missionaries are now a spy action that can only be used on other countries.
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If this is done then stability needs to also be buyable through ducats like EU2/EU3. EU4 stability operates on a fundamentally different economy (MP) that is both incredibly limited and already susceptible to bad monarch rolls. "No-CB best CB" is a once in a century thing, no one wants to pay thousands in already-strained ADM to fight a few wars.
Fabricating claims is just stupid and ahistorical. But it serves its purpose well in the gameplay.
Maybe adding different claim strenghts could improve the situation, or even replace fabricating.
E.g. events, different religion neighbors, territorial claims (regions, areas shared with rivals and religious enemies, basically better border friction), ideas (trade ideas improve the chance that you get a cb on high trade value provinces, offensive is more expansionist, etc.).
This way fabricating itself wouldn't be enough for a regular cb, or it would greatly increase the coring cost and the AE.
Maybe adding different claim strenghts could improve the situation, or even replace fabricating.
E.g. events, different religion neighbors, territorial claims (regions, areas shared with rivals and religious enemies, basically better border friction), ideas (trade ideas improve the chance that you get a cb on high trade value provinces, offensive is more expansionist, etc.).
This way fabricating itself wouldn't be enough for a regular cb, or it would greatly increase the coring cost and the AE.
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If people are able to fabricate claims in 769, then it doesn't make sense that the "technology" to do so is lost for a couple hundred years.
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The only, only sensible change I can see is some limitation on fabricating claims on HRE territory. Maybe the first imperial reform could prevent Christian nations from fabricating claims on HRE controlled land. That could cut down on Austria going on a rampage and still keep other means available (religious CB, missions, nationalism etc.)
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Better pacing on what standard? It seems like the constant theme is that strong players are getting past the point of AI competition too early in your mind, but is that actually a problem? You don't heap the kinds of bonuses to the AI that Civ does for example, not even on hard (not even close), and yet players often win the game outright long before they run out of time, and could flatten the largest maps even with all victories turned off. Maybe it's not such a big deal if the full timeline isn't meaningful to everyone.
Making players wait it out isn't fun. Take away conquest, and players will find another way to do war or have nothing to do in too many cases. What benefit does this confer?
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@Johan Like I mentioned on twitter, I would like to see the fabricate claim action be on a global cool down that decreases through technology and ideas. For example have it at 20 years at tech 1, 10 year at tech 3 etc. This would decrease the current claim spam in early game.
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Conquest is easily one of the least useful CB methods in the game already. It's worth doing if you don't have better things for diplomats to do (improve relations, annex vassals, building spy network for other uses) but carries more AE and/or much less flexibility in what you take. Nerfing this option comes off as...bizarre.
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Too bad. I would certainly have loved a return of a system similar to EUIII. You had more claims through events though, and EU4 could work a bit more in that direction, like adding CB against rivals, CB on spy discovery,... and CB like trade dispute and others would actually make sense to use, at least before getting access to better CB. There could even be a few more CB spead out in idea groups to make religious a bit less overwhelming.
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If they overhaul the mission system & allow you to get good claims through missions more easily, then it might be feasible to push fabricating claims back. Otherwise no, because it would slow down early game to a crawl.
I guess the silent majority would like that as well. If you like to change the pacing of how the game changes as the centuries passes, there are soft caps you may implement as well. Like:
- Changing the claim time length as Dip tech increases.
- Reducing the spy network cost as Dip tech increases.
- Increasing the spy network growth rate as Dip tech increases.
- Adding tresholds larger than the cost of the claim for the size of the spy network that allow you to fabricate claims, may change as Dip tech increases.
Does Dip tech difference between the spying nation and the nation being spyed on influence the spy network growth? If not that would be an added incentive to keep up in Dip tech.
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Lackluster Mare Nostrum, corruption and now this? It seems the devs are truly lost 
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I think you could make it so that it isn't free (other than spy network creation) Maybe have it work like a tiered system. Every claim gets you 10 AE until Tech 7, then at Tech 7 a claim gets you 5 AE, then at tech 10, 0 AE. Something along those lines.
Or, make them more difficult to get: So until Tech 7, it takes 40 Spy Network size to Fabricate, then lower that through technologies.
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I'm sorry, I thought what you meant was that you wanted them to fix existing features rather than add new ones, not fix existing features rather than change current ones. Basically fabricating claims is a covert action and hence technically covered by espionage. As I understand it in 1.17 most (all?) espionage actions are unlocked by tech rather than the espionage idea group; instead espionage ideas makes you better at espionage, rather than unlocking more actions.
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I would prefer a different solution than using tech level. CB generation should maybe be limited to the following (brainstorming):
- Rivals (permanent conquest CB on rivals' provinces)
- Special CB for consolidating culture (e.g. France should be able to go to war to annex other French culture provinces)
- Religious wars (take this out of the Religion idea tree and give it to everyone)
- Trade wars
- Conquest CBs from Missions (historical, dynamic)
- Revenge / Policing: If an ally with high trust loses provinces to someone, you should get a CB to help them reclaim it
- Ally's core reclamation: Ability to declare war using your ally's reconquest CBs; only the ally can get the province (again, limited by high trust)
Just some ideas.
- Rivals (permanent conquest CB on rivals' provinces)
- Special CB for consolidating culture (e.g. France should be able to go to war to annex other French culture provinces)
- Religious wars (take this out of the Religion idea tree and give it to everyone)
- Trade wars
- Conquest CBs from Missions (historical, dynamic)
- Revenge / Policing: If an ally with high trust loses provinces to someone, you should get a CB to help them reclaim it
- Ally's core reclamation: Ability to declare war using your ally's reconquest CBs; only the ally can get the province (again, limited by high trust)
Just some ideas.
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I wouldn't mind seeing fabricate claims weakened; but to balance it out, it would make sense for permanent CB vs heathens (perhaps reducing Deus Vult to just heretics). The whole point of losing stability for going to war without a CB is that it is unacceptable to your elites; which makes sense if you go to war against co-religionists for no reason, but less so if you're fighting against (perceived) infidels.
To be fair, I also remember when CBs were hard to come by, and you often had to eat the stability cost to go to war. It's not the end of the world, you know.
To be fair, I also remember when CBs were hard to come by, and you often had to eat the stability cost to go to war. It's not the end of the world, you know.
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there is a reason for democracy having "at least X% of allowed voters has to vote for the vote itself being valid".
i see even bigger problems than the actual vote:
- X% is set to 1, so if 99% stay away from the voting process the 1% will get what they want. and since there are multiple voting options it's not even 1% that actually gets what they want.
- "allowed voters" is set to people that happen to be involved with a service that is not even remotely tied to the thing they are voting about.
- i get the "devs mostly keep their reasons in silence and don't want to promise too early and too much" but please be a little more transparent than "more smooth"
- can you imagine the outrage when obama suddenly declares himself president for a 3rd period or german government declaring other parties void because of "remember when..."?
solutions:
- prepare a THOROUGH dev diary explaining your thoughts and reasonings, have a discussion about pros and cons afterwards
- increase launcher size via patch and have a big fat "vote for stuff!!" greet the player. the initial thread should be visible for everyone who clicks. answering and voting should require registration in this very forum.
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