What are the exact percentage or absolute effects of roads? I'm trying to figure out the optimum amount of roads to build for the perfect IC/infra build up 
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There is hardly any optimum, especially since starting conditions matter a lot. Such as the IC of the area you're building infra in, the resources...
Generally, it is best to build IC and infra in areas with IC already there. If you build 1 IC in an area with 1 IC already built, you get 1.01 more IC. It is also worth it to build infra in high IC areas (probably cheaper too).
Generally, it is best to build IC and infra in areas with IC already there. If you build 1 IC in an area with 1 IC already built, you get 1.01 more IC. It is also worth it to build infra in high IC areas (probably cheaper too).
Reaching 200% infrastructure instead of 100% will increase resource extraction and IC by 50% (IIRC).
But there are alot off other things to consider aswell. Building infrastructure in hard terrain like mountains takes much longer time (due to tunnels & bridges).
What I usually do is start a few (1-10) priority 3 serials of Infra in my capital and the few most important provinces in my nations (those that have much resources/IC and good terrain).
As Germany this (and a few prio 1 serials) gives me +300 extra energy or more by 1940, which in turn translates to about +60 extra oil at the push off a button. (Better to save the energy until your conversion techs are good).
But there are alot off other things to consider aswell. Building infrastructure in hard terrain like mountains takes much longer time (due to tunnels & bridges).
What I usually do is start a few (1-10) priority 3 serials of Infra in my capital and the few most important provinces in my nations (those that have much resources/IC and good terrain).
As Germany this (and a few prio 1 serials) gives me +300 extra energy or more by 1940, which in turn translates to about +60 extra oil at the push off a button. (Better to save the energy until your conversion techs are good).
it would be nice if someone would actually post the formula.
IE how much the Infrastructre affects IC and how much the IC concentration bonus is.
IE how much the Infrastructre affects IC and how much the IC concentration bonus is.
Thanks for your post Alex
the complexity of the IC/resources/infra relationship means more choices which means more flexability which means I like this game more and more all the time
the complexity of the IC/resources/infra relationship means more choices which means more flexability which means I like this game more and more all the time
Well, I don't know for sure, but on the other thread someone said that you gain a +50% bonus for going from 100 to 200 (0-100 = 100%). So you'll end up with 150%. (26 factories in Berlin + 50% = 39 IC without the factory stacking boost) !!!
If that is the case, it is very worth it. In fact it might actually be worth boosting the infrastructure build times (Berlin). If you focus on some of the providences that also have high resources, then it should be a huge boost. There are even some hidden gems in Germany such as Hanover, Essen and Dortmund.
If that is the case, it is very worth it. In fact it might actually be worth boosting the infrastructure build times (Berlin). If you focus on some of the providences that also have high resources, then it should be a huge boost. There are even some hidden gems in Germany such as Hanover, Essen and Dortmund.
Another effect of Infra that Ive observed is that it helps to raise supply efficiency, not only in the province itself, but also all provinces that need to trace supplies through it.
So corridors like the transsiberian railways actually help shitloads when it comes to improving the ESE (effective supply efficiency) at the front. The difference observed in my Game as Japan was huge.
50% ESE with the railway (60%infra) protected by garrisions all the way from Vladivostock.
5-15% ESE at the front without it (tracing supplies through multiple chinese mountain provinces with 20% infra).
The effect would have been even larger if you spent IC to improve it.
Yes thats what I usually do, the synergy effect from Infra building makes IC a better investment there then elsewhere.
So corridors like the transsiberian railways actually help shitloads when it comes to improving the ESE (effective supply efficiency) at the front. The difference observed in my Game as Japan was huge.
50% ESE with the railway (60%infra) protected by garrisions all the way from Vladivostock.
5-15% ESE at the front without it (tracing supplies through multiple chinese mountain provinces with 20% infra).
The effect would have been even larger if you spent IC to improve it.
Yes thats what I usually do, the synergy effect from Infra building makes IC a better investment there then elsewhere.
Its NOT like alexBrunius said earlier, the effect is 2,5 % for every 10 infra above 100. So the effect in 200 infra is 10*2,5 = 25% increase in effectiveness, dont forget that it is negative if infra is below 100. And then you add the concentration effect 1% for every IC in province.
A 50IC 200infra province gives 50*1,5*1,25= 93,75 IC. And then you add the other factors (GER - parochial view, conform, ministers, centralised slider, tech... are additive).
