Are you guys still going to sit there and act like the Egyptian depictions of Nubians did not vary? Or deny the overlap of even images from Kushite Upper Nubia with Egyptian art conventions?
Mary Lefkowitz, who has made a career off of being an Anti-Afro Centrist(and was involved in a hugely public snafu regarding another white author, Martin Bernal and some Afrocentrist scholars), said it best:
"The Nubian tribute-bearers are painted in two skin tones, black and dark brown. These tones do not necessarily represent actual skin tones in real life but may serve to distinguish each tribute-bearer from the next in a row in which the figures overlap. Alternatively, the brown-skinned people may be of Nubian origin, and the black-skinned ones may be farther south 9Trigger 1978, 33). The shading of skin tones in Egyptian tomb paintings, which varies considerably, may not be a certain criterion for distinguishing race. Specific symbols of ethnic identity can also vary. Identifying race in Egyptian representational art, again, is difficult to do- probably because race (as opposed to ethnic affiliation, that is, Egyptians versus all non-Egyptians) was not a criterion for differentiation used by the ancient Egyptians...
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Ps. Just because my position on the indigenous African origin of the AE (and that they fell within the range of variation for indigenous African people) is shared by black supremacists and Afrocentrist doesn't make me one, nor does it make the position I have invalid. That's like saying white Americans who want more gun freedoms are white supremacists because some white supremacist groups believe that and so the argument is invalid. That's a ridiculous failure of logic.
Are you going to ignore that Egypt was a dominant cultural factor in the region that lent its art and religious beliefs to the Canaanites, and that there is a great deal of evidence pointing to the Egyptians introducing such things to the Nubians? How the Nubian mythology, for example, has very clearly distinct Egyptian loans which stick out massively from native Nubian deities?
You are also trying to use a few fallacies:
Association fallacy: I never called you an Afrocentrist, I had used the term "Black Egyptian Hypothesis" once. Also, modern Blacks use hair products, so do Egyptians, ergo Egyptians = Black?
Post hoc ergo propter hoc: Citing Egyptian influences on Nubia as proof that Nubians are Egyptians, which, as an argument, is like saying the modern English people have no genetic continuity with the Celts. The Nubians did not share a great deal of similarity with Egyptians artistically until the Kushite period, as you mentioned. The only problem is that the Kushite period was preceded by Egyptian invasions and conquest, which would be like me using the picture of the mixed-race Egyptian in my original post as proof that Egyptians were originally Italians, whereas I instead recognized the character in the figure to be mixed-race and thus paler than he should be, and ensured that it was known that it was a Roman-styled depiction, not an Egyptian one. This is basically arguing that a high-population empire, one of the most powerful of its time, fiercely nationalistic, and incredibly wealthy, was influenced by a group of tribes to its South, ones that it conquered, rather than the Egyptians influencing them.
Straw Man fallacy: Nowhere in my argument did I say that the Egyptians were white. I said, very clearly, "Red/brown" and compared them to modern Arabs. There's more than just two races. This could also be considered Ad Hominem. You're also ignoring that I also brought up the fact that Egyptians use wigs and such. Are you seriously trying to say because Black Americans use them today, Egyptians were Black?
Hair irons weren't invented until the 19th century. You know who else uses hair products? Just about everyone who cares what their hair looks like. Hair care is not a race-specific invention. The Greeks, Hebrews, Assyrians, and Vikings all put in a large load of caring for their hair, and many of their descendants still do today.
Ignoratio Elenchi: You present me with evidence that Nubians vary in color in Egyptian art. Okay, now apply it. This does not defeat the argument I have made, which goes far beyond Egyptian art and extends into multiple independent scientific analyses doing their damnedest to figure out what ancient Egyptians looked like, and coming to the conclusion that they most likely looked like modern Egyptians.
You also quoted an Afrocentrist as a main point, which sorta goes against the idea of unbiased judgement and you NOT being an Afrocentrist. While I will go with the benefit of the doubt and say that you are, indeed, not an Afrocentrist and you just thought it a suitable quote, it is still an unreliable source Ethnocentrism is NOT a viable source of information. If you would not trust a Eurocentrist, you should not trust an Afrocentrist.
So, how about that how th Egyptian language is Afro-Asiatic (the group Arabic, Hebrew, and Berber are in), rather than Nilo-Saharan (the group Nubians are in) or Niger-Congo (the group Bantus, Congolese, and West Africans are in), or even Khoishan (the once dominant people of South Africa pushed into a smaller area by Bantu migrations)? All of the major Black African linguistic groups do not match with Egyptian linguistically. Also, comparing "cultural practices" of Afro-Americans (hair care, quotes because that's not particularly cultural, but to my understanding it was framed to be such) and Egyptians does not have any correlation, as most Afro-Americans descend from West Africa in the Ghana and Angola regions, which are entirely distinct culturally, linguistically, and genetically from Egyptians both past and present.
When you are going against near-global scientific result, consensus, and the official stance of the Egyptian government that Egyptians were brown back then, then you better provide some very compelling evidence that they were not so as to defeat the worldwide scientific and anthropological stance.
Of course, you didn't quote me to begin with, so you might've just missed me, in which case this is intended to be my response to your response to my response, not necessarily to the other gentleman involved in this debate.
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