Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise Developer Diary 7: Colonial Diplomacy

  • Victoria 3 - Sign up now!

    The journey begins, sign up now and get a special in-game item when the game is released.


  • Crusader Kings III Available Now!

    The realm rejoices as Paradox Interactive announces the launch of Crusader Kings III, the latest entry in the publisher’s grand strategy role-playing game franchise. Advisors may now jockey for positions of influence and adversaries should save their schemes for another day, because on this day Crusader Kings III can be purchased on Steam, the Paradox Store, and other major online retailers.


    Real Strategy Requires Cunning
  • Crusader Kings II Expansion Subscription

    Subscribe to the CK II Expansion and enjoy unlimited access to 13 major expansions and more!


Lakedaimon

Colonel
68 Badges
Mar 4, 2012
1.018
42
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Rome Gold
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • March of the Eagles
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pride of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Cities: Skylines
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
FINALLY! Something that portrays the historical colonial warfare was one of the things I wanted most in this game. YAY!
 

Helkoi

Sergeant
80 Badges
May 4, 2011
67
10
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Surviving Mars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • 500k Club
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
Of course, colonial nations cannot ally with any nations other than native states.

Well, can colonial nations allied with another colonial nation of the same overlord :) ?
Let's say for exemple that french Louisiana and Nouvelle-Flandres seeks to conquer british XIII Colonies (Why ? Because they are spawn of the BBB, muahaha :D)

Can they create an alliance in order to proceed or have relationship between each other ? It might be interessting to have pre-independance relationship of the colonies. Just an exemple !^^

Anyway, have a nice december beer ;) ! Prost :D !
 

LiberiusX

General
82 Badges
Feb 5, 2011
2.496
1.211
  • Semper Fi
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Lead and Gold
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • For the Motherland
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Victoria 2
Question: When the colony reaches 5 provinces and becomes pseudo-independent, will the player, playing the mother country, get the option to tag switch, like we do when we release vassals?

If so, contrary to releasing vassals, will players be allowed to tag switch to colonies in Ironman?

For instance. England sets up 5 colonial provinces in the Thirteen Colonies region which becomes the Thirteen colonies. Would the English player get the option to tag switch to the thirteen colonies at that moment?
 

grisamentum

Field Marshal
91 Badges
Feb 29, 2012
6.388
935
  • Stellaris
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • War of the Roses
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Humble Paradox Bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Dungeonland
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Teleglitch: Die More Edition
  • The Showdown Effect
I think what Gars meant was that they provide you with the same income as of 1.3.2 but that that income, compared to what you can squeeze out of a full-fledged colony with the new tariff system will be much greater than what you can take out of 3-4 provinces with the old system.

Presumably they will still provide Trade Power, too, which I can ship back. 4 provinces of 100% trade power that I picked seems better than 5-8 with 50% trade power.

In that case, why would you even bother colonizing? All the Monarch Points are better spent at home, not to mention you won't need to deal with oversea wars.

What monarch points? Colonies cost gold, not MP. And I have Expansion (or Exploration for other reasons) anyway, so it's not like I took a different idea group I wouldn't have otherwise taken.

And what overseas wars? It'll be great; colonial nations will allow me to declare war on people I have RMs with by declaring war on their colonies - which only works if they're my provinces, not my colonies.
 

TheBloke

Field Marshal
12 Badges
Sep 18, 2010
3.870
13
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Semper Fi
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • 500k Club
I think what Gars meant was that they provide you with the same income as of 1.3.2 but that that income, compared to what you can squeeze out of a full-fledged colony with the new tariff system will be much greater than what you can take out of 3-4 provinces with the old system.

I would love it if you were correct. But Captain Gars' answer seemed very specific, to me:

There's not much point in retaining provinces in the New World that don't form a colony as they won't give income.

(emphasis mine.)

This is unambiguous I feel: there would be a point to them if they did give per-1.3.2 income, which is far from nothing.


Presumably they will still provide Trade Power, too, which I can ship back. 4 provinces of 100% trade power that I picked seems better than 5-8 with 50% trade power.

Maybe.. I suppose we could still hope that Gars' statement does not reference Trade Power. But I really think that he wouldn't have said "won't give income" if they in fact still contributed to Trade income via giving Power.

I might be wrong, and hope I am! But so far it's not seeming like it's going to be like that.

I did ask Captain Gars if they would add moddability to all this. He sounded positive regarding adding a defines entry that would allow changing the breakaway amount from 5. I asked also if we could have a toggle that would allow pre-Colonial Nation colonies to still give income like normal ones, but there's not been a response to that so far.

