Europa Universalis Press Release

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Originally posted by kdp:
Heh, I doubt they will play either Denmark or Sweden. They will probably want our countries to suffer... At least I plan on playing Denmark and (hopefully) change the result of the wars between Denmark and Sweden. Nothing is better than a little internal struggle for dominance in the Nordic family.

kdp

Actually I want to edit the game files to create an alternate reality
in which the Kalmar Union does not dissolve and the Nordic countries
remain one entity. *That* should teach Northern Europe a thing or
two.

/David

 

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Originally posted by Doomdark:
Maybe it's entertaining in a game, but consider reality; where would we be today if Scandinavia had always stood united? A Scandinavian Union would have been a Great Power.

You're very right about that. A Scandinavian Union would have been a Great Power. We might even have been living in a Nordic (Norway-Sweden-Denmark) Union right now if things had worked out a little different. I believe I've read that after the Second World World there was some negotiating between our countries about some kind of union. The plans were dropped, however, when Norway joined the newly formed NATO.

kdp

 

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Originally posted by Johan:
Is an norwegian living in norway good enough as translator for you? Trust us, we've been releasing localised products in scandinavia since the early eighties.

Anyway, I've personally lived in norway for 4 years so for me it feels as natural to hear norwegian as swedish.

/Johan

Then the translation should be good enough. For me it doesn't really
matter even if it is perfect. I would still much prefer having an english
version.

(Yes, that's my preference for the rest of the software on my computer
too. Sometimes you're stuck with pre-installed software though.)

/David

 

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Originally posted by Daztek:
Jiminov, it is true. germany is the biggest games market in the world, they buy more board games per head than anywhere else, by a longshot. they are a bigger games market than USA

Daz, How do board games correlate to potential sales of EU? Clearly EU has evolved from the BG, so this might represent a potential audience. But remember this (1) there are more people in the US than Germany and (2) there is a higher percentage of computer users in the US than Germany. So, due to the installed base of PCs in the US, I conclude that there are more potential buyers of the game in the US than in Germany. However, if you have reliable market data that contradicts this belief, please feel free to advise.

 

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Originally posted by kdp:
You're very right about that. A Scandinavian Union would have been a Great Power. We might even have been living in a Nordic (Norway-Sweden-Denmark) Union right now if things had worked out a little different. I believe I've read that after the Second World World there was some negotiating between our countries about some kind of union. The plans were dropped, however, when Norway joined the newly formed NATO.

kdp

Well, at least we had the same currency until the 30's.

/Martin

 

[Johan]

Originally posted by Jiminov:
Originally posted by Daztek:
Jiminov, it is true. germany is the biggest games market in the world, they buy more board games per head than anywhere else, by a longshot. they are a bigger games market than USA

Daz, How do board games correlate to potential sales of EU? Clearly EU has evolved from the BG, so this might represent a potential audience. But remember this (1) there are more people in the US than Germany and (2) there is a higher percentage of computer users in the US than Germany. So, due to the installed base of PCs in the US, I conclude that there are more potential buyers of the game in the US than in Germany. However, if you have reliable market data that contradicts this belief, please feel free to advise.

Okies.. this is the reply from the marketing guys..

'The single largest market according to Datamonitor is the North American.However, all of the larger publishers who can reach the peaks in volume think that the theme and complexity of a game like Europa Universalis limits the ability to reach a mass market. Unfortunately, the North American market has had a structural change to the effect that only large publishers are left standing (barely) and that streamlines the offering.

While this movement is happening in Europa as well, the local nature of the markets have slowed it down, still leaving fairly strong regional publishers. The German market has a very high PC platform penetration, in fact 50% of the PC games sold in Europe are sold in Germany. Combined with a high interest in historic titles, this means wargame publishers (such as SSI or Interactive Magic) traditionally regarded this the single most important market.

Having said that, a good title backed by a large US publisher such as Age of Empires will most likely sell a much higher amount in the US. The problem is, there will only be three to five 'elected' titles per year, while in Germany at least you will get instant distribution of a historic, localized, game. Sellthru is a different matter - only good games sell.

All US publishers are receptive to consumer reaction. We have presented the project to all publishers but have no signed deal. Maybe the Americans on the forum should inform their favorite US publishers that this game indeed is not niche but could be considered as mainstream as, say Age of Empires!'

/Johan

[This message has been edited by Johan (edited 25-08-2000).]

 

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A larger number of computer users (pop * proportion of users/non users) does not necessarily mean a larger market. There is one more factor to be considered: the proportion of users interested in serious strategy (/not/ real time tactics)games /users. I would expect this last number to be significantly higher in Germany; however, I would still estimate the ultimate figure to be higher in the States.
Paradox management overestimates American chauvinism if they imagine US gamers to be interested only in games involving their nation. Who among the European members of this forum would forgo the purchase of this game were their country to be divided into unaffiliated provinces?
Jingoism aside, there exists a large cadre of dedicated strategy gamers in the United States. Profitable games were released in the USA long before the unwashed American masses so frequently cited in this forum had the user-friendly interface to play them.
JA2 sold quite well, as did Civ, Civ2, SMAC and both Railroad Tycoons. Neither Imperialism flopped, nor did Anno 1602 AD (though in my opinion it should have).
I understand the costs associated with distribution and product placement in the US, but neither Paradox nor any potential publishers would do anyone, outside of their competitors, any favors if they ignored the number of American (and Canadian,British, Australian,etc...) consumers aching to trade their hard-earned money for an intelligent strategy game.

