Executing rebel vassals

[unmerged(32372)]

When one of your Counts or Dukes revolts against you, and you smash him, you should have the option of executing him. Of course, it can lead to more revolts and a severe loss of reputation; but it's possible too that your vassals fear you and don't dare to defy your cruelty.

My brother has revolted. I've crushed him and I've took his county off, but I'm very furious and raging. I want to kill that traitor, but using an assassin will not be the most appropriate way. I want to watch him hanging in the public square, in front of the people.

 

[Justinian_A]

I do wish this was an option, too. Since it's not, I've made up my own way of doing it. If the ruler is defeated in battle AND loses his entire army in that battle, I rule that he's been captured. I then F-12 die him to simulate execution IF I also take all of his holdings. If he doesn't lose his whole army, I presume he escaped to another court. If, though, he for some reason comes BACK to my court...yep, I F-12 die him. Execution.

 

[Grosshaus]

There isn´t a way to make an event that would target on something that a character used to have and making changes in the actual code is a no-no. So not possible.

 

[unmerged(47151)]

I'd like to extend this idea a bit, in any war if you snuff out the existance of another state, you should have a percentage chance of capturing the inhabitant s of the court and then you'd have to decide their fate individually.

Certain traits would give you additional options, cruel characters are allowed to torture those they capture gaining prestiege (beacause you are feared) but losing you piety. Lustful rulers are allowed to rape their captured enemies daughters and wives (or sons and husbands for the female rulers ), conceiving bastard children (The Ghengis Khan effect). Forgiving and merciful characters should let their enemies go. Vengeful characters should be able to massacre the entire court.

 

[qvcatullus]

I'd like to extend this idea a bit, in any war if you snuff out the existance of another state, you should have a percentage chance of capturing the inhabitant s of the court and then you'd have to decide their fate individually.

Certain traits would give you additional options, cruel characters are allowed to torture those they capture gaining prestiege (beacause you are feared) but losing you piety. Lustful rulers are allowed to rape their captured enemies daughters and wives (or sons and husbands for the female rulers ), conceiving bastard children (The Ghengis Khan effect). Forgiving and merciful characters should let their enemies go. Vengeful characters should be able to massacre the entire court.

I'm pretty sure it's been made clear that rape and torture won't be making an overt appearance in a Pdox game. RP torture and execution as you wish, but you won't be getting a popup message that says 'Your spymaster suggests that now would be a good time to rape the daughters of your captured enemy' any time in the foreseeable future.

 

[unmerged(2456)]

There isn´t a way to make an event that would target on something that a character used to have and making changes in the actual code is a no-no. So not possible.

This could be done without editing code by doing the following:

condtion:
ruler is not commanding troops and is atleast 16 (its unlilely they'd kill the child when they know they're not the real power yet. Maybe a bit younger is possible).
the beiseger is higher rank than beiseigee (maybe)
both are in the same location (maybe)
captial is under seige (not sure the CSC will work with this)
checks to make sure there aren't any enemies of a different religion

effect:
death for ruler
% win seige (maybe 100%?, should be high, like 85-95 ntl)

 

[ZhugeKongming]

I can understand leaving out rape and torture, but surely excluding execution from a game about the Middle Ages is bizarrely ahistorical and leaves out another potentially interesting facet of gameplay?

And really, it's inconsistent. There are events to burn heretics and whatnot. Why can't I decide to execute people who have transgressed against me?

 

[Justinian_A]

Yep, I agree. I would love to see it...if it's not doable for CK1, then certainly in CK2.

 

[qvcatullus]

I can understand leaving out rape and torture, but surely excluding execution from a game about the Middle Ages is bizarrely ahistorical and leaves out another potentially interesting facet of gameplay?

And really, it's inconsistent. There are events to burn heretics and whatnot. Why can't I decide to execute people who have transgressed against me?

Really, I specifically said that rape and torture appear to be out, if you read my post carefully. I also mentioned execution, but mostly because it was mentioned above that that isn't possible to do with code as it is. I personally have no ethical problem with execution in-game, and as I said, I roleplay it. If I defeat a vassal and am ticked at him (and my ruler doesn't have 'nice' traits) I use the 'die' cheat on the offender. I usually try to pick a personality for each ruler based loosely on the traits he has, and then pick event choices based on that personality, usually reinforcing my traits.

