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Mem de Sá

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To all nations,

The treaty of Firenze was signed by five nations that were expanding in America - Spain, Portugal, England, France and Venice.

They have agreed to recognized frontiers between theirs colonial possessions in the New Continent.

That was done to avoid war. Spain didnt made concessions or gifted France with nothing. It was already ours lands those territories we claimed. Or it was in the interest of both nations the agreed exchange of territory, as was the case of France and England.

With this all nations hoped to avoid war. And it worked.

If, now, Spain and Portugal resolved to reduce their previous holdings we have nothing to do with it, only acept the will of those kings.

Portugal already had told that it had no particular interest in the lands it gave to the Swedish or to the Dutch. Spain talks about trading some few no important and small provincies.

We, on the other hand, have allways, even before the Treaty of Firenze, considerated that lands as ours. We have lessened part of ours claims already to sign the Treaty of Firenze.

We offered to pay a more than just price, to compensate the dutch for the money they spent on those colonies, that are, after all in ours lands and that they colonized during the war or in the time preceding it, when ours attentions were devoted to building a army to defend our nation against Habsburg agression.

We offered our help and friendship to the Dutch, as we once offered to Sweden by giving to then when they needed 200 ducats that were also needed in ours lands.

But if the dutch governement prefer to answer that by demanding more than the fair price, so it will be. We do not accept usury in our Kingdom.

We do not claim lands in all lands of the continents, as others do. But we will defend those lands that are ours - and it means Canada, Lousiania, French Antilles and Ganges protetorate. It is the blood of ours explorers ans settlers that give us the will to do it.

Henry III
King of Frances and Napoles
 

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Originally posted by Camisa 10
To all nations,

The treaty of Firenze was signed by five nations that were expanding in America - Spain, Portugal, England, France and Venice.

They have agreed to recognized frontiers between theirs colonial possessions in the New Continent.

That was done to avoid war. Spain didnt made concessions or gifted France with nothing. It was already ours lands those territories we claimed. Or it was in the interest of both nations the agreed exchange of territory, as was the case of France and England.

With this all nations hoped to avoid war. And it worked.

And since it worked, and since we have more countries interested in America than before (and one of them is a new country, and unable to participate in the Treaty of Firenze), Portugal thinks that would be advantageous to all countries a new treaty on this matter.

And the lands claimed by France are not small and their interests are in every continent known: Canada, Louisiana, FrenchAntilles, Table, Angola and Ganges are bigger than the portuguese empire for example and cover lands in America, Africa and Asia. This is not a small amount of land to claim. We do not believe that cede some rights to a new nation is dangerous or constitute a major disadvantage to the crown of France.

Signed by the Portuguese Ambassador in Paris.
 

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We agree with Portugal on that matter.
France is claiming territory which has not been recognized by the whole world as French lands.
To avoid future wars, potentially started by those who didnt get a piece of the cake because they weren't participating in the treaty we believe that the Treaty of firenze should be revised. We are not asking France to give up their territory voluntarily but we believe it is in the best interest of all European countries to have a signed treaty with all participants including Sweden, Netherlands and Austria and possibly even the infidels from OE.
The lands that the Dutch have colonized have never been colonized by anyone else and since Holland didnt sign the treaties they are not obliged with them. We are not wanting to change every point of the treaty but to settle colonial issues.
 

Mem de Sá

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To our allie, Portugal

Ainda existem muitas terras que nenhum reino descobriu ou clama para si. Portanto, os holandeses não precisam tomar as terras pertencentes à Coroa da França.

Se os holandeses sofreram durante anos sob o domínio espanhol, então, que o Rei da Espanha, que tem o maior império do mundo, os compense por não poderem explorar os mares e descobrir novas terras antes.

O Reino da França não irá abandonar suas intenções no Canadá ou em qualquer outra terra a que conquistou o direito sem a ajuda de ninguém.

Nós esperamos que nosso grande aliado aceite nossa decisão

Em nome de sua majestade Henrique III,
Ettiene d´Besançon
Emissário Francês na Corte de Portugal.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There are still many lands not discovered or claimed by any Kingdom, so that the dutch dont need to take lands of the Crown of France.

If the dutch suffered under spanish domain for so many years, then, the King of Spain, who has the biggest empire of the world, can cede part of it to the Republic as compensation for the dutch not being able to explore the world earlier.

The Kingdom of France won't release his claims in Canada or in any other land we conquered without the help of anyone.

We hope our great allie accepts our decision.

In the name of Henry III,
Ettiene d´Besançon
French Emissary at the Portuguese court.
 
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Lol, I was reading the portuguese part 3!!! times until I realized that you posted in english as well :D

But I gotta say it is amazing how much potuguese one can understand with a little knowledge of Spanish :p

edit: oops, AAR...


