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EU4 Development Diary - 11th February 2016

Hello and Welcome to another development diary for Europa Universalis IV. This time we take a look at a concept that neither we nor you have not been entirely happy with in any previous Paradox game: Espionage.

In the next major patch, we have completely reworked how espionage works. No longer is every spy action done by just sending a diplomat that will perform the action for as long as it is there, but now there is a concept of spy networks.

You now send a diplomat on a mission to a country to build up a spy network. The network can reach up to 100% power, and that power can be used to execute spy actions, such as sow discontent, fabricate claims, etc.

Spy Offense has been renamed to Spy Network Construction, and determines how quickly you build spy networks in another nation.

Spy Defence has been renamed to “Foreign Spy Detection”, and now determine the chance of detecting hostile network buildups and disrupting it. A disrupted network will lose some of its power, and also make it impossible for you continue improving it for a time period.

Performing an action is instant, and as long as you have the power, success is automatic. However, networks that are not actively built will slowly decay.

You can also target other nations networks with counterespionage, to actively reduce their capabilities of their network.

gAZjY5C.jpg


There are three passive benefits to having a strong spy network in another nation. First of all, if you have the Cossacks expansion and picked the Espionage Ideas, you have access to Study Technology, which is no longer a source of power, but instead a possibility to reduce technology costs by up 30% from having networks in nations ahead of you (the size of the discount depends on how far ahead they are in each tech). Secondly, the new expansion grants up to 20% higher siege ability against nations where you have a spy network. Finally, the new expansion gives you up to 10% less AE in that country.

Of course, all of those scale with the power of the spy network.


Espionage now contains the following actions.

Fabricate Claim: Gives you a claim on an eligible province for a low cost.
Justify Trade Conflict: Gives you a trade conflict CB if conditions are applicable for a low cost.
Support Rebels: Selected rebel faction gets +10% chance to progress towards revolt each month for 5 years for a very high cost. It will also cost a fair amount of cash to support ythe troops.


The following requires the Espionage Ideagroup.

Sow Discontent, applies +3 unrest and reduces legitimacy, republican tradition, devotion or unity for 5 years for a high cost
Infiltrate Administration: Lifts Fog of War over the target country for 5 years for a medium cost.
Sabotage Reputation: -3 diplomatic reputation for 5 years for a medium cost.
Agitate for Liberty: Selected subject has +25 liberty desire that lasts 5 years for a high cost.


There is also four new actions enabled by the new expansion, two of those we’ll tell you about here, two others are for future development diaries.

Sabotage Recruitment: Gives 20% less manpower and Sailor recovery speed for 5 years for a medium cost.
Slander Merchant: Reduces Global Trade Power by 33% for 5 years for a high cost.

Of course actions that require previously expansions will still require those expansions.

Next week we’ll be back with a look at Africa.
 
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Enemy army can be determined from how their current wars are going. So are their force limits, as it's either going to be all or nothing depending on how their wars are going. Same with depleted manpower. The only thing you wouldn't know is whether they have another army, but that's only an issue with nations with overseas empires, and it's pretty easy to deal with those overseas armies as they arrive.

But the difference is that what you get form how their war's going is a rough estimate. Which is what you'd get from the ledger anyway if it were based on your spy network with them.
 
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wait, are Sabotage Recruitment and Slander Merchant open to anyone or do they require Espionage Ideas? cause if they do, that'd make the idea group kinda worthwhile.
 
I still think all the actions that require the Espionage idea group should be available to everyone, Espionage ideas should just make them a lot more cheaper/effective.
IMO it's more interesting to get a new ability than just a numerical bonus. Forced march, for example, feels much more lame now that everyone gets it.
 
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How about sending spies to enemies that are at war and spout anti war propaganda to drive up war exaustion?

I also agree with a lot of others, having abilities hidden behind the idea group either emans that the ideagroup is a must have or that the ideas must be kept so weak that it's pointless to take. If you really want to balance it mak it more of a utility. Perhaps keep one powerful unique ability as the finisher but otherwise there's plenty of other stuff, more diplomats, slower spy network decay faster spy network growth, more powerful abilities, slower hostile spy network growth
 
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When you're talking about "cost" do you mean money, monarch points or some hypothetical "espionage points", or what?

Do I understand correctly that as long as I have a strong network in a country, I can now get a bunch of claims instantly, but would have to pay some cost?

The changes sound very interesting, I like them a lot. I just hope espionage doesn't become a must-have idea group because it's too good.
I imagine you would've to "sacrifice" some percentage of your spy network as the cost for said action.

Sabotage Recruitment alone sounds an OP thing to do as a small nation to a larger foe just getting out of war.
 
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Hello and Welcome to another development diary for Europa Universalis IV. This time we take a look at a concept that neither we nor you have not been entirely happy with in any previous Paradox game: Espionage.

In the next major patch, we have completely reworked how espionage works. No longer is every spy action done by just sending a diplomat that will perform the action for as long as it is there, but now there is a concept of spy networks.

You now send a diplomat on a mission to a country to build up a spy network. The network can reach up to 100% power, and that power can be used to execute spy actions, such as sow discontent, fabricate claims, etc.

Spy Offense has been renamed to Spy Network Construction, and determines how quickly you build spy networks in another nation.

Spy Defence has been renamed to “Foreign Spy Detection”, and now determine the chance of detecting hostile network buildups and disrupting it. A disrupted network will lose some of its power, and also make it impossible for you continue improving it for a time period.

