EU4 - Development Diary - 21st of April 2020

EU4 - Development Diary - 21st of April 2020

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LucaF.

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Similarities abound already, and it's not usually a huge problem, so long as there's some point of distinction. Like orange vs. red.

The radical wing of the Whig party were republicans but never gained much traction in the UK. They did however greatly influence goings on over the pond.
I understand, but the tricolour flag is tipically of the French Revolutions republics. Jacobins and Napoleon created this type of flag and spread it around the Europe.
In England/UK we need something not related the jacobin/napoleonic revolution, because something else happened before it.
If the parliamentary rebels win the English Civil war there must be a english/british republic with a flag and different mechanisms respect the french revolutionary republic.
So the flag used for this english/british republic cannot be the same used for french revolutionary, because tricolour didn't existed at that moment.
I know that in the game the English Civil War is not an event that change the flag, but if we change the government system (with the decapitation of a king and the creation of the Commonwealth under a Lord Protector), i think we should change also the national flag with some historical example of that period.
 
Last edited:

LucaF.

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Actually according to a couple of seconds research I just did on Wikipedia, flags with those colours were flown at the Spa Fields Riots, Pentrich Rising and Peterloo Massacre, in 1816, 1817 and 1819 respectively. It also mentions the flag flown at Spa Fields was (top to bottom) Green, White and Red, so that could be an option for a flag which differs from the Hungarian one. Of course, that would rely on the game allowing horizontal tricolours.

I think it's kind of a cool idea to use the Sufferagette flag, in the absence of any viable alternative, but I'd much prefer something that feels more historical even if that does run the risk of matching another nation in the game. Even making up a new flag (Green, Blue and Red doesn't seem totally outside the realms of theoretical possibility) seems like a better option. The noble associations of purple feel particularly anachronous when applied to C18/19 revolutionaries.

Also, as an aside, the actual shade of purple used in the flag in the screenshot is particularly hideous, and doesn't appear to match the Sufferagette colours anyway.
The problem with the use of Suffragette flag as revolutionary flag for England/UK is not only about the timeline of first use of that tricolour, but also about the issue and motivation of that movement and flag.
Suffragette was a movement for the vote rights of the women, it was a pro-democratic movement for increase the number of voters, not necessarily a republican movement (there is a difference about these two concepts, even if i understand that many suffraggette could had be antimonarchist, socialist and republican).
Historically, the battle for the vote rights of the women in UK didn't cancelled the monarchy and today the women can vote in UK under Her Majesty.
So it's completely wrong use this movement (and its colours) for represent a political revolution that, instead, change the institutional monarchist government for a republic.
The only historical moment in England when there was a supression of the monarchist government for the adoption of the republic it was during the English Civil War under the Lord Protector Cromwell.
There are historical flags of the Commonwealth that can be used for represent this new type of government. English flag could be changed with an event if the parliamentary rebels win the war against the crown.
So I expect that Paradox developers can look that direction and avoid to put strange and unhistorical connections among two differents political movements.
 
Last edited:

i3azyl

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Is the nation designer going to be available just from the update, or would I have to buy the Emperor DLC on top of my DLC enabling custom nations (not sure which one it is)?
 

Republic of Mercury

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Is the nation designer going to be available just from the update, or would I have to buy the Emperor DLC on top of my DLC enabling custom nations (not sure which one it is)?
I don't think you'll need any dlc other than El Dorado.
 

joriandrake

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As Groogy said, I repost my comment from Steam here to be easier noticed, after some editing.

Thank you, thank you for finally making it possible to have unit models be chosen by ourselves (and hopefully also these choices being 'inherited' if a new nation is formed, with the option to decide to keep what we picked or use the default ones)!

Might also expand customization then, to include an option to rename your nation ingame.
The "Kingdom of God" use for PAP(acy) seems like the obvious way to do it (visual tags like in ImpRome and HoI4?), and also acts as a good precedent on how to implement this for manual renaming by a player. A variant of this suggestion would also apply to ImpRome customization to allow (re)naming of nations.