 

[unmerged(47151)]

I'm pretty sure it's been made clear that rape and torture won't be making an overt appearance in a Pdox game. RP torture and execution as you wish, but you won't be getting a popup message that says 'Your spymaster suggests that now would be a good time to rape the daughters of your captured enemy' any time in the foreseeable future.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: I was just thinking of characterful things for really evil rulers to do to their enemies.

I can't see why simple execution isn't allowed, assassination is allowed afterall, and what difference is there.

 

[unmerged(29883)]

I think its one of those things which, with the benefit of hindsight, would have made a good intentional addition to CK and falls into the general morass of suppressing rebellions / what-to-do-about-differing-culture-in-captured-territories, etc.

If you get it right, executions would be a public display of strength on the part of the ruler and discourage rebellions by giving an example of what happens to those who do. If you get it wrong, the execution would be a public display of your ruler's fear of rebellion for he daren't leave rebels alive, and risks making a martyr for members of the particular cultural / religious / family to use in order to encourage further rebellions.

Likewise, offering mercy would be a public display of the good qualities of your ruler, of the potential for forgiveness, good christian conduct and generally encourage those wronged to seek amnesty rather than fight further. Of course, if you get it wrong, it would be a public display of weakness and cowardice on behalf of the ruler, and encourage those with uncertain sympathies to side with the rebels' cause.

Getting it right and wrong would, naturally, be a bit hit and miss - and depend on traits. Cruel rulers would suffer for not executing (but equally would suffer from the effects of over-exection) and Merciful rulers would likely experience the opposite.

However, short of putting a gun to Johan's head and forcing him to cut and paste the EU2 revoltrisk setup into CK, then code for executions, I don't see it happening until CK2.

 

[Carmina]

I think that executing a rebel vassal should trigger an event for other vassals : increase loyaulty ( when the ruler is feared or respected ) , or decrease it (if the ruler is already disliked or if the vassal has "good" traits )

 

[qvcatullus]

However, short of putting a gun to Johan's head and forcing him to cut and paste the EU2 revoltrisk setup into CK, then code for executions, I don't see it happening until CK2.

I don't think threatening Johan with physical violence is allowed by the code.

 

[unmerged(32372)]

This could be done without editing code by doing the following:

condition:
ruler is not commanding troops and is atleast 16 (its unlilely they'd kill the child when they know they're not the real power yet. Maybe a bit younger is possible).
the beiseger is higher rank than beiseigee (maybe)
both are in the same location (maybe)
capital is under seige (not sure the CSC will work with this)
checks to make sure there aren't any enemies of a different religion

effect:
death for ruler
% win seige (maybe 100%?, should be high, like 85-95 ntl)

It could be right. Can anyone write a script with these parameters?

 

[unmerged(47151)]

Torture is already in the game. I think rape is aswell beacause you're lustful marshall can be accused of it.

You can torture religious enemies, so why not rebel vassals?

Cruel rulers should gain prestiege from torturing their opponants to death.
Merciful rulers should gain prestiege from letting their opponants go with full honours.

 

[unmerged(29883)]

I must admit, I wasn't quite sure exactly what the purpose of Jinnai's piece of code was. Is it to represent a ruler capitulating when his final province is under siege and being automatically executed? Or is the assumption that if he's not leading his forces then he must have been captured in battle and so, given that, he can be executed on the spot to help bring the rebellion/war to an end...except that his heir will inherit and merrily fight on.

I could script it, if I knew what it was trying to do and I like the idea...equally, I'm sure Jinnai must be familiar enough with event scripting to do it.

 

[unmerged(2456)]

Its that he is executed, probably because he was caught because it wouldn't make sense otherwise.

Yes his son would fight on, but he'd not control the province and the main purpose was to have the (likely) rebeling lord pay the price. His son then likely is at a disadvantage.

I guess you could also script in a peace value though, but that could lead to even weirder results since you can't target the same chacter.

 

[unmerged(29883)]

That's what I was thinking. To be honest, I think the execution event won't work unless / until force-vassalisation is added, which is another gun to Johan's head job (ie, not bloody likely).

If we had force-vassalisation, then you could (easily?) trigger an event from a peace settlement with a revassalised traitor which gave you the opportunity to have him executed or pardoned for his crimes. Which is the realistic situation for an execution...most others, short of capturing the enemy on the battlefield and lopping off his head on the spot (pretty rare) would be nonsensical.