93,75+93,75*(0,15+0,05+0,15+0,25+0,15)= 164 IC
I think i got it right
A 50IC 200infra province gives 50*1,5*1,25= 93,75 IC. And then you add the other factors (GER - parochial view, conform, ministers, centralised slider, tech... are additive).
93,75+93,75*(0,15+0,05+0,15+0,25+0,15)= 164 IC
I think i got it right
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Resources at least get 50% or 55% bonus from 200% Infra (tooltip info displays 155% efficiency in capital). The real value seems to be even higher (if the values in parenthesis are base values). Then Im getting 83% bonus which is not far from how much extra 1% extra per IC should give me.
It's also modified by ESE so will be lower the longer away you get from your capital.
The displayed effect (155% efficiency) is the same for IC as resources, but the values don't seem to match up, you get more resource bonus then IC bonus. So the 125% + 1% per IC seems fairly correct with my observations aswell.
Then its a bug with the tooltip for IC efficiency.
With Conans Input Im guessing the following formulas are correct:
Industry:
Base IC * (100% + 1% per IC +- 2.5% for each 10 infra from 100 )
Resources:
Base Value * (100% + 1% per IC +- 5.5% for each 10 infra from 100 ) * ESE
Does this match up with what your seeing?
Edit: For correct math in formulas.
It's also modified by ESE so will be lower the longer away you get from your capital.
The displayed effect (155% efficiency) is the same for IC as resources, but the values don't seem to match up, you get more resource bonus then IC bonus. So the 125% + 1% per IC seems fairly correct with my observations aswell.
Then its a bug with the tooltip for IC efficiency.
With Conans Input Im guessing the following formulas are correct:
Industry:
Base IC * (100% + 1% per IC +- 2.5% for each 10 infra from 100 )
Resources:
Base Value * (100% + 1% per IC +- 5.5% for each 10 infra from 100 ) * ESE
Does this match up with what your seeing?
Edit: For correct math in formulas.
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Going to have a look at ESE now, tested the IC and resources in my example ingame and it is correct. Forgot to check if ESE had any impact on resources. (used a one prov minor for testing so ESE was probably 100). The ICconcentration and Infra bonus are used exactly the same for IC and resources on province basis. (When testing remember to let all numbers rise to maxlevel when you have built new Infra/IC. Missed this at first and got really f*cked up results).
Are you sure that ESE effects IC or resources? Infra do affect both ESE, IC and resources. To me it seems like ESE is derived from Infra and doesn't affect resources. Not the other way around. But im totally open to other theories.
This is what i found so far on province level atleast.
This is what i found so far on province level atleast.
Im certain that ESE doesn't affect IC at least.
However Im pretty sure I've seen resource extraction go up once I reduce revolt risk off occupied lands. So if not ESE (which is also effected by revoltrisk) is the culprit then revoltrisk itself must be.
From what I can tell ESE is derived from distance to capital ( by the infra in provinces on the way ) as well as revolt risk and possibly other factors aswell.
However Im pretty sure I've seen resource extraction go up once I reduce revolt risk off occupied lands. So if not ESE (which is also effected by revoltrisk) is the culprit then revoltrisk itself must be.
From what I can tell ESE is derived from distance to capital ( by the infra in provinces on the way ) as well as revolt risk and possibly other factors aswell.
That´s just what the devs said: dissent no longer affects IC directly but it increases the revolt risk and this in return reduces the IC production. The effect is much more felt in democracies than in dictatorships.
Isn't building IC and infra in a few provinces a bit like putting all your eggs in one basket, especially for germany and japan when the allies start their strategic bombing raids. perhaps spreading things around may be safer.
The good side off that is that it also makes it easier to protect with focused AA/Radar/Air patrolls.
Excuse me, does it mean that improving infra in provinces below 100% gives you no bonus whatsoever?
This is the point I was going to bring up. This change really increases the strategic value of certain provinces (If you concentrate your builds) therefore the strategic choices you have truly enhance the game play. Balesir and I had this discussion about infra and it’s impact long ago and Kudos to him and the design team for implementing this.
I will be purchasing this game today and after the HoI3 let down this has me ramped up about the game once again. After reading the DD’s and many of the threads, this game is so different from DD in subtle ways that have huge impacts in your strategic thinking. You can’t play with the same old tactics or you’ll get your arse handed to you. Great Job AoD Team.