In EU4 you might want to call your name the 'Republic of Hungary' or 'Empire of Venice'. In Imperator Rome you may play as Etruscia, fled to Iberia and call yourself 'Etruscan Iberia', or a Sparta that conquers Ptolemid Egypt might want to rename itself to 'Agiad Egypt' with capitol moved to Alexandria.​

What about an option to change your flag and map color midgame?
It is already possible in save file editing (using the colonial and custom nation color system overriding the base color and flag) so why not make it also possible at this update? It would be good enough improvement to be able to pick your own horizontal or vertical tricolor already for nations like Germany, Hungary, Incas, or Burgundy. Only later era China would really require a 5 color banner, most others can be done with 3 stripes.

Here's an example to a save file edit, on how to change flag and ingame color currently, but I think it would be great if we can do this ingame without save editing. It's the only way to keep a game in ironman even if you want different flags.
colors={
custom_colors={
flag=34
color=9
symbol_index=0
flag_colors={

1 8 0
}
}
revolutionary_colors={
0 13 5
}
map_color={
20 75 0
}
country_color={
20 75 0
}
}

You could add the option to pick RGB or HEX map and flag color codes ingame for custom nations (or recolor option for existing nation too, like you recolored Nepal to red in a previous devclash) as well. Again, this could also apply as suggestion to your other games like ImpRome or Stellaris.

Here are some ingame examples:
What if a player prefers a darker green hue for Russia and the imperial banner if they have a Romanov on throne?

What if someone wants to be a trendsetter and make red their favorite color ahead of its time? (all 3 flag stripes the same color)

For a Burgundy player who manages to not only survive but claim (and form) the French nation, it might be preferable to keep their blob purple and not blue, and maybe use their own version of the tricolor. (purple instead of blue)

Right now, as mentioned, we can change by save editing (a mod isn't even required) an existing nation's map color and as you see above also flags. I could've used dozens of more examples like a Spaniard USA changing its flag to yellow/red, or a republican Hungary starting to use its red/white/green tricolor ahead of time. I really hope this can be added ingame.​

It wouldn't only be fun in MP but mostly in SP for roleplayers, and when you improve the custom nation options it might be also the best moment to add flag & map color changing options to all other nations. (You might due to market issues want to have this option enabled only for those who already own the Custom Nations Designer via El Dorado.)

I believe the biggest flavor effect would be gained for huge & ahistorically formed nations like in case of the HRE, where most players would love to alter the map color and flag based on who and how formed it.

You may have noticed I didn't use any flag symbols on my examples, that's because I absolutely hate the fact that those symbols do not show up on the wavy flags ingame and many of them are out of position anyway. Clear tricolor, pure color, or cross flags work best with customized nations atm.​


Originally posted by Candramani: You should change rev ottomans to something else. Ottoman is the name of dynasty. you can't be ottoman and rev at the same time.
I have to agree with this suggestion on Steam. The name is like 'Revolutionary Anjous', 'Revolutionary Vasas' or 'Revolutionary Tudors'. It doesn't make any sense. This could be instead Revolutionary Turkey. Same naming problem for other nations like the Timurids, but unlike in case of Ottomans which represent Turkey in this era clearly I have no idea how a diferent non-dynastic revolutionary nation of TIM could be called as they often splinter and survive not even in the Persian region. Meanwhile 'revolutionary' [insert chinese TAG] is easily renamed to be 'Revolutionary China'.

From the screenshot seeing Britain it also reminded me that it's probably better to rename that "Revolutionary Britain" instead of 'Revolutionary Great Britain', the name is long enough without that word already. You might also consider not to have 'Revolutionary' as a word in some names and instead come up with something more unique, like for Rev.Britain it could be British Union, or for a Rev.Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth it might be People's Commonwealth instead.
The bonuses for for "Elite" Rev. Guard in exchange for +100% Maintenace cost don't seem to be worth their price. Why aren't they more 'fanatic'? I would assume these should have higher army morale, also why higher maintenance? Shouldn't they actually be cheaper as they fight for a cause and not mainly for money? Atm I see no reason to actually use them.
 