 

[Johan]

Originally posted by joneseh:
I understand the costs associated with distribution and product placement in the US, but neither Paradox nor any potential publishers would do anyone, outside of their competitors, any favors if they ignored the number of American (and Canadian,British, Australian,etc...) consumers aching to trade their hard-earned money for an intelligent strategy game.

Don't blame Paradox We've presented the game to almost every US publisher there is. And we've heard the 'too-european' / 'too-niche' / 'too complicated for the american market' comments so many times its not even fun.


/Johan

 

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OK, Johan posted his bit while I was composing mine. In light of his revelations, I propose that all norteamericanos among us inform the US distributor of Johan's choice (in email and/or print) why EU will make them richer than God.
If we Americans directed our bitching towards Hasbro or some such beast rather than Paradox, we might accomplish something. As it is, I fear that unless someone disabuses them of the fact, the large American distributors will beleive that we will be content playing Sid Meier's (Fill in the Blank) into perpetuity. And, unless someone disabuses them of the fact, they might just be right. (Irony intended)

 

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Don't blame Paradox We've presented the game to almost every US publisher there is. And we've heard the 'too-european' / 'too-niche' / 'too complicated for the american market' comments so many times its not even fun.

OK, well Paradox has done whatever it can. It's up to the AMERICANS on this forum to let their thoughts he heard. Choose three publishers you guys think might want to publish the game in the states and then hammer them. They won't care for pleading from anyone else around the world, YOU GUYS HAVE TO WORK AT IT. Don't blame Paradox for this, it seems they've done whatever they can.

It just proves my point that American Publishers are a bunch of nitwits who can't see past their own clones. Madden 20202023 anyone? Or perhaps a new rehash of C&C?

Bloody typical. Screw them I say. Ask Paradox to create an order utility from their site for ppl in the US / wherever else, the sort that the guys that made 'Combat Mission' have.


Sapura

 

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Originally posted by Sapura:
Don't blame Paradox We've presented the game to almost every US publisher there is. And we've heard the 'too-european' / 'too-niche' / 'too complicated for the american market' comments so many times its not even fun.

Thank you for the support guys. When we started presenting EU to the US publishers we had a slew to choose from. Although the mergers meant we had fewer to go to and every time there were new people so eventually we realized it´s better to do this territory by territory. We´ve been to everyone, SSI, Talonsoft,Interplay, Mindscape, Red Orb, MicroProse,Interactive Magic, and then up the ladder when they were all sold to the Hasbros, Mattels, Learning Company, etc. Plus all the European multis.

/Fredrik (Business Development at Paradox)

 

[Davout]

I am sorry to hear about the American response. I am particularly disappointed that all the mergers and acquisitions appear to have changed the philosophies of Talonsoft and SSI whom I thought would appreciate the depth of this project. I have been dreaming of a game like EU since I began tinkering with Empire in Arms in the 80's. Good luck and if you can't crack America at least look at an English version for UK (and Australia).

 

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Is there anybody in particular that You would like us to target in our pleas?

 

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Originally posted by yndenwal:
Or perhaps they really believed that Australia was in Europe.

I don'y it happens very often. Some tends to mix up Sweden with Switzerland and a lot Austria and Australia. I used to know an Austrian living in Texas for a year. He end up wearing something where he wrote 'There are no kangoroos in Austria'...

NB. For an exemple of dumb French, she heard thing like 'What do you speak in Australia? Australian?' or 'Australia? That's the big island near China?', and far worse believe me !

 

[Bogey]

I'm sure a publisher will be found for EU here in the US. As a percentage of population EU will not do as well here as in Europe. The reason is that as debated previously the average game buying american spends their money on internet fad games and more action related titles.

EU will still do very well in the US simply by sheer number of people. There are plenty of people here who have been waiting a long time for a game with this much historical depth. I'm sure it will do well.

I personally love this game and I hope that this game will add some excitement to the genra and hopefully more historical stratgy games will get published here in the future.

 

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Originally posted by Johan:
Don't blame Paradox We've presented the game to almost every US publisher there is. And we've heard the 'too-european' / 'too-niche' / 'too complicated for the american market' comments so many times its not even fun.

