Even infantry techs are not a no brainer

[Denkt]

Given how limited our research capacity is in HOI4 (it seems very hard if not impossible to get all techs but more importantly getting the techs at a time they matter) you will have to cut corners.

While infantry techs may look promising given the number of infantry battalions you operate this also mean if you want to change out all equipments I to equipments II you need to invest alot of resources to do so. Equipment II is about 40% more expensive then equipment I and don't improve the org of your infantry, actually the cheap equipment I may actually be better because it allow you to field more infantry battalions and more battalions mean more org.

The research you would have invested on infantry technologies can be invested into for example an air doctrine or navy doctrine and these can have much more serious impact on the game.

For major nations who can afford the expensive stuff, the role of the infantry is mainly to hold the line which don't require more the equipment I while tanks, aircrafts and artillery are used to make holes in the enemy line and then encircle the enemy so these need to be good stuff while infantry can be pretty low tech.

 

[Number 7]

very good point, i wasn't aware inf equipment 2 was so much more expensive. good spot

 

[Vidkjaer]

it allow you to field more infantry battalions and more battalions mean more org.

The research you would have invested on infantry technologies can be invested into for example an air doctrine or navy doctrine and these can have much more serious impact on the game.

I believe organisation is an average andg not a sum in a division. So more battalions will not increase organisation. More battalions will increase defensive and attack values

 

[Denkt]

My numbers are from the wiki which can change. Wiki list equipment 1 at 0.5 production cost and equipment II at 0.7 production cost. Late tech equipment do get more expensive this apply to all fields as far as I know. You also lose efficiency each time you switch what equipment to produce.

I believe organisation is an average andg not a sum in a division. So more battalions will not increase organisation. More battalions will increase defensive and attack values

Yes it is an average value but you have to multiply the average value with the number of battalions to get the correct org value.

 

[Zaku]

This is also great for realism imo.
There is a reason for even major nations to use WW1 weapons throughout WW2.

 

[Denkt]

The difference in soft attack between equipment I and II is very noticeable but if you use infantry mostly to hold the line and let your tanks and artillery do the push then you don't need infantry with strong attack.

So good infantry equipment is maybe very good for a minor nation but not worth it for a major. Different situations require different needs.

 

[mursolini]

How much of an upgrade to Soft Attack and Defence is Infantry Equipment 2?

How large is the soft attack of Infantry in an armour division?

How much does increase in Soft attack of tanks and artillery costs, relative to infantry?

It might be no- nobrainer to move to next tier of infantry arms, but OP argument is quite incomplete

 

[Volodio]

They already told it in the dev diaries.

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...-development-diary-5-production-lines.774778/

 

[Kab00mBaby]

the mainline infantry can do with less advanced equipment. the good stuff should go to your "special" troops aka Paras, Marines, Mountaineers

 

[Ariakus Fordring]

These reminds me Sturmgewehr 44.Production and distribution took enough time to make it not effective on outcome of war.

 

[Denkt]

I don't have the numbers for each equipment but the numbers are not as important as knowing what purpose each unit have. If you create infantry division only to hold the line you don't need good equipment you just need a cheap one that can be mass produced in huge numbers as org is as far as I know not dependent at all on which equipment your divisions use.

You also have very limited research to work with which you can see in all streams, like why do the player not even manage to reseach basic ships, air doctrine, naval doctrines and support equipment and alot else, that is how limited research is. Not reseaching infantry stuff will help you research other fields.

 

[Geronimo1]

It's definitely something to consider when playing, there's a lot of historical basis for it too. I know for a fact that the Italian and Japanese militaries desperately tried to modernise their equipment before the war but didn't get very far when it came to trying to equip their rapidly expanding military base. As a result they were left with an assortment of weapons that they had to maintain, supply and produce for very little gain, new weapons that were developed to replace older style weapons only managed to supplant them, and in some cases were abandoned entirely. There's even some documented cases of British Home Guardsmen equipped with single shot Martini-Henry rifles from the 1870's.

 

[Denkt]

The best strategy in HOI4 to defeat your enemies are to encircle them and this require the abilities of several different units. Infantry role is to hold the line. Artillery punch hole in the enemy line and armor or mechanized infantry exploit these holes to encircle the enemy. This don't really require good infantry equipment because the firepower of infantry is not that relevant then the artillery heavy divisions who may have 500 soft attack is what is used to break enemy lines.

 

[jockedahl]

Yea I suppose the more elite units, the ones that have experience and a good commander are the ones that can use the more expensive stuff most efficiently.

 

[Denkt]

The commando battalions have roles which can not be effectively done with other battalions so if you are heavly dependent on these the value of better infantry equipment rise but a few commando units should not be used as a excuse for lacking for example an air doctrine if you have a need for an airforce.

 

[WSnova]

Will have to see the final numbers but you are right.

Youwill have to pick a choose based on what you will be doing and your capabilities. To me it seems worth it to upgrade the infantry equipment to 1938 levels and the focus on the real killers, like artillery.

Sure, I will have more infantry but that means it will be more expensive to outfit them all for the rather mundane job of holding the line.

 

[Gort11]

Equipment II is about 40% more expensive then equipment I and don't improve the org of your infantry, actually the cheap equipment I may actually be better because it allow you to field more infantry battalions and more battalions mean more org.

If spending research on infantry equipment results in you having a worse army than not bothering spending the research, then that's a pretty serious balance failure.

I think it's far more likely that good quality infantry equipment will be one of the first things everybody prioritises, as shown in every WWW video so far.

 

[z4uberelefant]

you are probably right on small fronts where you can break through with a few tank on certain points... but on large fornts such as the eastern front (as germany) your infantry may needs some offensive skills too...

 

[wright1331]

If spending research on infantry equipment results in you having a worse army than not bothering spending the research, then that's a pretty serious balance failure.

I think it's far more likely that good quality infantry equipment will be one of the first things everybody prioritises, as shown in every WWW video so far.

This is exactly what i was thinking. In every WWW video Daniel researches infantry equipment as soon as he can, so that would lead me to believe that it is going to certainly be worthwhile to do in terms of cost and benefit.

 

[Gort11]

Daniel does pretty much just spam infantry though. Whether that's a calculated strategy or just force of habit, we'll have to wait and see.

Personally, I'm fearful that infantry divisions are too efficient - tank divisions should be the superstars of WW2 land warfare, and we really haven't seen them shine in any of the WWWs.