Last edited:

joriandrake

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Also, with unit models now handled by the game differently, would it be possible to have a choice to either adopt a formed nation's 'standard' unit models, or to keep your existing ones?

This would make forming Russia more fun as Novgorod, Ryazan or other minors. (choose to keep their unit models instead of the RUS/MOS tag linked ones)

It would make forming HRE more fun as (let's say) Lübeck, Ulm, Milan or Saxony as they have nice unit pack models.

It would also make forming nations like Ireland, UK, or Italy more interesting, as you would have the choice to keep the unit models of the nation you conquered lands with, and formed the new nations with. Imagine sporting those neat Teutonic tier 1-4 models as a Teutonic Brazil as example, instead of generic models.

Also, it could enable you to choose using colonial unit sprites (or even pirate models) if you form nations in America depending on your origin. I do like those colonial Spanish/Portuguese/French models, and it'd be neat to have them if you form nations like a French Louisiana, Spanish Mexico or Portuguese Canada.
 

Lord Hoosier

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Two Things:

Bear Sprites for Jan Mayen?

Revolutionary Flag Rework?
 

BradyWard

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all these people arguing about the GB flag change using hystorical exapmles , by the time you are at Rev. Date the map is so far gone that the arguments are almost pointless

1. the red white green flag is the Iranian flag 2. was barly used in the hystroy you are arguing 3. if your so purist on the hystory the UK was never going to become revolutinery at this date, 4. we did ditch the monarcy like 100 years priour and didnt change the flags 5. the Union jack reprisend a United Britain more than a monarch symbol ,

im just happy we have a much more unique and nicer looking flag thats still has some hystorical connection to my nation
 

joriandrake

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1. the red white green flag is the Iranian flag
Hungary. However, I was promoting the idea of having more player customization options for things like flag design earlier, so you could use whatever kind of flag design or map color you'd wish for Britain. I'd probably form it as Cornwall and have the flag be mainly black & gold.

2. was barly used in the hystroy you are arguing 3. if your so purist on the hystory the UK was never going to become revolutinery at this date, 4. we did ditch the monarcy like 100 years priour and didnt change the flags 5. the Union jack reprisend a United Britain more than a monarch symbol.
History. This is actually an argument for the option to opt-out of changing a flag as well when someone becomes revolutionary.
I wrote earlier suggestions on how to increase and improve the flavor choices on nation map color / flag / name, but the right to NOT change something is also on the list thanks to this now. An enforced revolutionary flag change wouldn't even be needed if players could at any time change their flags (maybe with some cooldown time and admin/diplo point cost though)

Players just need more control over graphical choices like the flag designs inside the game without having to make mods or edit save files.
The flags in our history were often changed rapidly in the revolutionary times, look up only the flag variants suggested or used for places like Germany and Romania. Some cultures or nations didn't even really use flags and a player could create whatever for them like for the Maya or Inca empires. Everything that could be needed for this to be possible ingame already exists in the game engine and code, it just needs an ingame interface.
 
Last edited:

Tutatris

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In my opinion the -10% damage received modifiers are much stronger than a 2.5% discipline modifier. Might want to tweak the numbers.
 

Blorgzorg

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  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Tyranny: Gold Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Tyranny - Bastards Wound
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pride of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Victoria 2
I know this is a few dev diaries late, byt the balkan one was locked.
Can you guys add a dalmatian (italian) culture in Ragusa, please?
 

Beagá

Field Marshal
May 27, 2007
12.985
2.858
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • 500k Club
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • BATTLETECH
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • For The Glory
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
Is this the last diary before the DLC?
 

Beagá

Field Marshal
May 27, 2007
12.985
2.858
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • 500k Club
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • BATTLETECH
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • For The Glory
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria 2
Damn... I´m itching to play a new campaign as Austria, last time I did it was in 1.7.
 

Vic3RebelUprising

Sergeant
On Probation
Jan 30, 2020
94
24
Do you guys think Emperor will get a release before August or after August?