El rey de España comprende la causa por los motivos de Francia pero no se parece que es la culpa española que los holandesas no tienen un imperio colonial. Despues tenía recibido el regalo de Austria, el rey ha liberado el pais de Hollanda rapido. Estamos ayudando nuestros amigos y esperamos que otras reyes van a hacer el mismo.


The Spanish King understands the reasons for the French motives but doesn't think he's to blame for the fact that the Netherlands do not own a colonial empire. After having recieved the gift from Austria, the king set free the country of Holland very fast. We are helping our Dutch friends and hope that other kings will do the same

ooc: lol, I had to change my English text so it matches the Spanish :D
 
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Mem de Sá

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I cant resist... this is totally Out of Character and I will take out in a few days:

El rey de España comprende la causa por los motivos de Francia pero no se parece que es la culpa española que los holandesas no tienen un imperio colonial.

Creo que la culpa de las holandesas no tenerem un imperio colonial no es del Rey de Espana, a non ser que ello no ha echo otra cosa en las sus ferias que llevar las holandesas para lo cuarto!

Eso explicaria por que el Rey de Espana deja sus tierras sob sus regents por tanto tiempo...

Oh I know its silly... but couldnt resist!
I will soon erase this post, hehe

EDIT: the image of a empire of beautifull dutch girls come to my mind :D Yeah, in that case I would have liked to live in Dutch Colony of Brazil :D
 
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The sublime porte, who has learned the hard way what treaties are worth for infidels, will not sign any contract regarding the matter of the new world in which we, as already stated, have no interrest.

We further hope it might be the will of Allah, that those infidels will show the greed bred in the unholy souls openly and fight this issue out in a most brutal way that will leave this god-left continent in tears crying out for help from Allah, the one and only.

edit: el sultan tienes una bicicleta azul :D
 
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El rey de España comprende la causa por los motivos de Francia pero no se parece que es la culpa española que los holandesas no tienen un imperio colonial. Despues tenía recibido el regalo de Austria, el rey ha liberado el pais de Hollanda rapido. Estamos ayudando nuestros amigos y esperamos que otras reyes van a hacer el mismo.
Yes, but help him respeting the pacts that your nation has an another countries.And if Spain not has the guilty, France and England the same. That's in the century XVII Holland is the major comercial country in the world, and really not ve many colonies.
 

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Originally posted by Camisa 10
Eso explicaria por que el Rey de Espana deja sus tierras sob sus regents por tanto tiempo...

Oh I know its silly... but couldnt resist!
I will soon erase this post, hehe

:D Please do not erase the post too quick :)
 

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Letter from the Democratic Republic of Netherlands

-Netherlands cedes San Bernadino and Inyo and Cuyani to Spain
-Spain cedes Parana to Netherlands, pay 100 ducats and grants Netherlands access to Artigos and Neembucu.
Spain proposes the following agreement to the Netherlands:
-Netherlands cedes San Bernadino and Inyo and Cuyani to Spain
-Spain cedes Parana to Netherlands, pay 100 ducats and grants Netherlands access to Artigos and Neembucu.[

The Colonial Advisor of the Dutch Democracy has an innegotable counter-proposal:

-Netherlands cedes San Bernandino, Cuyani and Inyo to Spain (value according to our valuation system: 250 ducats)
-Spain cedes Parana to Netherlands. Spain hands over the colonization right of Artigos and Neembucu to Netherlands. Spain pays 150 ducats.
 

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But if the dutch governement prefer to answer that by demanding more than the fair price, so it will be. We do not accept usury in our Kingdom.

The French attitude make us speechless - we have recently accepted their deal of bying Connecticut, Bangor and Stadcone for 400 ducats on only one condition: they will have to find a buyer for Wisconsin and Bahamas, which is willing to pay at least 200 ducats for them. It is also possible for France to buy these provinces themselves.

To help the French a bit we will purpose that England takes a look on the provinces - Bahamas has an important strategic position since it makes it possible to control the northern entry of the Carribean sea. This colony is also built up to level two, which alone makes 120 ducats. Wisconsin can be a fair start of colonizing the innerland of America.
 

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The Dutch Colonial Advisor suggests the following deal for the Honorable King of England:

-the colonization rights in Martinique to the Netherlands
-36 ducats to England

-the Netherlands recognizes the English claims in NA
-England recognizes the Dutch claims on Brazil, Flandern, Geldre, Brabant and Martinique

This deal can only go through if the English colonization right on Martinique is accepted by the Treaty of Firenze, or by at least 6 of the 8 human players (except for me)
 

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Enlglish goverment is pleased and the propost, and we ll take to you the isle, our rigths recognizes in this land in the point 5 of Firenze pass to Ducht govement.

We accept all conditions, but desires that you write all of your claims in Brazil (all of my claims can be searched in the ducument of the conference of Firenze, pag. 4)

We desires too, that ducht goverment arrives a pacefull pact wich France, for the peace of europe and the goof future of our nations.