Performing an action is instant, and as long as you have the power, success is automatic. However, networks that are not actively built will slowly decay.

You can also target other nations networks with counterespionage, to actively reduce their capabilities of their network.

gAZjY5C.jpg


There are three passive benefits to having a strong spy network in another nation. First of all, if you have the Cossacks expansion and picked the Espionage Ideas, you have access to Study Technology, which is no longer a source of power, but instead a possibility to reduce technology costs by up 30% from having networks in nations ahead of you (the size of the discount depends on how far ahead they are in each tech). Secondly, the new expansion grants up to 20% higher siege ability against nations where you have a spy network. Finally, the new expansion gives you up to 10% less AE in that country.

Of course, all of those scale with the power of the spy network.


Espionage now contains the following actions.

Fabricate Claim: Gives you a claim on an eligible province for a low cost.
Justify Trade Conflict: Gives you a trade conflict CB if conditions are applicable for a low cost.
Support Rebels: Selected rebel faction gets +10% chance to progress towards revolt each month for 5 years for a very high cost. It will also cost a fair amount of cash to support ythe troops.


The following requires the Espionage Ideagroup.

Sow Discontent, applies +3 unrest and reduces legitimacy, republican tradition, devotion or unity for 5 years for a high cost
Infiltrate Administration: Lifts Fog of War over the target country for 5 years for a medium cost.
Sabotage Reputation: -3 diplomatic reputation for 5 years for a medium cost.
Agitate for Liberty: Selected subject has +25 liberty desire that lasts 5 years for a high cost.


There is also four new actions enabled by the new expansion, two of those we’ll tell you about here, two others are for future development diaries.

Sabotage Recruitment: Gives 20% less manpower and Sailor recovery speed for 5 years for a medium cost.
Slander Merchant: Reduces Global Trade Power by 33% for 5 years for a high cost.

Of course actions that require previously expansions will still require those expansions.

Next week we’ll be back with a look at Africa.
Will the effects of espionage cumulative? If both France and Spain sabotage the dip rep of Austria the effect will be - 3 or - 6
 
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This made me think: Which nation has the best ideas for espionage? Not counting the Hashashin from CK2 converter of course.
 
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I had high expectation with new espionage system yet still there is no feature making them great namely: assassination. Killing rulers, heirs, generals/admirals would make it great and having high spy defense would be crucial. Moreover still not possible to poison wells, supplies of the armies to hamper their movement and increase attrition. Still no setting fires in cities, blowing up the mines to hamper production , destroying ships, dockyards to make merchants cry and so on. I guess I need to wait till EV for this.
 
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I had high expectation with new espionage system yet still there is no feature making them great namely: assassination. Killing rulers, heirs, generals/admirals would make it great and having high spy defense would be crucial. Moreover still not possible to poison wells, supplies of the armies to hamper their movement and increase attrition. Still no setting fires in cities, blowing up the mines to hamper production , destroying ships, dockyards to make merchants cry and so on. I guess I need to wait till EV for this.
we're still waiting for two unrevealed spy actions. :)
 
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Will those modifiers stack, when used by two or more different countries against one? Because -10 dip rep or +10 unrest are going to be truelly anti-blob measures. And more importantly, is AI going to use these espionage actions with any kind of sence and logic?
 
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@Johan:

Just to clarify: Does every nation have the possibility to establish spy networks or is it still restricted to nations who take the idea?
Every nation can build spy network since the basic actions don't require the idea group.

@Johan , a better question would be if this system replaces the old system for vanilla owners as well or will it work as "diplomatic feedback"? Either way is fine, but could be more clear**.

interesting, although it a bit unclear to me how we build a spy network
Probably a "build network" action for diplomats.

Up to 30 % tech cost reduction (to be fair, it was a bit unclear to me, whether that was espionage idea group exclusive)
It's part of the idea group ["Study Tech" action].

**I was pleasantly surprised to find that sailors are part of the patch and not DLC only.
 
I had high expectation with new espionage system yet still there is no feature making them great namely: assassination. Killing rulers, heirs, generals/admirals would make it great and having high spy defense would be crucial. Moreover still not possible to poison wells, supplies of the armies to hamper their movement and increase attrition. Still no setting fires in cities, blowing up the mines to hamper production , destroying ships, dockyards to make merchants cry and so on. I guess I need to wait till EV for this.


Assassination would be really bad for the game in the current state with no families, but the other ideas, like posioning wells sounds quite good, you should post a suggestion about this on the suggestion forum.
 
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Assassination would be really bad for the game in the current state with no families, but the other ideas, like posioning wells sounds quite good, you should post a suggestion about this on the suggestion forum.
I posted this in suggestion thread a while ago and many times rose this question yet i guess it landed on deaf ears.
 
The changes sound reasonably okay, but I feel like, in order for them to truly feel satisfying and enjoyable, diplomats and espionage would need to be decoupled entirely. Otherwise you're constantly having to play a game of diplomat shuffling to both improve relations and build spy networks, and that sounds like it could get real annoying real fast, especially in the HRE where AE reduction is crucial.

I don't know, it sounds like you don't need to have to keep separate diplomats for things like fabricating claims and supporting rebels, so it may balance out
 
It´s good to see that devs are making Espionage Ideas more useful, in the past espionage ideas were almost useless , only helped with CB generation and CB generation became more easier without spies since you could get Religious CB. I love how PARADOX keeps a constant eye on their forums.