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EU4 - Development Diary - 10th of November

Hey everyone! So when we introduced the new natives mechanics several of you were asking why we weren’t changing Totemism as well while at it. So since then and while I was working on the Sikh Gurus and Zoroastrianism I figured I should give it a shot and try to give them something as many of you were pointing out, it is one of the major religions at the start of the game and it deserves some love. Be warned a lot of work in progress values & especially really bad coder art will be shown!

Now North America is a big place, and how we are using Totemism in the game is sort of a catch all for several very distinct mythoses and with that also comes the challenge of figuring out flavor that is general enough and fits all of these as well. What I could find as a best candidate for a fun mechanic that could fit for all of these very different cultures were that they all have legendary figures, and the oral tradition of great deeds. Like Gloosecap of the Abenaki, or Esa the Wolf of the Shoshone.

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So now as you progress through the game, you can add one of your previous rulers to your mythos. You can have a maximum of 10 stories added at any point. This costs 100 Diplomatic power but they can also be removed later on for a severe stability hit. It’s not intended to be something that you switch around often but I don’t want to lock you in entirely either.

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Adding an ancestor’s story to your religion will have them provide the personality they had in real life be applied to your country for all future, with some modifications which we will get into in a bit. It will be a weaker version than they had in real life but still a nice bonus for you even as they have died.

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So with this change in order to keep things balanced rulers who follow Totemism will only have one personality, since it will be combined together with the benefits they get from the religion as well. But these are special and they scale with the rulers skill. This does mean that you can get a ruler with 7.5% discipline bonus instead of 5%. This is also to feed into the ancestor stories where not all rulers will actually be useful to be made into a story. This does mean that totemism needs it’s entire own setup of personalities scripted up but we are aiming to try and match the original ones.

The intent is since you have 10 ancestor stories you can collect, each will just provide a bit of the full picture. It's a religion you build up over time by reconnecting to previous rulers you’ve had.

Also here's a preliminary set of values for the Gurus and their teaching. The value next to the Guru's name is applied by the Guru while they are alive. The ones in the lists are their teachings and can be picked by you as the player. These values are still work in progress but I know people been asking for a complete list.
Guru Nanak: +1 Admin Power
  • Share and Consume: -1 Unrest
  • Work Honestly: 5% Production Eff
  • Recite His Name: -2.5% Regiment Cost
Guru Angad: +1 Military Power
  • Gurmukhi Script: -5% Tech Cost
  • Temple Langar: +10% Church Loyalty
  • Wrestling Akhara: +0.1 Yearly Army Professionalism
Guru Amar Das: +1 Diplomatic Power
  • Dasvnandh Collection: +5% Tax Modifier
  • Anand Karaj: +1 Diplomatic Reputation
  • Sanghat Equality: +10% Nobles Loyalty
Guru Ram Das: +1 Admin Power
  • Legitimize Inheritance: +0.25 Legitimacy (or +0.1 Rep Trad, etc. etc.)
  • Scripture Hymns: +0.5 Prestige
  • Masand System: +10% Manpower Modifier
Guru Arjan: +1 Diplomatic Power
  • Adi Granth: +10% Institution Spread
  • The Abode of God: +10% Rel Unity
  • Martyrdom: 5% Land Morale
Hargobind: +1 Military Power
  • Throne of the Timeless One: Same as Legitimize Inheritance
  • Protection of the Poor: -0.025 War Exhaustion
  • Miri and Piri: +2.5% Discipline
Guru Har Rai: +1 Diplomatic Power
  • Impartial Manjis: -0.05 Corruption
  • The Fragrance of a Flower: +10% Improve Relations
  • One Guru: +5% Nobles Loyalty
Guru Har Krishan: +1 Diplomatic Power
  • Treat the Sick: +1 Monarch Admin Skill
  • Illiterate Recites Saloks: +1 Monarch Diplomatic Skill
  • Young Humility: +1 Monarch Military Skill
Guru Tegh Bahadur: +1 Admin Power
  • The Word of Sikh: +1 Missionary
  • All Kings must Pass: +2 Tolerance of Heretics
  • Resist Persecution: +1 Hostile Attrition
Guru Gobind Singh: +1 Admin Power
  • Pluralism: -10% Advisor Cost
  • Dharam Yudh: 50% War Taxes Cost
  • The Khalsa Sikh: +0.1 Yearly Army Professionalism
Guru Granth Sahib: -50% State Maintenance Cost, -25% Regiment Drill Loss
  • Eternally Living Guru: -10% Development Cost
  • Divine Justice: 10% Trade Efficiency
  • The Unchanging Writing: 50% Drill Gain Modifier

And that is it for today! Thanks for reading and we’ll see you next week!
 
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Let me hear your suggestion if you have one regarding Iran and Zoroastrianism?
Converting from Islam to Zoroastrianism with a large Muslim realm – even if your ruler and all their provinces have an Iranian culture – should absolutely cause a stab hit.

 
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Converting from Islam to Zoroastrianism with a large Muslim realm – even if your ruler and all their provinces have an Iranian culture – should absolutely cause a stab hit.