The unknowed advanced minister, in the name of our gloriosus majesty, the Queen Elisabeth I of England
 

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Originally posted by gak
This deal can only go through if the English colonization right on Martinique is accepted by the Treaty of Firenze, or by at least 6 of the 8 human players (except for me)

The portuguese kingdom reminds the dutch government that the last point is not needed. By the Treaty of Firenze -currently valid- this lands are claims of England. And as rightful owners of these lands, England can do whatever they like about them, including the sale or transfer of rights. There is nothing any country binded by the treaty can do about that.

In general, we do not understand the position of the French kingdom. Every colonial power has already made or signed a deal with the Dutch republic. The only exception is France.

Signed by the portuguese ambassador in Amsterdam.
 

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So that the dutch dont think France is an unreasonable kingdom I received orders of my king to propose the following:

France will buy Connecticut, Bangor and Stadcone, Wisconsin and Bahamas for the dutch price of 600 ducats, wich is the price asked for the dutch and it's more than they are worth to us.

As compensation, Netherlands wont send any merchants to the CoT of France for 20 years, to avoid ours merchants being expeled from our own CoT.

Netherlands will recognize French rights to the CoT of Ganges and surrounding area, and will have no more of two merchants there for 20 years.

That´s our proposition,

Ettiene d´Valmy
French Ambassador in Netherlands
 

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The Democratic Republic of the Netherlands will accept your proposal with the following addings:

-the Netherlands recognizes the French claims described in the Treaty of Firenze

-France recognizes the Dutch claimes on Brazil, Flandern, Brabant, Geldre and Martinique.

To show our goodwill we will not only agreeing of only having two merchants in Ganges, but offers to NOT SEND A SINGEL MERCHANT HERE WITHIN 20 YEARS. We will also ask the French king to promise not going to war against us within these 20 years.
 

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The Netherlands are interested in buying your colonies!

The Dutch Colonial Advisor, Albert de Waard, announces that the Democratic Republic of Netherlands is interested in buying colonies.

Antigua (Spain) (63 ducats)
Puerto Rico (Spain, Venetian colonization rights)* (54 ducats)
Barbados (Spain, French colonization rights)* (63 ducats)
Jamaica (Venice) (63 ducats)
Dominica (France has the colonization rights) (54 ducats)
St. Thomas (Spain, French colonization rights)* (90 ducats)
St. Martin (Spain, French colonization rights)* (234 ducats)
Guadeloupe (Spain, French colonization rights)* (99 ducats)
Paramus (Portugal) (63 ducats)
Recite (Portugal) (54 ducats)

*=These offers are for both the TP/colony and the colonization rights. The mentioned countries have to agree how they will split the payment.


The Dutch reserve themselves the right of withdrawing an offer if they run out of money. The prices are neutral – calculated with a system made by the Colonial Advisor of the Netherlands – and therefore not negotiable. We hope some of you will find interest in this!


Yours sincerely,

Albert de Waard,
Colonial Advisor for the Dutch President


NB! My ICQ number is 228086214 – I will be reachable tomorrow from 11 to 13 GMT.
 
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Mem de Sá

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We accept the dutch changes and will sign the treaty with the Republic of Netherlands with the changes they proposed.

We, on the other hand, have no interest in selling ours colonies in Caribeen. So we will have to refuse the dutch propost.
 

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A War is being fought in Europe

Recently ambassadors and emissaries have been very busy discussing the dutch colonial proposals. But we remind to all the kingdoms and republics in Europe that a war is currently fought and that peace negotiations should be continued.

After reading all the peace proposals discussed, the king of Portugal in the interests of peace and thinking in the well being of the peoples of our continent proposes the following terms, that we think are reasonable and reflect the fact the Austria won the eastern theatre of operations and that currently Spain is losing the western theatre of operations:

1. Austria will devolve the province of Dalmatia to Venice
2. Spain will give Tortuga and trading rights in Zacatecas to England.
3. Spain will give Les Cayes and Antigua to France.
4. Spain will recognize the current portuguese ownership of Canaries and will give trading rights in Zacatecas to Portugal.
5. Spain will devolve all colonial loses to their previous owners.
 

unmerged(9338)

Believer in Free Speech
May 15, 2002
864
0
I`m still missing an answear from the Spanish player to my counter-proposal concerning the provinces of San Bernandino, Inyo, Parana and Cuyini.

The Colonial Advisor of the Dutch Democracy has an innegotable counter-proposal:

-Netherlands cedes San Bernandino, Cuyani and Inyo to Spain (value according to our valuation system: 250 ducats)
-Spain cedes Parana to Netherlands. Spain hands over the colonization right of Artigos and Neembucu to Netherlands. Spain pays 150 ducats.