My guess is no for CoP/1.4, but it could come later. Gars has been on a moddability-improvement overdrive the last few days, so I'm very optimistic about future modding improvements, even if it's not immediate :)
 
Last edited:

TheBloke

Field Marshal
12 Badges
Sep 18, 2010
3.870
13
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Semper Fi
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • 500k Club
I believe it was only said that colonial nations cannot declare on other colonial nations that share the same overlord. But I might have missed a detail here or there.

Sorry, I misread; he said 'ally' and yes I was referring to same-overlord, not allied overlord. We've not had a statement regarding that.
 

Darkath

Scholar-Official
93 Badges
Apr 9, 2012
3.435
4.315
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Humble Paradox Bundle
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings III Referal
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Prison Architect
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Teleglitch: Die More Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Victoria 2
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Magicka
  • Magicka 2
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
I would love it if you were correct. But Captain Gars' answer seemed very specific, to me:



(emphasis mine.)

This is unambiguous I feel: there would be a point to them if they did give per-1.3.2 income, which is far from nothing.


Personally i think he meant that if you only had 4 province in a given region, that would leave the rest to another country, which would thus suck all the income from your 4 mere colonies;
 

Orctavius

Major
82 Badges
Jun 25, 2012
787
632
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Crusader Kings III
  • BATTLETECH
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Victoria 2
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Warlock 2: The Exiled
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
Can/will colonies declare war on each other if they have the same overlord? For instance, could Spanish Cuba declare war on Spanish Mexico?
 

TheBloke

Field Marshal
12 Badges
Sep 18, 2010
3.870
13
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Semper Fi
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • 500k Club
Personally i think he meant that if you only had 4 province in a given region, that would leave the rest to another country, which would thus suck all the income from your 4 mere colonies;

This seems to me to be a rather optimistic reading :) Other colonies can't suck tariff and tax income, only trade power. Tariff and tax income is not "no income." And as soon as you have provnices providing some Trade Power, you can significantly buffed it with Light Ships.

I really feel that what you, Comes and grisamentum say could only be read into a statement like "not much point.. you will gain far less income." That's a lot different to "won't give income."

But I would be very glad if I were wrong :)
 

Novacat

Khajiit
5 Badges
Oct 9, 2010
9.193
739
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Semper Fi
  • 500k Club
Do the colonies share the Overlord's NIs, tech, and ideas?

I believe it was confirmed that colonies do not share the Overlord's NIs, and instead get their own set of colonial NIs.
 

grisamentum

Field Marshal
91 Badges
Feb 29, 2012
6.388
935
  • Stellaris
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • War of the Roses
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Humble Paradox Bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Dungeonland
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Teleglitch: Die More Edition
  • The Showdown Effect
This seems to me to be a rather optimistic reading :) Other colonies can't suck tariff and tax income, only trade power. Tariff and tax income is not "no income." And as soon as you have provnices providing some Trade Power, you can significantly buffed it with Light Ships.

I really feel that what you, Comes and grisamentum say could only be read into a statement like "not much point.. you will gain far less income." That's a lot different to "won't give income."

But I would be very glad if I were wrong :)

No, I'm sure they might not give tax or production income. But trade power isn't income. In fact it often doesn't even provide any income; if it's not collected, or if it's steered elsewhere, or if you're out-powered in your own collection node, it can actually be someone else's income.

I'm just saying I don't see a lot of clear advantages to actually going for a larger nation if I then lose control of it and start getting dragged in to colonial wars and possibly real wars against European powers. (actually it does create interesting scenarios; what if I'm England, I PU France, we both colonize. Can France's colonial protectorates get in a war with my colonial protectorates? Can that somehow make me fight my own PU junior? Historically this is the kind of thing Paradox drops the ball on, like when vassalizing a war enemy made you switch sides in the war.)

Even if there were actually no Trade Power flowing at all, I'd still prefer the ability to have a permanent CB against my own RM partners through attacking their colonial juniors.
 

tunapirate

Sergeant
80 Badges
Jan 13, 2013
72
30
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sengoku
  • Rome Gold
  • March of the Eagles
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • War of the Roses
  • 500k Club
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
Is there any way for another foreign power to seize control of an entire colonial nation in a peace deal? Say, for instance, the French have colonized Canada, creating Quebec, and they lose a war to the English/British. Would it be possible for the British to become Quebec's overlord, at the cost of raising nationalist sentiment in Quebec pretty high?
 

TheBloke

Field Marshal
12 Badges
Sep 18, 2010
3.870
13
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Semper Fi
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • 500k Club
No, I'm sure they might not give tax or production income. But trade power isn't income. In fact it often doesn't even provide any income; if it's not collected, or if it's steered elsewhere, or if you're out-powered in your own collection node, it can actually be someone else's income.