Yes, that is why I suggested this be available for Iranian cultures if they own at least 2 Zoroastrian sites. You al ready can convert From Islam to Sikhism via decision in India. There are not much Zoroastrian provinces besides Yazd. We don't know how much will be added in future DLC in Iran or will any. Perhaps I made a mistake in previous post, perhaps there should be price to pay if you wanna go Zoroastrian. Another reason why I suggested this is because so you don't suffer devastation if you go to provoke rebels. You basically need to watch out your armies and after rebels enforced their demand lose prestige.
 
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The new changes look great. I'm just a little worried about all the RNG involved and hope maybe we can get just a little more influence on it somehow.

Now we just need Animism and Judaism improvements in that order IMO and the games religions will be good.
 
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Wow, these religion mechanic changes/additions have been really good! Thank you Groogy!
One thing I'd think would be interesting is if each culture/culture group had a starting ancestor like Glooscap, Wisakedjak, Wakan Tanka, etc. which has a better bonus than rulers. There are certainly plenty of Native American creator gods which we know about and can use.
Awesome idea! That’d definitely give this a higher degree of authenticity/genuine portrayal of native beliefs. I’d love to see Maushop for eastern Algonquins and Raven for the Athabaskans.
 
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Me: *busy making a mod updating some of the "unexpanded religions *
PDX: Hey we're updating Sikhism+Zoroastrianism

Me: okay, so now I can focus more on Totemism, Animism and Judaism
Pdx: so.... We're also doing Totemism now
 
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When did syncretism happen? From what I understand most of the natives died out.

It is happening even today. Google “Santa Muerte”. Although I suppose you mean specifically North American Indians, then I don’t really know. But syncretism was (and is) not uncommon in regions recently converted to one of the revealed faiths.
 
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*Smiles in Totemist*
 
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I love the new religious mechanics. It adds variety to have this new style of religion that gradually builds from very weak to very strong over the course of the game. I also like the balance between randomness and control for the Totemist change. I think I'll be trying this out a bunch both as a native and maybe as a custom nation somewhere.
 
Here's a suggestion for how to handle rulers having multiple traits: when you add a ruler to your mythos, you get to pick which trait to preserve (or maybe just the first one). Seems a lot simpler, honestly.
 
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Still picturing the theme of the DLC, it appears to be a "remaining" religions pack with diplomacy and North America focus kind of. At least for now. While the patch will be SEA focused which is weird but okay.

To be fair, I am disappointed you guys came up with another paid DLC ASAP and its content seems like just an ordinary DLC with various mechanics packed in. I think you guys owe us a little bit for all the DLCs we bought over the years and if you wanna sell a couple more DLCs or not, you should revise some more core mechanics as you did with the last patch. I don't think working a whole year for a really big patch accompanying DLC would be an underpayment for the company at this point considering the current smaller team and the state of the game. By the way, I won't even mention the most recent DLC and patch still being a huge mess, hence why I am still delaying my purchase.

That's why you better bring us a patch with reworking core mechanics while still trying to sell a DLC after all these years. Warfare alone would keep you guys busy enough for improving I suppose, including balancing all around. Regarding the upcoming patch though, maybe adding religious minorities as province modifiers like good old Dei Gratia and its successor M&T would be a good start and it would fit the theme too. Maybe even adding Jews as an estate(alright make it paid) and reworking current obnoxious banking and loans. Possibilities are endless and if you guys are thinking of just shipping some old-fashioned Eu4 DLCs nevertheless, I'll just pass.
Wrestling Akhara: +0.1 Yearly Army Professionalism
The Khalsa Sikh: +0.1 Yearly Army Professionalism
he Unchanging Writing: 50% Drill Gain Modifier
So what will happen to the army professionalism? Will it be integrated into the base game or unlocked with the upcoming DLC if you don't own CoC? Or, most unlikely one, will these new Sikh features come for CoC owners too? OR(last one), least excited one, will these bonuses be replaced with other random bonuses for non-DLC owners?
I'd like it more if rulers could still have multiple personality traits and allow the state to pick one. Kinda reflective how characters of legend are often portrayed more one dimensional than they were irl. Still really love the overhaul of totemism overall though!
Great idea!
Could you reduce the penalty Pagan nations have from converting to a different religion through decision? While new mechanics for Totemist are good, it would also be nice if converting to a Christian religion was possible as well. Currently it costs 4 stability and is much worse than forcing rebels to convert you. It's weird to have Totemist be this religion that gets better over time and abandoning it cost so much compared to using rebels.
I think 4 stability hit is pretty reasonable, the problem is using rebels to force their demands doesn't cost much.
 
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Well I guess I'll have to eat my words now. Never saw this coming. A very pleasant surprise though.
 
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All this changes to Religions are amazing.
Can we please get the other Pagan religions from the converter for the Nation Designer while we are at it? Pretty please :(
 
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The new changes look great. I'm just a little worried about all the RNG involved and hope maybe we can get just a little more influence on it somehow.

Now we just need Animism and Judaism improvements in that order IMO and the games religions will be good.
Maybe they could even ADD new religions after that? Even if it gets a mechanic, Animist is still a placeholder which would benefit from a divide (at least between Asia, Polynesia and South America), and there is a very good case for importing Nestorian or European Pagan faiths from CK2.
 
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