However, it wasn't something you could get on the market. The only labor was people working jobs, and even then most of the time that was producing goods to sell.
Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise – Dev diary 5: A new way of playing
- Thread starter Besuchov
- Start date
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
EU4 is about more than that. That's one of its stated goals. Another of its stated goals is to be a fun and challenging strategy game.
There are players who are interested in a compromise between both of these factors, and there are players who are mostly, or exclusively interested in only one or other. I assume you're primarily interested in the historical aspects. I am one of the players who is exclusively interested in it as a game. I couldn't care less if a feature is historical or not, so long as it adds to the strategy, challenge, and fun.
Unfortunately the needs of the two groups are very often at direct odds with each other. Paradox seek to find a compromise, and are sometimes successful, sometimes not. It's therefore as well that whatever camp we personally fall into, we remember that the other camp exists and that therefore some things will not always be modelled in the perfect way for our preference.
This is one example. It may well be totally unrealistic for pre-state societies to have inflation, and no doubt a number of other concepts. But removing them in the interests of historical plausibility may very well negatively impact the game-playing aspects.
I believe that any argument made against the game that starts out "This is totally unrealistic" then needs to go on and ask "..but does it improve the strategy/gameplay/fun." Because if the answer is yes, then that's likely the reason it's there, rather than Paradox just not caring if things are historical or not.
I make these points somewhat generally, in response to your implication that the game is just about roleplaying a state.
But in this specific case, with inflation being a rather minor, even insignificant part of the game, it's quite likely that the arguments are neither historic nor about gameplay.
I expect they simply don't want to spend further development time making exclusions and special cases for a mechanic that doesn't much influence the game anyway. No doubt they feel that the new tribal mechanics, including many tribal-only features, are enough to distinguish the tribes both from a historical and gameplay perspective.
As a strategy game player, not a "state roleplayer", I fully concur with that: I want them to spend time on bigger features, not removing inflation from pre-state societies.
You might be able to mod it out, if you continue to feel strongly about it.
I don't quite understand you. Why that wasn't thing one could get on market?
Sorry, labor. You couldn't buy services on the market in Tenochticland, only goods.
I found that on wikipedia when I was researching things for my Aztec colonization mod in CK2 a few months ago. The last line of the article said that land and labor were not available for sale.
Here is a link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aztec#Economy
TheDarkMaster: thats really weird. According to:
http://www.google.cz/url?sa=t&rct=j...jSJKY64HBTMigSg&bvm=bv.57752919,d.bGQ&cad=rja
(sorry for ugly link)
services were traded. And thats basically "labour for trade". And still I am not counting porters. So, I would really like to see original quote in primary source, however that book isn't available for download:/
http://www.google.cz/url?sa=t&rct=j...jSJKY64HBTMigSg&bvm=bv.57752919,d.bGQ&cad=rja
(sorry for ugly link)
services were traded. And thats basically "labour for trade". And still I am not counting porters. So, I would really like to see original quote in primary source, however that book isn't available for download:/
I did not what?
Someone who earns enough at work just to buy enough food to live to the next day is trading labour but not producing a surplus.
Mesoamerica had states, we're discussing pre-state societies
Cool
Thats why I asked you on definition of "tribal". Because you are now jumping from your original claim on "tribal society" to "pre-state society".
Could you provide a quote of the relevent part of the article, I didn't see what you were talking about in a quick skim.
I can't really tell you anymore, that's just what I found when I was looking for very broad information. Do note that what I found seems to be talking about trading for things on the open market only, using cocoa beans as currency.
Here you are. It just seems really strange in such diversified society to not be able to buy services. Mainly when porters were a must for transporting goods, medical services were quite important part of culture, the same with prayers and offering (so one would buy service from priest: praying for buyer; his crops; his children etc.) or even lawyers. On your note on open market, I think that the quote or the whole paragraph seems to be more general:
I could understand that services would have their special place, but this quote seems to note on general aztecs economy.
As I said, when I said "tribal societies" I was quoting user Sir Garnet. I assumed he meant pre-state societies in general, since his post added to a conversation where this was the subject of discussion (http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...of-playing&p=16511200&viewfull=1#post16511200)
In either case, the Mesoamerican empires were neither tribal nor pre-state.
Gosh. You are linking your posts citing Weinum as proof that you have quoted Sir Garnet? Read Sir Garnet post.
Don't be obtuse. I linked to that post to show that I originally referred to "pre-state societies" rather than "tribal societies". Sir Garnet said "tribal societies" in this post, my reply to which is when you asked me to define what I meant by "tribal societies":
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...of-playing&p=16516573&viewfull=1#post16516573
I'm surprised native americans get cool graphics of their own (like those advisors) but poor arabs/turks don't get any. 
Hopefully one day, though.
Hopefully one day, though.
I imagine they'll get them when it is their turn for a DLC.I'm surprised native americans get cool graphics of their own (like those advisors) but poor arabs/turks don't get any.
Mesomaricans and Andeans are obviously not native. Not to Americas, nor earth. They are aliens, as seen on History channelI'm surprised native americans get cool graphics of their own (like those advisors) but poor arabs/turks don't get any.