Yeah true. We certainly can't preclude the possibility that Gars wasn't referencing Trade Power in his statement.

I'm just saying I don't see a lot of clear advantages to actually going for a larger nation if I then lose control of it and start getting dragged in to colonial wars and possibly real wars against European powers.

I agree completely. I remain a little concerned about this new system. With the current mechanics, I build my colonies and in doing so there's a reasonable amount for me to do, and strategic considerations. I put them where appropriate to create borders, for making war, and for extending colonial range. I put them where appropriate for Trade Power, and then send and adjust my Light Ships and merchants accordingly. I plan what buildings to build to buff their direct (tariff, tax) and indirect (trade) income. I can DOW and then annex 7 or 8 Native nations, and work on integrating them into my nation, for their tariffs, gold, and trade, and perhaps releasing one or two and then feeding new colonies to them.

In other words, there's a reasonable amount of things I can "do".

Based on what we know so far, I'm wondering how much there is to do in the new system. I build colonies, and I gain (it seems) nothing until they breakaway. Then once they do, I gain 50% of some money, and I sometimes get pulled into wars. I can still make the merchant/light ship decisions, based on a lower amount of Trade Power than I'd have now.

And.. that seems to be it, from what we know so far. I can't build buildings in any of those colonial nation provinces (this was confirmed by Gars last week.) I don't get my own borders, and even if I did, there doesn't seem much I can do with them. I'm at the mercy of what the AI decides to do, with no way to manipulate it. They don't sound awfully different from our current vassals, save for the extra income types and their ability to wage independent war.

What I was hoping was that these new Colonial Nation vassals would come with a bunch of new control mechanisms. That I would be able to manipulate their diplomacy. That I would be able to manipulate their decision making. That could make things really interesting, because rather than just directly putting down buildings and Light Ships where I wanted them, with no effort, I would instead (I hoped) have to convince/manipulate the vassal to do it, through a more complex/indirect process.

But there's thus far no indication that any of that will happen. Today's DD was quite brief, and maybe significant new info is still to come. In particular, Beschuov did say "there are other elements we are still working on balancing." Maybe they contain the key.

But I must admit I do have a worry that while the new Colonial Nations are very 'fancy looking', fun to watch, and more historic maybe, they might be somewhat lacking in terms of strategy and gameplay. They might even be a regression on what we have now.

I very much hope that I'm missing some salient point that indicates that the options we will have will result in loads of strategic opportunities, and lots for the player to 'do'.

Anyway, worst case:
a) This only applies to the New World; Africa and Oceania remain exactly the same. We'll have a region-specific choice of mechanics.
b) It's been confirmed that Colonial Nations will only operate with the DLC enabled. So games can be played without this new system, albeit at the cost of losing other mechanics as well.
c) There's always 1.5 and beyond, and past behaviour tells us that Paradox will continuing adding new features and improvements.

And, I should add, even if it is the 'worst case' of it resulting in the player doing less overall with regard to the New World, this is very far from the end of the world. It's just one continent, and there's still plenty to do in the rest of the world. I'm not against having new mechanics and flavour in specific parts of the world, and indeed I like it. I would much prefer it if they also added new player options, new buttons and new mechanics and new strategic planning. But even if they don't, the game will be improved overall.

There's still going to be more to think about, even if there's slightly less to do.
 
Last edited:

Pellaken

TheNewTeddy
On Probation
102 Badges
Mar 24, 2009
3.685
1.750
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Imperator: Rome
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Sengoku
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Prison Architect
I didn´t get one before he ran out of the office, but he might add one later on! ;)
Go a sneak a few while he is out, I'm sure he won't mind :D
 

Nyrael

Field Marshal
81 Badges
Jul 20, 2008
5.823
4.781
31
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Warlock 2: The Exiled
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
Personally i think he meant that if you only had 4 province in a given region, that would leave the rest to another country, which would thus suck all the income from your 4 mere colonies;

I am pretty sure PI will take care that holding colonial provinces yourself ends up being disadvantageous. The whole point of the system is to add the downside of being unable to directly control your colonies. For both gameplay reasons and historical (American colonies had a lot of autonomy no matter what Motherland would have preferred) the Colonial Nations will be a must for colonial players. And if players fidn a way around it, you can put your money on 1.5 patch fixing that.
 

Vedinu

Suuriruhtinas
23 Badges
Sep 12, 2013
771
362
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • A Game of Dwarves
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • March of the Eagles
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Prison Architect
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris
  • Warlock 2: The Exiled
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV
This sounds great. Finally colonial wars that won't be fought in Europe!