Dear Johan, et al:
First of all, thank you for providing me (and everyone else) with the background on your efforts to bring this game to the US. I hope I didn't make the impression that I was blaming anyone here.
Secondly, I want you to know that I'm not worried about my ability to procure this game. I know a lot of people in Europe in general and the UK in particular so I when the smoke clears in Oct/Nov I know that I will be happily adding lands to my realm.
Third, based on the above - you may ask; so why does he care about the US publishing arrangement? Let me tell you it is mostly altruism at this point (although it would be nice to see an expansion pack or sequel). EU appears to be an excellent product and it would be a terrible shame if you are not fully compensated for its creation. That's the bottom line here, all the enthusiasts on this site will get the game (one way or another), but if you don't get it into Wal-Mart, CompUSA and Best Buy, you're going to regret it.
Fourth, what do I recommend? Paradox appears bent on selling the game through the conventional model of: we make it, you sell it - or the developer/publisher relationship. If this is only way you want to operate, then at least try Gathering of Developers, as I didn't see them included on your list of publishers. However, I'd suggest that you at least get a demo or current beta build in front of three people. The following five individuals are 'opinion leaders' meaning that they are revewiers/columnists for big time game sites in the US, and if you get them interested in your game I'll bet that the attitude of the publishers shapes up significantly. These sites are large enough that they have several correspondents for just the strategy genre alone, but I chose the ones that covered AoK, as it would provide the best parallel to EU:

• Arinn Dembo or Jason Ocampo of Gamecenter, which is backed by Yahoo and CNet. Here is a link to the recent review of AoK, www.gamecenter.com/Reviews/Item/0,6,0-3263,00.html
• Greg Kasavin of GameSpot, which is a part of Ziff-Davis and is linked to many sites. The AoK link is: www.zdnet.com/gamespot/stories/reviews/0,10867,2537995,00.html
• Trent Ward at IGN, which is backed by Electronics Boutique, the AoK link is pc.ign.com/reviews/11531.html
• Andy Eddy of GameWeek, this seen as the definative source for the game business in the US. The AoK review is: www.gameweek.com/reviewpreview/showreview.asp?platform=pc&article=Age_of_Empires_II
• Alex Dunne, the Editorial Director of Gamasutra, this is another industry source and tends to be more technical. It covers trends but doesn't do reviews per se... but should be able to provide good insights into how to tame the publishing beasts. The site is www.gamasutra.com

Fifth, so in conclusion - while you never solicited this advice, it looks like you need it since you don't have a way to tap the vast US market yet. I wish you the best in your endeavors, and I'll once again volunteer to help you out with the contacts listed above. So if you'd like, feel free to e-mail me, if not - I'll keep quiet from here on out.

[This message has been edited by Jiminov (edited 25-08-2000).]

 

[Doomdark]

Don't blame Paradox We've presented the game to almost every US publisher there is. And we've heard the 'too-european' / 'too-niche' / 'too complicated for the american market' comments so many times its not even fun.

By the Allfather, how can American companies consistently degrade their own people with comments like that?!

Sadly, this confirms all my nasty suspicions about Hasbro and the other giant toy corporations. Sometimes commercialism just does not work, and few things are worse than rampant capitalism spliced with sugary plastic Di$neyland morals. To put it simply, the megacorps strive to dumb us down so that we will enjoy their dumb, formulaic products.

The strategy genre is dying, and there is little we can do about it. The mere fact that people even think of comparing EU with RTS tripe like 'Age of Kings' and 'Seven Kingdoms' speaks volumes about the sad state of the genre. Sid Meier's games and the 4x genre in all honour, but they represent only a small portion of what used to be a relatively rich and thriving genre.

Who can forget classics like 'Storm across Europe', 'Command HQ', 'High Command', 'Third Reich' and 'Romance of the Three Kingdoms'? Where are their heirs? Why do all the niche companies (TSR, Avalon Hill, SSI, SSG, etc) sell out to the big buck? When will Hollywood stop producing syrupy sedatives for the masses like 'Hook', 'Independence Day', 'Star Wars: Episode 1' and every single Di$ney film since 'Snow White'?

Sorry for the rant; I just needed to get it out...

 

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Well it is time to go capitalist. Who here lives in a town that has an E3 type convention? Time to become an Indepentant game company and go get a booth at E3 or some other Software convention and put the game on display.

 

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Hmmm, a lot of anti-Americanism flying around here. Americans are dumb, Americans don't know Austria from Australia, blah, blah. Have fun with your stereotypes, but I am an American and everyone I know is very intelligent and well educated, and they all have a pretty firm grasp of geography, history, and current affairs. *shrug*

Anyway, I would really love to play this game, and I personally think you are dead wrong that it wouldn't sell in the US. Imperialism was huge. Hell, I bought 2 copies so I could make people play with me. I'm not worried, I have no doubts this game will be released in the US.

 

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Enough with the debate over the possibility of US intelligence; obviously many people outside of the States feel that septics lack competence and many Americans feel otherwise. I doubt this issue will be resolved in this forum and as far as EU is concerned, I trust Johan, et al, to sell as many copies of their product in as wide a market as possible. I believe the uncertainty regarding the timeliness of an English release has more to do with the market strategy of the US Game Distribution Cartel than any misconceptions Paradox management might have.
I do wonder how much Cognitoy profited by distributed their games indepently. Games targeted to the experienced gamer may not benefit from the typical corporate banner ads etc... and may thus be better advised bypassing the Cartel.
Given the current situation, however, I'd advise advowedly intelligent US gamers to take this opportunity to learn German.
I know I will.